Vibration at 60-85mph here's what I've done, what's left?
01-04-08, 07:32 AM
#31
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The one that has 20 lbs of road force will be more prone to causing vibration. As justfixit points out (nice copy & paste from the Hunter web site by the way) the tire acts as a spring, actually like ten springs around the wheel. What causes the vibration is that one of these "springs" is stiffer than the others. This is because of a hard or stiff spot in the tire. What a road force balancer does is locate the stiff spot in the tire and also find the run out (low spot) in the wheel. The technician then matches the stiff spot int he tire and low spot in the wheel by spinning the wheel with in the tire thus reducing the amount of road force in the assembly. It is almost impossible to get 0 lbs of road force in an assembly. In order to do this the wheel and tire would have to be absolutely perfectly round, and this just doesn't happen. If you can get it down to 10 lbs or less you shouldn't feel any vibrations. I have been selling these machines for 9 years and they can do wonders for drivability issues. They now even have a feature to measure Lateral Force which will correct a radial pull. Radial pulls cant be corrected by alignments, but a Road Force machine with Straight Trak will correct this problem and eliminate pulls alignments can't fix.
01-04-08, 11:19 AM
#32
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Great info, guys. Very interesting.
So it sounds to me like the guy who road force balanced my tires did me a bit of a disservice. To recap, I brought him tires that were already mounted on the rims by NTB. He stripped the weights and put them on the Hunter 9700 machine to road force test them. When two of the tires measured 21 lbs and another 16, instead of rotating the tires on the rims to reduce the number, he simply took a shortcut and balanced the tires (because, as he explained to me, the 16 and 21 lb numbers fell below the rejection threshold of 25 lbs). So, to sum it up, even though he used a Hunter 9700 machine, I did not receive any of the benefits of road force balancing other than the fact that I now know how much road force each one of my tires applies to the road.
Correct?
e
So it sounds to me like the guy who road force balanced my tires did me a bit of a disservice. To recap, I brought him tires that were already mounted on the rims by NTB. He stripped the weights and put them on the Hunter 9700 machine to road force test them. When two of the tires measured 21 lbs and another 16, instead of rotating the tires on the rims to reduce the number, he simply took a shortcut and balanced the tires (because, as he explained to me, the 16 and 21 lb numbers fell below the rejection threshold of 25 lbs). So, to sum it up, even though he used a Hunter 9700 machine, I did not receive any of the benefits of road force balancing other than the fact that I now know how much road force each one of my tires applies to the road.
Correct?
e
01-07-08, 09:42 AM
#33
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Fill your tires with nitrogen. This will reduce or eliminate the vibration you have with cold tires in the morning. It will also cure any TPMS errors you may receive.
01-07-08, 10:47 AM
#34
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Nitrogen, from what I've read, does not react to tire temperature. This could be a simple fix for the vibration.
Although, you've got to appreciate the outcomes of Roadforce Balancing. BTW, where would I locate someone in Seattle do this, if nitrogen doesn't work?
-JRRRRRR
01-07-08, 07:24 PM
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Have you tried "micro sequence retorquing"? (made up name)
That is how I solved my vibration issue. At 55-65 it was pretty noticeable. This from a set of wheels I knew were balanced properly. (they were on my old GS400 and it was perfect). Car is a 01 GS430, wheels Moda R6 and tires Bfg KDW2's w/ about 80% tread. 100% stock suspension and 40k miles. Set balanced by NTB with nothing special other than a watchful eye.
I did the same trick that worked on my GS400. I pulled the front wheels, made sure the mounting surface was clean, (light wire brushing and razor blade off any surface rust) of both hub and wheel sides, and carefully remounted the wheel. Then, I put each lugnut on finger tight. With no load or weight on the tire (just lowered the jack just enough to prevent rotation) I torqued the wheel in very small 10 ft/lb increments. 30ft/lb; then 40, 50, 60, 70, and 75 ft/lb in the 5 star sequence. I hoped for an improvement. This requires 6 passes around the star pattern, takes a little more time but well worth it.
The next day, as I went to work, the difference was amazing. Night and Day. No vibration issues at all. I put about 70 miles on it today and it is as close to perfect as a GS can be. I have used this method on both my GS400 and GS430 and the car goes from a score 3 to a score 4.8. Wow!
(score 1 = vibes at just about any speed all the time)
(score 3 = vibes most of the time, but only at a certain speed range that is pretty predictable)
(score 5 = no hint of vibration at any time, temperature or speed)
Now there must be proper balancing done to the wheels, and a proper alignment, tire pressure etc all affect it as noted throughout this thread. But if you have tried everything and you seem to have vibration from 55-66, try this and let us know if it improves. I bet it will help.
That is how I solved my vibration issue. At 55-65 it was pretty noticeable. This from a set of wheels I knew were balanced properly. (they were on my old GS400 and it was perfect). Car is a 01 GS430, wheels Moda R6 and tires Bfg KDW2's w/ about 80% tread. 100% stock suspension and 40k miles. Set balanced by NTB with nothing special other than a watchful eye.
I did the same trick that worked on my GS400. I pulled the front wheels, made sure the mounting surface was clean, (light wire brushing and razor blade off any surface rust) of both hub and wheel sides, and carefully remounted the wheel. Then, I put each lugnut on finger tight. With no load or weight on the tire (just lowered the jack just enough to prevent rotation) I torqued the wheel in very small 10 ft/lb increments. 30ft/lb; then 40, 50, 60, 70, and 75 ft/lb in the 5 star sequence. I hoped for an improvement. This requires 6 passes around the star pattern, takes a little more time but well worth it.
The next day, as I went to work, the difference was amazing. Night and Day. No vibration issues at all. I put about 70 miles on it today and it is as close to perfect as a GS can be. I have used this method on both my GS400 and GS430 and the car goes from a score 3 to a score 4.8. Wow!
(score 1 = vibes at just about any speed all the time)
(score 3 = vibes most of the time, but only at a certain speed range that is pretty predictable)
(score 5 = no hint of vibration at any time, temperature or speed)
Now there must be proper balancing done to the wheels, and a proper alignment, tire pressure etc all affect it as noted throughout this thread. But if you have tried everything and you seem to have vibration from 55-66, try this and let us know if it improves. I bet it will help.
01-08-08, 11:01 AM
#36
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http://www.gsp9700.com/pub/search/findgsp9700.cfm
01-09-08, 07:53 PM
#37
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Have you tried "micro sequence retorquing"? (made up name)
That is how I solved my vibration issue. At 55-65 it was pretty noticeable. This from a set of wheels I knew were balanced properly. (they were on my old GS400 and it was perfect). Car is a 01 GS430, wheels Moda R6 and tires Bfg KDW2's w/ about 80% tread. 100% stock suspension and 40k miles. Set balanced by NTB with nothing special other than a watchful eye.
I did the same trick that worked on my GS400. I pulled the front wheels, made sure the mounting surface was clean, (light wire brushing and razor blade off any surface rust) of both hub and wheel sides, and carefully remounted the wheel. Then, I put each lugnut on finger tight. With no load or weight on the tire (just lowered the jack just enough to prevent rotation) I torqued the wheel in very small 10 ft/lb increments. 30ft/lb; then 40, 50, 60, 70, and 75 ft/lb in the 5 star sequence. I hoped for an improvement. This requires 6 passes around the star pattern, takes a little more time but well worth it.
The next day, as I went to work, the difference was amazing. Night and Day. No vibration issues at all. I put about 70 miles on it today and it is as close to perfect as a GS can be. I have used this method on both my GS400 and GS430 and the car goes from a score 3 to a score 4.8. Wow!
(score 1 = vibes at just about any speed all the time)
(score 3 = vibes most of the time, but only at a certain speed range that is pretty predictable)
(score 5 = no hint of vibration at any time, temperature or speed)
Now there must be proper balancing done to the wheels, and a proper alignment, tire pressure etc all affect it as noted throughout this thread. But if you have tried everything and you seem to have vibration from 55-66, try this and let us know if it improves. I bet it will help.
That is how I solved my vibration issue. At 55-65 it was pretty noticeable. This from a set of wheels I knew were balanced properly. (they were on my old GS400 and it was perfect). Car is a 01 GS430, wheels Moda R6 and tires Bfg KDW2's w/ about 80% tread. 100% stock suspension and 40k miles. Set balanced by NTB with nothing special other than a watchful eye.
I did the same trick that worked on my GS400. I pulled the front wheels, made sure the mounting surface was clean, (light wire brushing and razor blade off any surface rust) of both hub and wheel sides, and carefully remounted the wheel. Then, I put each lugnut on finger tight. With no load or weight on the tire (just lowered the jack just enough to prevent rotation) I torqued the wheel in very small 10 ft/lb increments. 30ft/lb; then 40, 50, 60, 70, and 75 ft/lb in the 5 star sequence. I hoped for an improvement. This requires 6 passes around the star pattern, takes a little more time but well worth it.
The next day, as I went to work, the difference was amazing. Night and Day. No vibration issues at all. I put about 70 miles on it today and it is as close to perfect as a GS can be. I have used this method on both my GS400 and GS430 and the car goes from a score 3 to a score 4.8. Wow!
(score 1 = vibes at just about any speed all the time)
(score 3 = vibes most of the time, but only at a certain speed range that is pretty predictable)
(score 5 = no hint of vibration at any time, temperature or speed)
Now there must be proper balancing done to the wheels, and a proper alignment, tire pressure etc all affect it as noted throughout this thread. But if you have tried everything and you seem to have vibration from 55-66, try this and let us know if it improves. I bet it will help.
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Loyalone72
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09-24-22 08:37 AM
