lex400sc

I've driven a 2002 ES300 loaner too. The leather is nice, so is the burl wood, love the HIDs , and the car feels pretty solid, but it only took about two days before I was bored of the car. I think the interior is pretty bland, I was so bored at one point I was playing with all the speed and mileage counters in the dash while driving! The V6 bothered me, felt torquey off the line yet where's all the power going to?? FWD is very weird too, no seat-of-the-pants feel to the car. At the end of the day, I was happy to be back in my '95 SC400. I've riden in my buddy's '98 GS400 and it really does put my car to shame in quietness, pick-up, comfort, spaciousness, and feel. Oh yeah, I sat in an LS430 UL, while it was off and parked, and all I have to say about that is DAMN. :eek:

LexFather

Oh, after driving the ES and getting my car back, it is amazing how 2 CARS could be so different in execution. I think the prob we may have with the ES is there is a HUGE differerence is build quality in a 50k car compared to a 30k one.

TheOfficeBoy

It seems that a lot of you guys and gals think of the IS300 as too ricey. Furthermore, it seems that many of you view the demographics of the IS300 negatively. However, please keep in mind that this is exactly what Lexus wanted to accomplish (not you negative views, I mean the demographic). Prior to the IS300 (despite the positive that the GS series had), Lexus owners were generally viewed as older people who found no satisfaction in driving. Although the GS changed some of that perception, it was really the IS300 that drew younger buyers to Lexus. In that respect, I think it's hugely successful, and I bet that if it wasn't for the fact that every other Civic now sports "altezza taillights", the IS300 would not be viewed as ricey.

As for the ES300, it is slow. However, that's because it's purpose has changed. Originally, it was intended to be an entry level Lexus that provided comfort, and performance (when Lexus didn't have a rear-drive, sporty compact). With the introduction of the IS300, the ES300 suddenly found itself free to be more luxurious, which it did. As the result, the newest ES300 lacks the punch of the previous gen, but makes up for it with smoother ride, more luxury etc.

It all depends on how you look at it, but I think the Lexus line up is pretty well-rounded, with something for everyone.

Iceman

I agree with you OfficeBoy, but I think people's point here is that Lexus could have done more with the IS. It was a chance to enter the entry luxury/sports sedan market with a bang. Instead, it took them a year just to offer a stick. Then, instead of a convertible they came out with a wagon.

You're absolutely right that they are attracting a new demographic to Lexus, but as someone else pointed out, that could be the same demographic that leads people to look down on Acura because they sell the Integra/RSX. As long as Lexus can expand the brand without sacrificing the impeccable reputation they have built, it will be great.

Synergy

Officeboy - I think the target demo that Lexus is going after is huge and has big potential. My point is not based on good business decisions or "seeling out" to a price-point contious consumer whatsoever.

My point is that Lexus has about two-models that stand out from the rest of their lineup (on the car side). The IS to me is an upgraded honda - sorry but look at it. The ES is an upgraded Camery and the interior is nothing that special.

Iceman nails it when he says that Lexus could have done more. I mean hell, we drive Lexus's not Toyota's, right?

TwentyTen

I found this post during a site search and after reading all of the opinions, I wanted to bring it back into the light with my .02:

The IS300 is clearly not intended to be a luxury car but a lure to get younger buyers as loyal Lexus customers. Anyone who has ever sat in an IS after test dtiving, being driven in, or driving an LS, RX, or GS knows that the car was made just for that reason. The leather quality is horrible. I've been more impressed by a leather jacket @ Target. Quality paint, nice stock rims, cool lights and generally cool aesthetics in and out, but the cabin is extremely cramped (and I'm only 5'8"/185lbs).

The GS Series is the perfect blend of luxury and performance, especially the GS430. As far as the ES series, I can't really say - I haven't driven one but I know that it shares the Camry's body. I don't know about the engine or the luxries but to quote TheOfficeMan: "With the introduction of the IS300, the ES300 suddenly found itself free to be more luxurious, which it did. As the result, the newest ES300 lacks the punch of the previous gen, but makes up for it with smoother ride, more luxury etc." Lexus has created a pretty well rounded product line that I am fortunate enough to own.

As far as nothing else comparing to the GS - I have to agree. I have wanted this car since 1997! This is my dream car, better than the 5 series, better than the E class (with the exception of the NEW E55) and better than the Audi A4 and A6, & IMO Volvo's C & S series.

My .02 are spent

amy011079

It is to your own opinion what you think of each model car, which is why Lexus designed them all so differently. Everyone has different tastes in things that is why there are so many views about them all in this thread. IMO Lexus did the right thing. They have a different car for each taste. If you want a sports sedan go IS300, if you want a coupe convertable then you better get a SC430, if you want sports and luxury then go GS400/430 if you want Luxury at an entry level or higher go ES330 and LS430. And if you don't like it go somewhere else. But you are bound to find something in the Lexus line that you like.

Each brand of car to me has something that I don't like, I have yet to find a perfect car. I wish my car had more umph but nothing that F/I won't help. BMW is all name. Yeah they are nice cars but they are freakin eveywhere. The design of their cars didn't actually start looking good to me until a few years ago. My sister has an 03 and it's not all that it is cracked up to be. And not to mention they all look like the same freakin car except for size.

Mercedes, you couldn't pay me to own one of those after all the horrors stories I have heard from friends that have had them or people that I know that have had them etc. Saab, blech. Don't know much about Audi, they look really nice but they all KINDA look the same too. And I know there are others but hopefully you get my point.

jaysonb

Isn't the 2004 ES330 faster to 60mph than the 2004 GS300?

I think Lexus's own numbers show this to be true.

TwentyTen

Funny. 3 looks like a smaller 5 which look slike a smaller 7.

ripe911

Last year, I drove a 2000 Camry for about a week and believe me I was so happy to go back to the 1996 Es300 I had at the time. Ride is much better on the Es and this is car that was 4 yrs older than the Camry.

Also, the Es is a big money maker for Toyota since it is shared with the Camry, Rx300/330, and the HighLander. Its all about business strategy and what makes the most money.

RMMGS4

iTrader: (5)

I couldn't agree with you and amy more. Someone down the street owned a black M5, but after like a year of thinking it was a 3 series, I realized what it was. That was about the same time I realized the guy was a Jerk and started revving his motor every time he drove by my house.

These are probably the top 3 reasons why I don't own a BMW :

3. Don't like the way they look, especially the new models. I HATE THE KIDNEY BEAN GRILL looks like pig nostrils !
2. They all look the same. Styling hasn't changed enough over the years, ubtil now since they are getting uglier.
1. There are too many jerk off, stuck up, wanna B yups, driving them, that I don't want to be associated with that image.

I do have friends with nicely modded bimmers ( they can look much beter modded) and I do like the current M3, but it did have to grow on me. So every temptation I have ever had to buy one has lead me to remembering those top 3 and then I say forget it !

Someone should start a thread TOP 10 Things you hate about Bimmers".

PS - Amy, my family owns a GS and an IS so we hear where you're coming from.

amy011079

heck yea that would be too funny! the bimmer guys are always doing something about 10 things i hate about lexus. and thanks!!

TwentyTen

I am guilty of lusting over the style of the new 745i. Aside from the kidney bean grill, that's a beautiful (huge) car.

I couldn't have said it better! Your comment inspires me to create a new Post - What does your car say about you?

https://www.clublexus.com/forums/sho...hreadid=101079

AlphaJZS

iTrader: (2)

in regards to the subject : YEP, WE DO.

XenonES3

Yes, ES330 does 0-60 in 7.2 seconds.

As far as the GS being so nice in comparison to the ES, for another 20 GRAND , IT BETTER BE