doug_999

Um, maybe I don't understand. Or maybe you meant it a different way. But those are positive numbers so they are adding to their sales. Maybe you meant to say that sales of the X5 were down from last year?

rogers2

First and foremost I don't feel any car company is on another level. Lets stick to the topic. Lexus make cushy cars. EXCEPT THE IS300
Acura/Honda do make rwd cars. I never said Lexus doesn't make nice cars. I said they don't make performance cars. Let me remind you what's in the sc430 class.SL500/JAGXKR/911CAB and cad XLR and it doesn't outperform any of those cars. If Lexus add more performance
to their cars they will be miles ahead of all the companies. For the record most of the time when a new design of a car comes out most people at the begin always thinks it's ugly. As far as style I feel it's in this order

MB/BMW/INFINITI/AUDI/LEXUS/ACURA
PERFORMANCE
BMW/MB/AUDI/ACURA/INFINITI/LEXUS
LUXURY
MB/AUDI/LEXUS/BMW/INFINITI/ACURA
AND YES LEXUS #1in rel/cust svr

meanboy

Yes, and that brought down the total number of BMWS down. Without their numbers BMW sales percentages would have been up for the year. In contrast, the 3 series numbers brought up BMW sales percentages.

RNM GS3

Which RWD does Acura or Honda make?????

Style of cars varies from person to person, so u cant compare companies based on style.

Why do u rank acura higher than lexus and infiniti in performance???? They have no car that has a V8 even. The NSX is their only true performance car. They have no car to compete with GS, LS, IS or the M45, Q45, G35. Unless u really love Acura i really would love to hear the reasoning for ur ranking.

As far as luxury, Lexus is #1 imo. When MB starts making a navigation system that actually works than maybe you can compare them.

I do agree with u that Lexus should step up in terms of performance, but i guess they feel thats not their target market.

meanboy

Acura ahead of Infiniti in performance? The last time I looked Infiniti has two G-35, both with 6 speeds, FX series of vehicles, and the Q45. Overall, they seemed to have it over Acura.

The cars you mentioned as competitiors to the SC430 all cost more..much more(although, I don't know about the XLR). In fact, Porsche is doing so well they are ceasing production for the 2003 model year(no sales).

911 cab is 78k msrp without options - it will need some
MB SL500 is 86k msrp without options - it will need some
XK ragtop is 78k with NAV and Xenon
SC430 is 64k with Lexus link

Considering the company that it is compared to, especially since it's purposely handicapped, is very commendable.

rogers2

[QUOTE]Originally posted by RNM GS3
[B]Which RWD does Acura or Honda make?????

Style of cars varies from person to person, so u cant compare companies based on style.

Why do u rank acura higher than lexus and infiniti in performance???? They have no car that has a V8 even. The NSX is their only true performance car. They have no car to compete with GS, LS, IS or the M45, Q45, G35. Unless u really love Acura i really would love to hear the reasoning for ur ranking.

As far as luxury, Lexus is #1 imo. When MB starts making a navigation system that actually works than maybe you can compare them.

I do agree with u that Lexus should step up in terms of performance, but i guess they feel thats not their target market

You ever heard of the S2000. Why would I love Acura? It's a car company. Having a V8/RWD don't make your car a performance car. More like a Buick with a nice name. Please don''t take personal Quote from Motorweek about the SC
I put Acura ahead of Lexus in one category and your crying. What about the other 3 companies?
Acura/Honda does have better performance cars than Lexus. Name one car Lexus has that perform /HANDLES better than the NSX or S2K. Lexus is not #1in Luxury. MB HOLDS THAT TITLE.

Simple fact Lexus need to make at least one car that has a growl.

LexFather

I deleted my comments cause I felt some were out of line. Rogers, I took no offense to your comments, this is the internet and a discussion forum. Glad we care to disagee.

rogers2

Well I feel your dad is wrong. Lexus cars are not that expensive. Maybe to person that make 60K or less. No offense to anyone.. You basiscally wrote what I said in a previous statement.Yes Lexus is one of the top carmakers in Luxury but not performance. Like i said Lexus is last. Stick to the topic lexus need more performance. I never question Lexus Rel/customer svr.
Tell me one thing Lexus has over audi other than rel/cust svr
offer no manual except the is300
Lexus is only behind bmw&mb in "PERFORMANCE" bull****
I guess you forgot about the A6/RS6 from AUDI

elclassico

lexus needs more performance, lexus needs more performance, lexus needs more performance, do you ever shut up? you sound like my 5 year old daughter.

rogers2

I guess you got the point. But forgot the topic.

Gojirra99

Yes, I want Lexus to have high performance variations of their cars. But there's no question through my own observations & any surveys and studies that can be found that they build the highest quality cars among all manufacturers, and that's mainly what sell their cars.

They still manage to be the #1 selling luxury brand for the last few years despite having a significantly narrower line-up of car models to offer than MB & BMW.

Lexus philosophy as of now seems to be that you can't be everything to everybody. No one manufacturer produce cars that please everyone. If you don't like Lexus, if you want more performance,buy something else.

elclassico

i think the topic is worthless, you have no point. get a grip, if it doesnt live up to your expectation of quality so be it, anyone can complain about anything. doesnt mean you have a point. whats your point, lex better get more hp or people like you wont buy it> i don t think lex corp. is too concerned w/ people like you...
just my opinion

RON430

I wish one of the minds here would define what they are calling lack of performance in the Lexus. When the GS4 came out it was clearly faster than the equivalent bimmer, audi, and merc (with allegations about the six speed 540 aside, the stick just made it get closer to the GS4). So now, due to the competition, the e, 5, and who knows about the A6 4.2, are making it closer. Lexus has demonstrated that it doesn't have any interest in an AMG, M, or R version of a Lexus due to the inevitable conclusion that the market is just too small except for the high school kids daydreaming but would it really surprise very many people if the next GS has a five liter with an automatic and shaves several tenths off of the 0-60 (which is virtually a meaningless benchmark in the real world) to cater to those who buy a car based on the brochure? And the insurance will be a little more and the gas mileage a little less. And the world will still keep spinning. OK, turn those personal reality distortion fields back up to 11 but unless Lexus redefines its customer, what you see is what you are going to get. And that isn't a bad thing to most of us. It is apparent that bimmer, merc, and audi are much more lathered about their customers buying a Lexus than Lexus is of their customers buying one of the competition. Final comment, if Lexus increased performance to the detriment of reliability, like bimmer, I would take that as a very, very bad sign and believe it would be difficult for Lexus to retain its customer base.

Someday someone will be thankful that they live in a time and have the wherewithall to buy cars like bimmer 5 series, mercedes e class, audi A6, and yes, Lexus GS without making the different approaches taken by each maker as a personal insult. OK, back to how many bimmers can drive on the head of a pin.

meanboy

[QUOTE]Originally posted by rogers
[B]Last time I checked the S2000 had a big old H on it. Honda is not a luxury marque. If you include Honda then you have to include Toyota. Didn't you just admonish elcassico for forgetting the topic? Seems you just did the same by introducing Honda into the topic.

It seems the only car better in the Acura line is the NSX. Now, if you want to say look at the price difference I'll agree with that. But that would sour your statements concerning the SC430 versus all of the other cars. What to do...what to do.

You have not defended your acura over infiniti statement concerning performance. That should be a good one to read.

Iceman

I think he's got a point regarding Acura vs. Infiniti performance. Acura has had the Integra GS-R and Type-R, the Legend sports coupe, the NSX, and now the TL and CL Type-S. Honda has a proud heritage in Formula 1 racing that translates into how they design their cars. They invented VTEC, for instance, as a way to get more power out of a smaller engine while maintaining low emissions. Until the G35, Infiniti has never had a car that could really be considered a "performance" machine.