From USA Today : Lexus GS falls short of Infiniti M (merged threads)
#76
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Originally Posted by Off
No flames, just wanted to point out the GS300 3.0L DI V6 is a short-stroke derivative of the 1GR-FE 4.0L V6 in the 4Runner. Not a bad thing, since that's a fine engine.
The Infiniti M also uses a 2nd gen FM platform, with over 60% new components.
Platform sharing and component sharing is a good thing. It allows manufacturers to achieve better QC and economies of scale.
So the GS300 should be the GS350 already!![Big Thumb Up](https://www.clublexus.com/forums/images/smilies/biggthumpup.gif)
The Infiniti M also uses a 2nd gen FM platform, with over 60% new components.
Platform sharing and component sharing is a good thing. It allows manufacturers to achieve better QC and economies of scale.
So the GS300 should be the GS350 already!
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#77
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Originally Posted by 1SICKLEX
Lexus does share items (they are a business trying to make money) they just don't do it in such obvious ways.
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#78
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Originally Posted by 1SICKLEX
What world do you live in? Remember the Q45, yeah it was supposed to be a sports luxury sedan. They CLEARLY had trouble, for 16 years.
Remember the I35, yeah, it was supposed to be a sports sedan, and its discontinued.
Remember the J30, yeah, it was suppposed to be a sports sedan, and its discontinued.
Kudos to Infintii finally getting some of it together and using the FM platform to create some very sporting sedans and even a sporty SUV.
The IS wasn't the sales success, but was the first Japanese RWD sedan to tackle the 3. The GS is cleary a success.
Remember the I35, yeah, it was supposed to be a sports sedan, and its discontinued.
Remember the J30, yeah, it was suppposed to be a sports sedan, and its discontinued.
Kudos to Infintii finally getting some of it together and using the FM platform to create some very sporting sedans and even a sporty SUV.
The IS wasn't the sales success, but was the first Japanese RWD sedan to tackle the 3. The GS is cleary a success.
#79
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Originally Posted by 1SICKLEX
I did not say the 3.0 V-6 is better than the VQ and I won't say that. The VQ has been a 10 best engine for years now, for anyone to argue its a bad engine is sad.
But you sound like some kid who thinks horsepower is everything. So please join www.mustangforums.com if that is going to be the jest of your arguements here.
You forgot that the GS has an additional gear. The M35 uses a 5 speed. The 1998-2005 GS used a 5 speed. Hell the 96-97 1GS used a 5 speed. Its old news. Heck Benz has a 7 speed.
To some, the most hp and an old tranny is fine. To many, less power, a new tranny, and 20% gas mileage is better. To some, they don't care if their 40-50k M35 shares its engine with every Nissan product known to man. To some, they would rather less power for an engine that is not as shared.
Part of luxury is exclusivity.
But you sound like some kid who thinks horsepower is everything. So please join www.mustangforums.com if that is going to be the jest of your arguements here.
You forgot that the GS has an additional gear. The M35 uses a 5 speed. The 1998-2005 GS used a 5 speed. Hell the 96-97 1GS used a 5 speed. Its old news. Heck Benz has a 7 speed.
To some, the most hp and an old tranny is fine. To many, less power, a new tranny, and 20% gas mileage is better. To some, they don't care if their 40-50k M35 shares its engine with every Nissan product known to man. To some, they would rather less power for an engine that is not as shared.
Part of luxury is exclusivity.
#80
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Originally Posted by LiquidBlue
My, we're sensitive... i said nothing about Infiniti selling sedans, i was speaking strictly about Lexus... let me restate: Lexus has a hard time selling sedans in comparison to MB and BMW.. That is factual. Now, if we're going to compare the Infiniti M specifically with the Lexus GS specifically, that is another issue, which I will address in another post.
And in the near future, as gas prices become a concern, the cars with improved fuel mileage, and perhaps even the added environmental and technological incentive of hybrid and other alternative fuel technologies, will become more attractive.
#81
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Originally Posted by enigma354
Hard time selling? While it's true that Lexus ranks #5 in luxury car sales in the US, behind MB, BMW, Acura, and Cadillac, I hardly think that the LS is having much trouble against the S-class, its chief competition, nor is the ES doing poorly in its segment. The IS and GS classes are in the midst of turnover to new, exciting models. Right now Lexus is poised to improve on its luxury car sales figures, but hopefully not at the expense of quality or profitability.
And in the near future, as gas prices become a concern, the cars with improved fuel mileage, and perhaps even the added environmental and technological incentive of hybrid and other alternative fuel technologies, will become more attractive.
And in the near future, as gas prices become a concern, the cars with improved fuel mileage, and perhaps even the added environmental and technological incentive of hybrid and other alternative fuel technologies, will become more attractive.
The ES really has no competition from the imports, with the death of the I35. I guess the TL comes closer, but it's much sportier than the ES.
#82
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The tachometer needle has been more closely synchronized with engine speed to minimize typical tach lag. Bet you never knew there was such a thing, or cared enough to wonder. Nice that Lexus is fixated on such details, but it's a so-what feature.
Originally Posted by TRD-bB
LOL, yeah, and he made Lexus' attention to detail sound like a bad thing.
All the little details are refered to as "so-what" features........
All the little details are refered to as "so-what" features........
yep.. made me laugh. Luxury cars are all about the details, this is where Japanese cars were deficient before, compared to the germans. Obviously reviewer doesnt care about "all that", but thats not your average buyer talking...
#83
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Originally Posted by LiquidBlue
Well, you didn't say that the 3.0 V6 is better than the VQ, but you implied it by stating that the 3.0 is new and the VQ is not.. Newer is not always better, especially when the newer is underpowered compared with the rest of the competition. Having said that, although the M uses a 5 speed tranny and the GS uses a 6 speed, that does not make the 5 speed any worse of a transmission.. It certainly hasn't improved the GS300's 0-60 times in comparison to the M35. So, while the GS may be different from the M in these categories, i'm finding it difficult to draw conclusions on how the GS is superior than the M based on your criteria.
I dont thin MXX is that much faster engine wise, as recent numbers show, M45 was only 0.2 sec faster than GS430, throughout the testing - despite of 40hp more.
M is faster because Infiniti made it all about sportiness. Lexus didnt, and thats why Lexus is Lexus.
People who buy M want more sportiness, while people who buy GS want more luxury.
If 20yr old kids bought M45's, I would think M would be more sucessful of the two, but since target age is more like 50, I think GS will do better...
#84
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Some journalists are forgetting that not everybody considers harder sport-tuned suspension and overwhelming power as their first priorities when buying a sedan of this class. If it would be so Infiniti and BMW would be only players on the market. There are hundred things more in a luxury sedan that makes the car a complete experience. This USA Today journalist sounds like a streetracer. All the gearheads and sport-oriented drivers will be fully satisfied in 2006 when Lexus receives kickass power stronger than ever - GS350, GS450h and GS460. I can safely predict, that GS460 will put M45 to shame.
Last edited by Itsuki_23; 03-26-05 at 05:19 AM.
#85
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Originally Posted by LiquidBlue
My, we're sensitive... i said nothing about Infiniti selling sedans, i was speaking strictly about Lexus... let me restate: Lexus has a hard time selling sedans in comparison to MB and BMW.. That is factual. Now, if we're going to compare the Infiniti M specifically with the Lexus GS specifically, that is another issue, which I will address in another post.
#87
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Originally Posted by LiquidBlue
My, we're sensitive... i said nothing about Infiniti selling sedans, i was speaking strictly about Lexus... let me restate: Lexus has a hard time selling sedans in comparison to MB and BMW.. That is factual. Now, if we're going to compare the Infiniti M specifically with the Lexus GS specifically, that is another issue, which I will address in another post.
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#88
Lexus Connoisseur
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5 Stars
HONDA ACCORD
ACURA NSX
ACURA RL
GMC YUKON
HONDA ODYSSEY
INFINITI G35
LEXUS ES330
LEXUS GS300
LEXUS GS430
LEXUS GX470
LEXUS RX330
LEXUS SC430
MERCEDES-BENZ CLK CLASS
MINI COOPER
NISSAN FRONTIER
PORCHE 911 GT2
TACOMA PICKUP
TOYOTA 4RUNNER
TOYOTA CELICA
TOYOTA RAV4
TOYOTA SEQUOIA
TOYOTA TUNDRA
VOLVO C70
VOLVO S60
VOLVO V40
VOLVO V70
Hmmm where's that FX35/45 on the list? Not as good as the G35 is right, but not that great to make it on the 5 star list.
Only one Nissan and one Infiniti. Lexus and Toyota dominate the list itself. Not surprised.
HONDA ACCORD
ACURA NSX
ACURA RL
GMC YUKON
HONDA ODYSSEY
INFINITI G35
LEXUS ES330
LEXUS GS300
LEXUS GS430
LEXUS GX470
LEXUS RX330
LEXUS SC430
MERCEDES-BENZ CLK CLASS
MINI COOPER
NISSAN FRONTIER
PORCHE 911 GT2
TACOMA PICKUP
TOYOTA 4RUNNER
TOYOTA CELICA
TOYOTA RAV4
TOYOTA SEQUOIA
TOYOTA TUNDRA
VOLVO C70
VOLVO S60
VOLVO V40
VOLVO V70
Hmmm where's that FX35/45 on the list? Not as good as the G35 is right, but not that great to make it on the 5 star list.
Only one Nissan and one Infiniti. Lexus and Toyota dominate the list itself. Not surprised.
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Last edited by flipside909; 03-26-05 at 07:25 AM.