lexguynj

Are you kidding about your assumptions of BMW drivers?! The same assumption should be of you, pulling up in your Lexus at the Golf course. Why not just drive a non-premium brand?

The Fun Factor is for real when you drive the BMW with Sports Package.

Drive the GS300AWD and you will be even less impressed. The GS430 is impressive.

adale

My two cents( with inflation worth a little more) - very long essay!

The GS (and lexus for that matter) is as reliable as a brick and but about as much fun to drive as one. Abeit a very comfortable one. I have a '03 GS with 50K on it which I love but the car has no soul, i.e., it is boring to drive. And the one thing I hate is the damn hesitation on the tranny.

That being said, the 530 and 545 has their own problems. I test drove one and I love the steering, tranny and general ride comfort. What I dislike is the numerous trips you have to take to the dealership. One of my associates has a '04 7 series (his daily driver), an '05 5 series (for his wife) and an '04 X5 (for the snowy days) and an older M5 (for FUN). His 7 has been in and out of the shop more than it's been in his garage. The new 5 has been in and out about 6 times and the car only has 5K miles on it not to mention the loaner car she was given just stopped on the interstate one day and would not start again, and if the X5's cd changer ever changes a CD correctly they mark it on their calendar. These vehicles have some issues with their electrical systems but BMW will figure it out and make it right with their customers. They are a great car company!

I agree with others who have posted that the BMW line is purchased as much for the status as the car. I also agree that the 5 series is a much more agressive looking car that acts like one. The GS styling is great, but more fluid, less on the edge. Lexus has never been a risk taker in the styling or the engineering of their cars, but they sell IMO the most refined car in this price range. Some say that Lexus does not have the technology in the cars, but in reality the technology is so well integrated you really never see it.

What it boils down to is what is important to you, price, value, looks, reliability, status, the "Ohhh" factor, driving , fun, whatever. Buy a car today is a compromise and we all have to decide what is important to us.

As for where I stand, I have driven the 530, A6, M35, M45 and the GS300. I now have to battle the idea of waiting for the GS350 or pull the trigger and get the GS300. One of lifes more difficult and yet fun agonies!!!!

akim47

My sister has the last gen 5 series, my brother in law has 330, before they had both had '96 325s. Before I got my GS I test drove the 530. I really didn't think much of it. In addition, the cost (to me) was substantially more than the GS300, and it just wasn't worth it. I am more than happy with my GS3 purchase. For what I can afford (I would have loved to get into a 430), it was the best car. No regrets. It has all the luxury and comfort I could ever ask for.

akim47

Oh, I forgot to add my point about my sister and brother and law's cars... they have been in and out of the dealership with repairs, problems, etc. They finally found a good mechanic in their area, but it is still costing them a small fortune to maintain their cars.

merlin70

Read it again. I said 530 drivers, not BMW in general. I respect 545's, 330's especially with manuals, and 745's. I just think 530 drivers in particular are buying just for the badge, not the reasons an enthusiast would normally buy a BMW which includes at least an above average desire for performance. There's not necessarily big problems with that, it's just like ES330 buyers. A comfortable car with a premium badge. But let's not confuse a 530 and ES330 for the performance models in the line. Remember, the original poster is comparing the 530 to a V8 Lexus. If he was comparing it to a GS300 or even ES330 I would say ok, fine, it's a toss up.

I had a GS300, and now a GS430. I like the feeling of torque and power which is avialable with the V8. I don't play golf and I work from home, so I'm not out to impress people when I pull up. I drive what I want for me, which is the way it should be.

lexguynj

I understand that this is just your opinion and assumptions. I also bet you have that V8 ego (because you own a GS430). I used to have it when I had my 01 GS430 and thought anything below it was 2nd rate (even a GS300). Maybe you think Lexus is not a performance driven brand like BMW, so you do not lump GS300 owners under this "Buying the car just for the badge" statement, just because they don't have a V8 GS430 (like you are already assuming with BMW drivers with inline 6 cylinder engines) and then you go on to assume ES330 buyers are just content persons with a comfy car.

Remember, we are all driving premium luxury brands here, so we all own this car for some part of the prestige, otherwise we would be driving more practical & more bang for the buck cars by other non-premium brands.

I believe your statement above is a combination of V8 owner arrogance & brand loyalty that we all can relate to at some level. It is human nature, however please do not state that you don't drive your GS430 for the prestige and you also don't care about the name brand because that is unbelievable.

DaveGS4

iTrader: (2)

Gentlemen please shift this conversation back on topic to the cars and away from the commentary on people you don't know.

Please both of you take it to PM.

JeffTsai

iTrader: (1)

One thing about the reliability. If BMW is a more sport oriented car, don't those drivers tend to drive the car much harder and aggresively? As compared to a Lexus owner.

For Lexus the majority of the sales goto the ES and RX. I don't picture soccer moms taking it rally style or anything, not to meniton the fact that those cars weren't designed to do that in the first place. For the BMW camp the 3 series is a very big chunk of their sales and that car is marketed and designed as a sportier car. I'm sure there are plenty of moms driving in 3 series, but the ratio of moms in 3 series vs ES....there are more in ES.

BTW: Mom's in this post is a reference to moms, mature drivers, or people that just cruise. People who have never taken the car over 3000-3500rpm on purpose. Take turns at speeds of 20-30% of the cars maximum handling capability. Basically, the drivers that most of us "aggressive" drivers tend to get pissed at on the road (slows down to 10mph when turning into a shopping center while traffic behind is going 45mph).

Anyways, this post has to do with the reliability of the car. If a majority of the clients drive the car hard and aggresvely, I'm sure the visits the the service department will skyrocket. Take my last car for example, I had a 99' Toyota Camry 4 cyl. I managed to throw a rod in that thing. Bone stock no mods. I was actually surprised the tranny held because the way I drove that thing I was actually expecting the tranny to give out before anything else. Yes, that was my learning car and I was 16-17 at the time Good thing the warranty covered a new motor(car had 45K miles at the time and replaced with new motor ). I mean, driving a car hard isn't against any of the warranty rules as long as the car is in stocked out and no mods. Same goes for BMW, I bet I could send one of those into the service department weekly if I had one. So far the GS is holding up pretty good, but I don't drive anywhere as crazily as I used to. I think I might be having some problems in the rear suspension though. After my last spinout there is a knocking sound back there.

This is a pretty big assumption on my part, but I think it is correct for the most part.
3series drivers = more aggressive
ES drivers = "mom's"

Don't get me wrong. I know Toyota/Lexus is leaps and bounds more reliable than BMW. However, stop to think for a moment. If all BMW drivers behaved like Lexus drivers, wouldn't their trips to the shop be reduced? I know there are many more quirks in BMWs such as their notorious electrical systems that fail for nor reason (nothing to do with drivers style). In the end Lexus would be more reliable than bmw even if all bmw owners drove like lexus owners.

Edit: Ok, never mind about the soccer moms part above...just change that to regular MOM. I have seen them do some crazy ****** in surburbans and minivans when their kids are late for practice. I'm sure the same thing will occur if a soccer mom is behind the wheel of an RX or ES. I guess soccer mom's can be branded as "aggressive drivers"

merlin70

Jeff, good point, I think BMW might be driven harder on average. However, with the car we are talking about here (530), I see them most of the time driven by a 40-ish woman. Just my take based on what I see here. If you look at 745's, they seem to be mostly male businessmen, and 545's seem to be men also but younger than 745 drivers.

Also, I should note BMW is not terrible unreliable car to own. I think they come in about industry average for relaibility? It's just that Lexus is far above average. And considering the big price premium for BMW ($45k+ for a compact car 330?) I think buyers have the right to expect better.

Remember, the original question is would you pick a 6cyl BMW over a GS430 V8? For the same price I think no question you go with the V8 Lexus. If you are jumping up to the $65k+ class and put a premium on sport, then fine go to a 545.

Personally, I really feel the GS430 at around $55k loaded is a great bargain over a similar price 530.

HotShotEng

FYI here is an article testing the 2006 BMW330i against the 2006 IS350: http://www.autoweb.com/content/share...t/861/id/25731

merlin70

That's a good article on the 330 vs. IS350. But I thought we were discussing a 530 vs. GS430?