hrthrb

Okay. I've had the GS450h with the ML and have to say, I'm NOT impressed with the system..at all. My old 99 ES300 had better surround sound. When set to Surround, it sounds like an old single speaker AM system with sound only coming from the center dash speaker. If I move the setting for more toward the back speakers, I get way too much bass thump and I can't hear the real bass notes. Anyone have issues like this with theirs?

Also, I don't seem to find a fast-forward for the CD player. Like a cassette tape, I should be able to fast-forward through a song to any point. But there isn't any way to do that which I can find. Or reverse either. Anyone?

And, isn't XM a standard accessory for the 450h? We haven't paid for XM yet, but hitting the AM/XM button does only AM radio. Am I wrong? Is it an option?

I'm beginning to feel like our salesman *forgot* to tell us about some things. Maybe they can't sell the ML option unless it's bundled with navi. I know I WOULDN'T buy it with this quality of sound.

Modeler

XM is a dealer-installed option. I paid $895 to get it installed, but I got my 450h for below invoice, so extra couple hundred dollars over the going rate was Ok with me. I understand that you can get it installed for $695 to $795 at local dealers. You can do it at any time.

As far as ML system sounds quality, I'm happy with it. It sounds slightly better than the ELS surround system in my previous car - 2004 Acura TL. Just try switching off the surround mode, I think it makes things worse, not better.

Which dealer did you buy your 450h from and what did you pay? I see you're in VA; I live near the Pohanka Lexus of Chantilly.

hrthrb

I bought from Pohanka. Got the car for $55,922; came to $60k out the door with extra warranty, tax, tag and freight. They did okay by us on it. They couldn't deliver a 350 AWD in the black sapphire and tan, but had the 450h in that. I'm happy enough with the deal, but wish the salesman had been just a little bit better about telling us everything about it all.

I know what you mean about turning off the Surround feature. Kind of defeats the purpose, but it's still the ML system.

XM installed by the dealer pre-purchase costs $485. I don't know if they will do it for that after the fact. I don't know if they CAN do it themselves, and probably not for that. (I did my research after I posted the question, on XM).

Thanks for your reply.

Modeler

The $485 figure shown at carsdirect.com and edmunds.com appears to be bogus. I spoke to three different dealers and got quotes from $695 to $895 for the XM when purchased as part of the car purchase transaction. My neighbor is a salesman at Pohanka and he told me that they can do it for the same price ($695) at any time.

Keep in mind that there are two possible installation scenarios for the XM. Some cars come with the "shark fin" antenna on the roof; some don't. Mine didn't, and they put a tiny black antenna on the front edge of my trunk. If yours has a shark fin, I don't think it's easier to install, but would be more visually pleasing.

Good luck.

twister

$485 IS the price for Sirius or XM install. $300 for the module, $50 for the receiver, $135 a rate for 1 hour install even with external antenna. XM is easy since sharkfin will plugin directly. A lot of dealerships outsource install to outside shop.

hrthrb

Mine has the shark fin, so it should be seamless. Still waiting to get more info about whether Sirius or XM is better. I have an old XM receiver and am wondering if I can get one level of service which can be picked up at home and in the car. More research....

I'm taking the car to the service rep. and ask him to verify that our stereo is the ML, that's it's operating correctly as installed, and if so, I'm going to ask if they can reduce the center dash speaker sound. It's overpowering and sounds cheap because of it. Everything is clear and all speakers work exceptionally well, but the center is too hot.

Kesem

I too am trying to decide whether to get XM. How does it sound compared to regular FM broadcasts?

I do like having the details of what is being played on the touch screen, but I'm not sure that benefit alone is worth sending XM money each month.

Modeler

XM has no static, but quality will typically be worse than good FM transmissions. Songs selection on some channels (like 70s, 80s, 90s, for example) is bargain-bin. Other than that XM is great. I've had it for three years now and there's no way in hell I can go back to the crappy local FM market (Washington DC area) and the incessant commercials.

twister

To make your decision of XM vs Sirius easier, just go to their website and look at the channel line up. If you are only after 70's/80's/90's, rock, dance/pop and today's hits music and latest news, both of them have a great coverage. You have to look for a specific interest channels. For me the deal breaker was Howard Stern who I HAVE to listen in the morning to start my day right!!! You also get MAXIM radio and Playboy radio, along with Raw Dog Comedy (Jim Brewer of SNL). Those were the selling points for me. I think you also get a full NFL and NBA coverage on Sirius. Or if you are into Martha Stewart, they got her too. While XM has Oprah and Opie and Antony if you like that stuff. With sound quality, they are probably on the same level. Reception will be better if you are in a big city where you get both satellite and terrestrial antenna coverage. Both will cost you $12.99 a month and you get additional subscribers for $6.99. You also get a free on-line listening account where you can login from anywhere and stream your channels. Just like Modeler mentioned, after experiencing Sirius, I will never go back to a regular radio station.

One thing to keep in mind, if you have very short commute, it probably not worth it unless you are after listening on-line or getting subscription at home. But, when you stuck in a traffic or have to drive long way - its priceless!!!

chuckf99

i agree...my wife has xm, yet hates it. we both listen to sirius...my car, her office, my office, home (stiletto while running)....

the channel lineup does it. hands down....

and don't forget about all the sports....the NFL channel is amazing...i think the ONLY sport xm has is baseball...the rest are all on Sirius.

mail_junky

I have an IS350 with ML and I too feel the same way. The center channel is too loud and makes it sound like all the music is coming from there only.

I am a bit disappointed by the imaging of the ML system. On the other hand, the tonal response of the setup is quite good.

I do have a question for you guys out there with a GS ML system. Is there a menu that let you choose to optimize for the driver's position vs the passenger's position? Somehow this option is NOT available on the IS's ML system which is another disappointment......

Modeler

First of all, you should turn off the Surround mode; it's crap. Second, no, there is no one-touch adjustment to optimize it for the driver's position, but you can just do it manually with balance and fade.

DrexLex

The CD's fast forward/reverse is done by touching and holding the << / >> keys on the touchscreen. If you touch it a short time, it goes to the next track.

As for the bass, yes, it is too plump. I've ordered an amplifier to stick in the trunk that will be driven from the existing sub wires. It will add some power, but moreover it offers 2 things that will tame the bass: First is a woofer gain control I can place at my fingertips and use easily as the song may require. This is more convenient and effective than fiddling with the bass control in the menu--which takes a few touches to the screen--with eyes off the road. The amp also has a 40Hz adjustable boost, so with the main "plump" part of the bass reduced, I can still get some bottom.

I also agree that the surround mode isn't set up optimally--and I wish it were Pro Logic II, which is smoother. ML sets it up too strong to the center speaker. They don't get it--vocals should come from in front of the listener, not off on some angle. Best I found is to set the L/R balance 2 clicks to the L, and the front/rear balance 2 clicks to the rear. It still beats the pants off multi-stereo, IMHO, as I cannot stand hearing vocals smeared all over the cabin.

red whip

XM has: MLB, Indy Racing League, NHL, Pac-10, Big-TEN, Big East college football & basketball, PGA, ESPN, Fox Sports & more...

XM has over 170 channels versus 130 from the other one. More music, sports coverage & news talk, entertainment...

...also the offical satellite radio of Lexus for the next decade...