dunnojack

i guess it doesn't matter in the end.

lexus still sells lots of other cars.

and it seems lexus is gonna keep this body style for 7 years, so who cares if sales suck right...

EXP_Cougar

Really? Having driven both, I find them to be very different vehicles. I would think that each appeals to a different demographic and that the ooverlap is not that large. Perhaps the confusion could be better addressed by more aggressive marketing?

Shane D

I can't speak for recently, but when I was shopping for a car last year it came down to the Lexus GS300AWD and the Infiniti M35X. The bottom line was I bought the Infiniti for four reasons:
1) Cheaper price
2) Way more options included for the price
3) Much more headroom
4) GS was gutless on the highway compared to the M35

New models may have addressed some of these shortcomings, but that was the story last year.
However, hanging around their showroom I really started to like the SC430...

LexFather

I think you are not seeing the total picture here.
So the GS sold 2,021 units with no kind of great lease deals like BMW or even Infiniti. We have posted the residuals, etc, they simply are not class leading. TONS of cars in this class are leased.

Then look at how many models BMW/Benz has vs Lexus. We have
GS 350
GS 350 AWD
GS 430 (with production ending as the GS 460 is ramped up)
GS 450h (special edition/low volume car, only 2k to be sold)

BMW
530i (E60)
530xi (E60)
530xi Sports Wagon (E60)
535i (E60)
535xi (E60)
535xi Sports Wagon (E60)
550i (E60)
M5 (E60)
Benz
E350
E350 Wagon
E350 AWD
E 500
E500 AWD
E500 Wagon
E63 Wagon
E63

So considering the above, selling over 2,000 is great!!! GS 350 sales are up 2.2%!

The E-class and 5 have been around for ages and simply will continue to ousell the GS until Lexus adds more models. The E and 5 are the standard for this class, every month they trade places #1 and #2 for sales.

Considering that, the Lexus GS is 3rd!! A huge accomplishment. And the GS does meet Lexus sales targets.

Remember, not EVERY Lexus is meant to sell #1 in class.

LexFather

Disagree. ES has been around since 1989, GS 1993. Both have their targets both have done very very well for Lexus in sales, in keeping buyers in attracting new ones.

Lexus has proven they can offer 2 entry level sedans (ES/IS) and sell well. I will agree with you, it might hurt the GS as the ES is bigger, the IS sportier and that leaves the GS in the middle and it is more expensive.

However, all 3 are not going anywhere.

jerfitz

In my case it was the price. The GS350s increase in price over the ES350 was not worth it for what I felt were the few more extras offered. As an example, the ever so slight increase in HP in the GS350 was not worth it, i.e., for me.

mel's-gs

I didn't think I'd spend more for the GS instead of the ES, but when I drove both, I was sold on the GS350. I also wanted something slightly more sporty than the ES, and I wasn't feeling the 5 or the E series after being in them. Guys at Lexus, BMW and Mercedes told me the ES was a 55 year old man's car. I thought that was funny, especially because that's the way I felt driving the E class. Besides, not to offend any ES owners, but I could not get past what I felt was an ugly interior. Just my opinion.

memasterac

Not so sure about why the GS sells the least. But one thing I am sure: the GS is the sexiest among BMW 5, MB E, and Infiniti M. I really wouldn’t mind the GS sells less than other comparable luxury cars as well as other Lexus models… >>> UNIQUENESS <<<

bozer

I agree. The GS wins in the looks department! All of the other cars looks the same except they have different badges

audimerc

Well that is my point sicklex. MB and BMW invest in one platform that is fairly flexible while lexus has two different platforms which is not very cost effective. MB and BMW sells 5 and e-class cars and can put tons of money back in R&D while lexus sells a fraction in GS and where is the money for further R&D come from? My point was that if they make a car that can incorporate the ES and GS benefits they can through more money at that car to compete better with e-class and 5 series. Lexus could also use the money to design coupes and wagons.
This is the reason no other manufacturer has 2 similiar size sedans competing for similiar markets. As you can see others on this forum has looked at both the ES and GS when shopping for their car which indicates that Lexus is cannibalizing its own sales between the two models.
I agree with you that both sell reasonably well but if Lexus wants to be the sales leader and known as such instead of third place than I think they have no choice but to go to a single platform eventually. It's not like customers mind since the range in price in the E-class and 5 series are huge 20-30grand.

gstois

Many people still look to the German cars as status symbols and the Lexus as a glorified "Japanese cars." I see it a lot with people in Orange County, with tons of Range Rovers, BMWs and Mercedes, despite the fact that they are all crappy cars. Some of them eventually see the light, but it's going to take a while for Lexus to catch their attention.

They all need to go to Europe and drive in a beat-up BMW or Mercedes taxi cab to see the junk that those cars really are.

audimerc

well crap in the sense that they are unreliable I would totally agree. But the european cars do drive fairly nice. They are much more stable at high speed and they also can put the power down a little better than lexus at the moment. It might be due to weight distribution or larger tires but currently Lexus is still a little behind in that aspect. But I chose Lexus because it is way way more reliable in the long run and it is much more quiet than the european cars. I own both the GS and E-class and on the highway the e-class is much more stable but Gs is smoother and quieter. but my E breaks down all the F@#@ing time.

LexFather

Well the ES platform is shared with the RX and Camry and Highlander so it is very flexible. There is talk the next ES/RX will be Lexus based only.

The GS was its own platform until the IS came, the IS is based off the GS (thus why the IS weighs a lot).

I see what you are saying, Lexus has 3 sedans that do overlap in price and size etc but again, they do meet sales targets.

I just have to tip my hat off to the E and 5 b/c month after month every year, they are trading spots for #1 or #2 and they are just fantastic vehicles. Clearly they know what the buyer wants, even with some quality issues sometimes. On top of that, the E/5 cost significantly more than the GS. It shows people will pay for what they truly want!!!

We also have to give kudos to the M35/45 as Infiniti is still a bit player but that car has done very well for them in this class.

audimerc

I always dream of a car that can be reliable as a Lexus, ride like a merc, and handle like a bimmer and you have the perfect car. Just waiting for someone to build a car like that that we can afford. I think Lexus can do it, it will just take same time for them to figure it out that cars driven in North America and Europe are driven at high speeds.

Yang1815

iTrader: (1)

As far as the dream car goes, you take the reliable 3GS and put on some aftermarket parts to make it ride like a merc AND handle like a bimmer, it's not impossible