encore888

The marketing reports show that many buyers, particularly in the US, opt for the ES and step up to the LS. The 3GS is targeted more at the 5-series, and avoids the luxury emphasis of the ES and LS to some extent. Since the biggest strength of Lexus is luxury, the other vehicles sell in greater numbers. But with the IS-F and other performance enhancements, the GS can improve further by association. But there's more to that...

I think Lexus was working around the ES and LS markets with the 3GS and 2GS. Beginning with the 1GS the V6 midsize sporty Lexus sedan was supposed to take up the price point between the ES and LS, but it's a tight fit because of the attractive pull to the other vehicles because of price/value, features, and reputation.

Now with the 5ES and 4LS we see some adjustments. The 5ES adds an UL package but hews more tightly to the entry luxury segment in a number of areas, compared vs. the 4ES. The 4LS has gone up in price significantly, features, options, etc. This widens the gap for the GS to straddle the $45,000-60,000+ segment.

The 4LS has gone up in price such that, for instance, in Consumer Reports it is no longer eligible for the 'best car we ever tested' section...the LS 430 at $55,000 was the winner and now that spot has been taken up by the M35/45, despite the new LS 460 getting the highest score ever in CR at 99/100, better than any other vehicle. The 4LS is now (rightfully) compared at the top end with the S/7/A8 in pricing, and is not compared as much with the midsize segment.

With the 4GS I would like to see Lexus play more to its strength and make the 4GS even more luxurious, yet sporty. Adding interior room and making the vehicle more targeted at the E-Class would be an idea, plus giving the vehicle an Ultra Luxury package option would tell consumers it is as luxurious as the ES...and other exclusive features would add incentive and make it even more worth looking at. A GS-F would enhance the performance credentials, but most of all what Lexus needs is to make the next GS the head of the class in many ways...by broadening its appeal.

I am looking for Lexus to pull an LS-worthy effort on the GS, with more 2GS debut credentials, while amping up the styling introduced with the 3GS. After all, Lexus is rightfully making good on its vehicle potential...looking at the entry-sport market with the 2IS, now a top 10 luxe best-seller, and then there's the midsize market where the 5-series and E-Class show the potential of that segment. However, it's a tough proposition for any luxury manufacturer, given how competitive this segment is. Nonetheless, considering how the 2IS came out, and knowing what Lexus can do with the LS, ES, and others, I am optimistic.

Och

iTrader: (3)

If Lexus wanted the GS to be competitive, why did they butcher the GS460?

flipside909

Toyota/Lexus has traditionally followed a 5 year cycle on their passenger vehicles. The longest running Lexus vehicle cycles were the 2GS, 1SC and the 2SC. There have been plans to extend the traditional model year cycle to 6, but at this point, we wont know considering the GS has been on a weird cycle/run with powertrain choices and etc. since the 2GS.

encore888

Maybe there is the effect of Toyota's pronouncement to slow model cycles down for quality control reasons, rather than rushing new products out to fit demand?

steverhode

But the IS, ES and LS have never been slowed down. The max generation for any of them is 6 years.

The 2GS went on for 8 years for unknown reasons, but I doubt that making the 3GS (available first in 2005 and before the quality issues had come up) wait that long had anything to do with quality concerns.

flipside909

The ES, IS and LS have only had a 5 year max cycle, not 6 to date.

The idea of stretching model year cycles is to help maintain a timeless sense of a particular model and to reduce the fact of outdating an outgoing model year. It also helps with resale values as well.

LexFather

Ryan...LS 430 was out 2001-2006....6 years
Before that the 2LS was out 1995-2000, 6 years...
The IS in America was out 5 years, in Europe I believe it did a 6 or 7 year run!

flipside909

Whoops. Let's make that the IS and ES then.

encore888

Yeah, from what I read the IS was introduced in Europe first.

Back to the GS, I remember also that when they introduced the 5ES, the buzz was all about how 'this vehicle is better than the original LS' in many ways. The GS is supposed to take the late 1/2/3LS price point. With the theme for the 2GS being 'something wicked,' a bad boy persona now taken by the IS-F, perhaps the next GS should have a grown up theme that informs its existence the way the other vehicles have had such a sense of mission and purpose.