2010 Stereo questions (yes -did a search already)
12-04-09, 12:56 PM
#1
Racer
Thread Starter
2010 Stereo questions (yes -did a search already)
I've studied all the "ML or not" threads - so please go gentle on me - I'm new here.
Quick background, currently in a CTS Caddy (with Surround stereo) previous two cars were Infiniti M45 and Acura TL (04) - both with Surround. My lease is coming up. I'm looking at a GS, Acura TL (yeah, I know it's ugly), and Genesis 4.6 Tech (yeah, I know it's a Hyundai).
Yesterday I listened to a ML and not terribly impressed, especially after listening to a 2010 Acura TL Tech 30 minutes earlier. The TL stereo sounded WAY better. Anyone else listened to both and care to comment?
On to the questions. The 2010 brochure says the base stereo is "Surround sound system with 5.1 architecture". To me, that means it would have to play DVD-As to get true 5.1 sound. But the sales guy says it does not play them. Anyone know what that is about? Is Lexus playing games? I know some other vehicles have synthesized surround, but they don't call it 5.1
Second, how well does the "I-Pod/USB" interface work? I don't have an I-Pod, but I would be willing to invest in a MP3 player. Or can you just use a "jump drive" to plug in? I'm really a novice at this (yep, the only guy on the planet without a I-Pod").
I'd welcome any comments - as well as if anyone has thoughts on the current generation Acura TL system. It seems to have a far better stereo & Nav, and the hard drive for the stereo is a big plus.
Please, let's not get into a discussion of "yeah, but which car would you rather drive...". I know a lot about cars and I'll make that decision when all factors, including the price of the car are all weighed in.
Thanks for any input.
Quick background, currently in a CTS Caddy (with Surround stereo) previous two cars were Infiniti M45 and Acura TL (04) - both with Surround. My lease is coming up. I'm looking at a GS, Acura TL (yeah, I know it's ugly), and Genesis 4.6 Tech (yeah, I know it's a Hyundai).
Yesterday I listened to a ML and not terribly impressed, especially after listening to a 2010 Acura TL Tech 30 minutes earlier. The TL stereo sounded WAY better. Anyone else listened to both and care to comment?
On to the questions. The 2010 brochure says the base stereo is "Surround sound system with 5.1 architecture". To me, that means it would have to play DVD-As to get true 5.1 sound. But the sales guy says it does not play them. Anyone know what that is about? Is Lexus playing games? I know some other vehicles have synthesized surround, but they don't call it 5.1
Second, how well does the "I-Pod/USB" interface work? I don't have an I-Pod, but I would be willing to invest in a MP3 player. Or can you just use a "jump drive" to plug in? I'm really a novice at this (yep, the only guy on the planet without a I-Pod").
I'd welcome any comments - as well as if anyone has thoughts on the current generation Acura TL system. It seems to have a far better stereo & Nav, and the hard drive for the stereo is a big plus.
Please, let's not get into a discussion of "yeah, but which car would you rather drive...". I know a lot about cars and I'll make that decision when all factors, including the price of the car are all weighed in.
Thanks for any input.
12-04-09, 03:04 PM
#2
I've driven a TL and own a a 2009 MDX so I have some experience with their stereos and nav. I would say the the Mark Levinson in my GS is stronger, richer, and crisper than either of the Acuras' ELS stereos. Mark Levinson in the GS does play DVD-A as do the Acuras with Tech Package. The GS also will put a DVD on the front screen while stopped while the Acuras do not. One thing I would try on the GS is clicking "Audio", then "Sound", and then trying the difference between having the surround option on or off.
Before purchasing my Acura, I'd heard all about their amazing nav system but I have to say that it is hype. I like the nav in the GS better. First the touch screen controls are much easier to use than Acura's **** controller. Destination input is also difficult in the Acura as you have spin the **** to get to new letters. It also has trouble finding locations by distance and you often have to enter the State, City, Street, and Number. Lexus nav typically only needs Street and Number. The lexus also has far better bluetooth integration because they are in the same device. Acura's bluetooth is managed in the center display, so you can't dial a number in on the screen you have to do it by voice.
Before purchasing my Acura, I'd heard all about their amazing nav system but I have to say that it is hype. I like the nav in the GS better. First the touch screen controls are much easier to use than Acura's **** controller. Destination input is also difficult in the Acura as you have spin the **** to get to new letters. It also has trouble finding locations by distance and you often have to enter the State, City, Street, and Number. Lexus nav typically only needs Street and Number. The lexus also has far better bluetooth integration because they are in the same device. Acura's bluetooth is managed in the center display, so you can't dial a number in on the screen you have to do it by voice.
12-04-09, 03:38 PM
#3
Im a pretty big audiophile and know a good amount about various stock audio systems so ill try to help you with your questions.
5.1 refers to having 5 speakers and 1 subwoofer which the ML does have so it is a true 5.1. dvd-a is the type of format it can play which does sound lot better than normal cds due to a higher bit rate sampling but theres barely any music out there yet that encodes in that format. The tl does have a better sound system though because its digital signal processing is more advanced and samples at a higher rate which gives a truer frequency reproduction.
IMO,the ML system really isnt that impressive. I know in my year gs, the free-air subwoofer they use bottoms out fairly easily. I believe they might have addressed this problem though with a new subwoofer, but don't quote me on that. It also has fairly weak midbass which I believe they used a bandpass filter (digital or physical, I dunno) to put more of the lower frequencies on the subwoofer to create lower distortion for vocals. I haven't heard the new acura tl audio system but it looks pretty impressive from reading the specs. You should take a listen to BMW's Logic 7 system, its my favorites by far.
To answer your question about the ipod/usb, yeah. get one. Most cars now come with hard drive based navigation system which allow you to dump music into the car and play it through that. Some cars will actually allow you to use voice control to say the song you want to hear and itll play automatically from the hard drive. Either way, digital is the way to go. Its so much better than changing through cds.
5.1 refers to having 5 speakers and 1 subwoofer which the ML does have so it is a true 5.1. dvd-a is the type of format it can play which does sound lot better than normal cds due to a higher bit rate sampling but theres barely any music out there yet that encodes in that format. The tl does have a better sound system though because its digital signal processing is more advanced and samples at a higher rate which gives a truer frequency reproduction.
IMO,the ML system really isnt that impressive. I know in my year gs, the free-air subwoofer they use bottoms out fairly easily. I believe they might have addressed this problem though with a new subwoofer, but don't quote me on that. It also has fairly weak midbass which I believe they used a bandpass filter (digital or physical, I dunno) to put more of the lower frequencies on the subwoofer to create lower distortion for vocals. I haven't heard the new acura tl audio system but it looks pretty impressive from reading the specs. You should take a listen to BMW's Logic 7 system, its my favorites by far.
To answer your question about the ipod/usb, yeah. get one. Most cars now come with hard drive based navigation system which allow you to dump music into the car and play it through that. Some cars will actually allow you to use voice control to say the song you want to hear and itll play automatically from the hard drive. Either way, digital is the way to go. Its so much better than changing through cds.
12-04-09, 05:15 PM
#4
Racer
Thread Starter
Thanks for the replies.
Yes, I have a hard disk in my Cadillac and love it. That's why I'm dissapointed that the Lexus does not. As I understand, I can hook up a I-Pod or MP3 player and play music FROM it, but cannot download to the car from it.
As to the 5.1, I understand that-but any true 5.1 requires a source (DVD-A for instance) as 5.1 implies discrete channels - right? I may be wrong, but that would have been my interpretation of a 5.1 system.
Yes, I have a hard disk in my Cadillac and love it. That's why I'm dissapointed that the Lexus does not. As I understand, I can hook up a I-Pod or MP3 player and play music FROM it, but cannot download to the car from it.
As to the 5.1, I understand that-but any true 5.1 requires a source (DVD-A for instance) as 5.1 implies discrete channels - right? I may be wrong, but that would have been my interpretation of a 5.1 system.
12-04-09, 05:54 PM
#5
Racer
Thread Starter
Okay, quick update. I've done some more searching on the internet, and now I believe the 2010 GS does have the ability to store music on the Hard Drive. Unfortunately, both Lexus printed brochure (which I have in front of me) and the Lexus web-site does not address this at all. It only states that the Navigation system is HDD based.
12-04-09, 07:38 PM
#7
Having heard the '09 TL audio system and the ML in my '08 GS, I can definitely say that for 2-channel sound (I don't care for music in surround), the Lexus system is vastly superior. The TL system (with all audio controls flat) sounded unbalanced and had no warmth or depth - it sounded very one-dimensional. In contrast, the ML system in the GS (treble and mid at 0, bass at -1 or 0 depending on the music) sounds much more like my home system. I think one important factor in the difference is that the GS is noticeably quiter than the TL - not that the TL is noisy, the GS is just less so. I listen to pretty much everything except hardcore (c)rap and country - even classical sounds good in the GS. I feed it using Lexus's iPod interface from a 160GB iPod Classic with 256kbps AAC encoded files.
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12-04-09, 08:25 PM
#8
Thanks for the replies.
Yes, I have a hard disk in my Cadillac and love it. That's why I'm dissapointed that the Lexus does not. As I understand, I can hook up a I-Pod or MP3 player and play music FROM it, but cannot download to the car from it.
As to the 5.1, I understand that-but any true 5.1 requires a source (DVD-A for instance) as 5.1 implies discrete channels - right? I may be wrong, but that would have been my interpretation of a 5.1 system.
Yes, I have a hard disk in my Cadillac and love it. That's why I'm dissapointed that the Lexus does not. As I understand, I can hook up a I-Pod or MP3 player and play music FROM it, but cannot download to the car from it.
As to the 5.1, I understand that-but any true 5.1 requires a source (DVD-A for instance) as 5.1 implies discrete channels - right? I may be wrong, but that would have been my interpretation of a 5.1 system.
12-04-09, 08:35 PM
#9
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Im a pretty big audiophile and know a good amount about various stock audio systems so ill try to help you with your questions.
5.1 refers to having 5 speakers and 1 subwoofer which the ML does have so it is a true 5.1. dvd-a is the type of format it can play which does sound lot better than normal cds due to a higher bit rate sampling but theres barely any music out there yet that encodes in that format. The tl does have a better sound system though because its digital signal processing is more advanced and samples at a higher rate which gives a truer frequency reproduction.
IMO,the ML system really isnt that impressive. I know in my year gs, the free-air subwoofer they use bottoms out fairly easily. I believe they might have addressed this problem though with a new subwoofer, but don't quote me on that. It also has fairly weak midbass which I believe they used a bandpass filter (digital or physical, I dunno) to put more of the lower frequencies on the subwoofer to create lower distortion for vocals. I haven't heard the new acura tl audio system but it looks pretty impressive from reading the specs. You should take a listen to BMW's Logic 7 system, its my favorites by far.
To answer your question about the ipod/usb, yeah. get one. Most cars now come with hard drive based navigation system which allow you to dump music into the car and play it through that. Some cars will actually allow you to use voice control to say the song you want to hear and itll play automatically from the hard drive. Either way, digital is the way to go. Its so much better than changing through cds.
5.1 refers to having 5 speakers and 1 subwoofer which the ML does have so it is a true 5.1. dvd-a is the type of format it can play which does sound lot better than normal cds due to a higher bit rate sampling but theres barely any music out there yet that encodes in that format. The tl does have a better sound system though because its digital signal processing is more advanced and samples at a higher rate which gives a truer frequency reproduction.
IMO,the ML system really isnt that impressive. I know in my year gs, the free-air subwoofer they use bottoms out fairly easily. I believe they might have addressed this problem though with a new subwoofer, but don't quote me on that. It also has fairly weak midbass which I believe they used a bandpass filter (digital or physical, I dunno) to put more of the lower frequencies on the subwoofer to create lower distortion for vocals. I haven't heard the new acura tl audio system but it looks pretty impressive from reading the specs. You should take a listen to BMW's Logic 7 system, its my favorites by far.
To answer your question about the ipod/usb, yeah. get one. Most cars now come with hard drive based navigation system which allow you to dump music into the car and play it through that. Some cars will actually allow you to use voice control to say the song you want to hear and itll play automatically from the hard drive. Either way, digital is the way to go. Its so much better than changing through cds.
12-04-09, 08:39 PM
#10
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Okay, quick update. I've done some more searching on the internet, and now I believe the 2010 GS does have the ability to store music on the Hard Drive. Unfortunately, both Lexus printed brochure (which I have in front of me) and the Lexus web-site does not address this at all. It only states that the Navigation system is HDD based.
(don't want you to be mis-informed or disappointed after you get your new car home...)
The available Hard Disc Drive (HDD) Lexus Navigation System eliminates the need for DVD map discs and offers enhanced Bluetooth® with phonebook download and Voice command, a casual-language—based voice recognition feature. This new technology allows the driver to give more flexible, conversational commands for easier access to audio, climate, and navigation system functions. Voice command helps users avoid having to speak commands in a specific order―making tasks easier to accomplish, in fewer steps, and helping to allow drivers to focus more on the road ahead.
System functions include multiple route calculations, route preview, simplified highway junction graphics, and a dual-map screen mode. Bluetooth wireless technology allows the transfer of personal phone books to the navigation system, from which the driver can make hands-free phone calls.
12-05-09, 05:49 AM
#11
Racer
Thread Starter
Did not see anything about storing music on HDD:
(don't want you to be mis-informed or disappointed after you get your new car home...)
The available Hard Disc Drive (HDD) Lexus Navigation System eliminates the need for DVD map discs and offers enhanced Bluetooth® with phonebook download and Voice command, a casual-language—based voice recognition feature. This new technology allows the driver to give more flexible, conversational commands for easier access to audio, climate, and navigation system functions. Voice command helps users avoid having to speak commands in a specific order―making tasks easier to accomplish, in fewer steps, and helping to allow drivers to focus more on the road ahead.
System functions include multiple route calculations, route preview, simplified highway junction graphics, and a dual-map screen mode. Bluetooth wireless technology allows the transfer of personal phone books to the navigation system, from which the driver can make hands-free phone calls.
(don't want you to be mis-informed or disappointed after you get your new car home...)
The available Hard Disc Drive (HDD) Lexus Navigation System eliminates the need for DVD map discs and offers enhanced Bluetooth® with phonebook download and Voice command, a casual-language—based voice recognition feature. This new technology allows the driver to give more flexible, conversational commands for easier access to audio, climate, and navigation system functions. Voice command helps users avoid having to speak commands in a specific order―making tasks easier to accomplish, in fewer steps, and helping to allow drivers to focus more on the road ahead.
System functions include multiple route calculations, route preview, simplified highway junction graphics, and a dual-map screen mode. Bluetooth wireless technology allows the transfer of personal phone books to the navigation system, from which the driver can make hands-free phone calls.
I'm going back to the Lexus dealer today to do more homework. If I have to, I'm going to ask them to let me look through an owners manual. I absolutely will know the answer before buying the car.
Thanks for taking the time to research and past the info! I'll report back what I find.
12-05-09, 05:54 AM
#12
Racer
Thread Starter
Yes you are correct but lexus can still market their system as a 5.1 surround sound. They all pretty much emulate surround sound if the source is anything but a DVD. The dvd-a is a true 5.1 but the market really isn't there yet to make it a deciding factor. I honestly couldn't see me ever using it in the near future.
12-05-09, 10:22 AM
#13
Unless the ML has changed in the 3gen I think the ML was nicer in the IS but probably due to the smaller cabin space and lay out? Its nice for a factory radio. Nicer then what I had in my Audi and BMW several years back but I don't think its better then what Acura offers in the Tech Pack. I still feel that Acura holds the Navi and Audio market still and they have for a few years. I have not been in a newer Audi, BMW, or Benz to see what they have to offer now.
By the way have they made any changes in the 2010 model or is it the same ML that was offered back in 2006 with the 3gen GS?
By the way have they made any changes in the 2010 model or is it the same ML that was offered back in 2006 with the 3gen GS?
12-05-09, 12:06 PM
#14
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not sure it's helping...
I got a 06 GS3 w/ ML
Playing CD with it is really suck...
But when it comes to play some DVD concert. the 5.1 really come out amazingly...
I guess maybe it is the way that the audio file ( CD / MP3 / DVD ) format output differently?
I got a 06 GS3 w/ ML
Playing CD with it is really suck...
But when it comes to play some DVD concert. the 5.1 really come out amazingly...
I guess maybe it is the way that the audio file ( CD / MP3 / DVD ) format output differently?
12-05-09, 01:55 PM
#15
Racer
Thread Starter
I went back to the dealer today with two friends of mine who are also car nuts (one in a 550 BMW, the other a Maserati Quatroportte). We thoroughly listened to and researched both the base & ML systems.
First, the LS for 2010 does have the ability to download to the hard drive, but the GS does not. I'm very dissapointed.
Next, we listened to both systems with discs that I had with me. The ML sounds a little better, but not night and day. Having said that, all three of us agreed that it was enough of a difference that I would get the ML. My theory is that if I'm going to spend the money to get a Lexus, then why stop short of the best stereo they have to offer.
BTW, we also went to the Acura dealer and drove a AWD w/tech. Sorry, but the Acura stereo is significantly better than even the ML system.
At this point, the Lexus dealer made me a pretty good offer on the GS350 and I'll have to make a decision in the next week or so.
Thanks for the input.
First, the LS for 2010 does have the ability to download to the hard drive, but the GS does not. I'm very dissapointed.
Next, we listened to both systems with discs that I had with me. The ML sounds a little better, but not night and day. Having said that, all three of us agreed that it was enough of a difference that I would get the ML. My theory is that if I'm going to spend the money to get a Lexus, then why stop short of the best stereo they have to offer.
BTW, we also went to the Acura dealer and drove a AWD w/tech. Sorry, but the Acura stereo is significantly better than even the ML system.
At this point, the Lexus dealer made me a pretty good offer on the GS350 and I'll have to make a decision in the next week or so.
Thanks for the input.