rumcajs997

Hi Guys,

I have got this car for just over a month and this is my first car with timing chain, so it might be normal but I just wanted to make sure as it really concers me. The car is Lexus GS300 2007/2008 with 67.000 miles on it and full Lexus service history from the very beginning.

After some research I can say that I haven`t got any 1sec rattle while cold engine start (which seems to be a popular problem) + it is definitely not only the noise of DI which can be heard but there is some rattle on top of that. When the engine is cold this rattle can be heard as well inside of the car and lasts for like 4-5km driving and after that inside is OK but still can be heard outside.

Film I have done below shows warmed up engine + cold engine accelerating (which starts at 00:50) . At the beginning of this film you can hear that DI can be heard on the left hand side and this rattle on the right hand side (it is like chain rattle + regular "rattle clicking" on top of that).


I have found some 2014 Toyota Avensis engine film with DI and timing chain which has got only 3000km on it and it sounds like it is quite rattling as well to be honest but I am more concerned by this rattle clicking that can be heard on my engine as well (here is the link to this 2014 Avensis that I found to compare - http://www.toyotaownersclub.com/foru...-engine-noise/ ).

Thanks in advance for any opinions

Sodium

Has this been going on since you bought the car, or did it start after you'd purchased it?

rumcajs997

This is the question I am not able to answer to be honest. I noticed it like 2 weeks ago so I assume it was there but I didn't notice it earlier. Otherwise the chance that something happened just after the purchase is rather slim, this car has got proven history at the end of the day.

Sodium

Ah yes I see. I read your post when I was helping someone move, and the bit about "this may be normal" must not have registered.

From the video, I can't clearly hear anything that I haven't also heard from my engine for 50,000+ miles. Of course, take that with a massive handful of salt since there's certainly a lot that you're hearing standing two feet from the engine that the mic fails to pick up, or that is lost during the video file compression and upload, or that our speakers can't properly reproduce. Haha or it's there and I can't perceive it, but another member will identify it. If you're fairly convinced that it's not normal, your best bet would be to take it to an independent Lexus shop or a dealership, and definitely do so if the sound gets louder

Of course, if you want more info on timing chain issues, the real experts are probably on the Bimmer and Audi forums

pbxcomm

I've read this sound could be a water pump beginning to fail.

rumcajs997

Obviously I will go to Lexus Dealer but before I go there, I am trying to shop around a bit, because I don`t want to be told by them that everything is spot on when it might not be spot on. What concerns me the most is this metallic clicking noise that can be heard clearly starting at 00:38 when I am filming sitting inside with door open. Then you can hear DI noise + this click - click - click. It gets clicking quicker with revs up (but I forgot to film it).

On top of that it is rather not normal to have such ratling noise during acceleration on cold engine. I can`t imagine that this is normal for a car that has got opinion of super smooth and super quiet.

According to service history and invoice that I have got with this car, water pump was replaced on December 2015.

The problem I have got is that this is my first DI car and first with timing chain, so it might be normal but since I am not sure (and there is so many problems with timing chains these days) I prefer to ask, as my previous cars were totally different technology (no DI and timing belts instead of chain) so such engine sounds different. On top of that the only V6 engine that I have heard was old Vauxhall Omega 3.0 V6 with belt and it was totally different type of engine which was in my opinion a proper petrol V6 because those new DI with chains sound more like some diesel than petrol.

SILENTM

Yes most Di engines sound like diesel so its hard to trace the sound without being there. You will have ticking sounds from the high pressure fuel pump like from the beginning of the video as stated and ticking sound from each fuel injector. I know in the states theirs been a service bulletin for valve spring replacement which can also make ticking noise and the intake cam adjusters have been known to rattle on cold starts which also has been update to reduce this noise. The timing chain is in the front so you can place a stethoscope on top to see if its coming thru the front cover
I would check your oil level and for piece of mind get it changed so you know its the correct viscosity in there

pbxcomm

If I recall a few of your previous posts indicated you had a CYL #5 miss and is re-occuring.. The noise you recorded sounds as if its coming from the CYL #5 location. That said, the noise could be a bad Injector, they have been known to produce strange sounds when they go bad. Have you checked or swapped coils as I had asked previously? A coil could also be leaking to ground..

pbxcomm

Also, it sounds to me as the motor is running on five CYLs, one CYL dropped out.

pbxcomm

You would benefit greatly from a compression check at this point, prior to taking the vehicle to a dealership or shop.

RayN

Check your engine oil. That sounds is like when you are low on the engine oil.

pbxcomm

One other note:
If in the event a CYL has not been firing for extended periods or not firing at all, the piston rings can stick causing the skirt of the piston to strike the CYL wall as you may be hearing. If rings stick to the piston, the entire piston could strike the CYL wall as well.

rumcajs997

That is true, there is some misfire on Cyl-5 as I mentioned in my other topic but it is not something massive, you can sometimes feel some small vibration when the engine is cold over night on idle (and this is as well the moment when most misfire errors occur on Cyl-5 when I checked with Techstream, like 40 misfire after 10 idle minutes) but after that it is OK. Anyway I already bought 6 new spark plugs but I just need firstly to do SeaFoam into intake before change.

Regarding engine oil, the level is perfectly on max, the colour and smell is like brand new oil. It has been regularly maintained every year and last oil change took place on December 2015 and only 6000 miles has been done since. On December over 1500£ was spent on this car according to invoice (it was 8 year service so quite big one).

Regarding this metallic click-click noise I would say it is rather from right hand top side (Cyl 6 I believe, around the battery ?). Rather than Cyl-5 area where you can hear DI clicking noise on this film.

Regarding valve spring recall - I was checking some informations about it few days ago, but is seems like GS300 is not on the list (it is starting with GS350). But it is a bit strange as I am 100% sure that they used the same springs in GS300 like in GS350, those engines are rather the same apart from the size.

BTW. You said to check the compression ratio prior taking it to the dealer, is it possible to check it on my own ? Like using Techstream or something ?

pbxcomm

First off and foremost..
You should not read ANY misfires on ANY CYL's. This is or could be massive, you shouldn't ignore CYL misfires as this could be indicating a much larger issue.
So please don't take offense to this,,, if your not familure with compression checks (not ratio) or how to perform them, you may consider taking your vehicle to a local shop with a reputation for working on Lexus cars or bite the bullet and run it to the dealer and have it throughly checked out.. A good mechanic will always start with the simple things and work up from there and ALWAYS request a WO (Work Order) signed,, prior to anyone as so much as looking at the vehicle.

rumcajs997

I want to believe that simple spark plugs change will sort it out, as it is about time for spark plugs in my opinion. If not and it is going to be some more complicated engine problem, then without a single doubt it will be my first and the last Lexus/Toyota car that I bought. There is a bit to many concers considering perfect service history and pretty low mileage for such type of car, I was hunting for such car for few months. Firstly the gearbox and now this. I don`t know, they are using cardboard to build cars these days or what... So many issues with Audi, VW etc. I am honestly starting to consider some old type car, like old 1.8T VW petrol or 1.9 TDI. Old, simple, 500.000km without major issues with most of the things that I can sort out myself.