flipside909

AVS is nice but the setup is not worth the extra cost for only 2 standard settings. Although I do like the option from going from NORM to SPORT setting..the difference is very negligible on a real performance scale. A better suited set of adjustable coilovers or f-sport springs mated with the f sport shocks do a better job in performance. Although not compatible with the GS460/450h...you're stuck unless you totally swap the whole suspensions for a coilover system which has greater dampening variability.

VGRS is nothing but an electronic control that artificially amplifies steering feel and works in conjunction with VDIM. The steering in the GS is vague across the board, 300, 350,450h, 430/460. It was designed for luxurious comfort...not good road feel. Variable assist power steering has been a standard feature on lexus models for a pretty long time...some tuned a little heavier than others, but a lot of factors weigh in...especially tire selections and suspension/steering design. Electric power steering units are notorious for feeling disconnected in comparison to conventional power steering units. The LS has VGRS...but it still doesn't handle any better. Like all technology, time and development will help improve it. My ISF and the LFA are prime examples of this. My IS F's steering feels great, but the steering is still not on par compared to the benchmarks in its class.

Active Stabilizer Suspension System (****) is a great system but an electronic motor to pre-torque the rear sway is nice but not worth the extra cost (approx $2-3k i forgot the exact amount). Upgraded F-Sport sways do just as good of a job if not better, for a lot less, and you don't get forced on with runflat tires and lose the use of your spare tire well:




The GS350 comes with the same tire choices from the factory as the GS460...as most GS350's are packaged with the 18" wheels. Its very seldom you find GS350's with 17s. My GS350 came stock 18" 5 spokes with the Michelin Primacy HP from the factory. I guess you can call the Primacy HP's junk compared to performance tires like the PS2 and PSS. Just because people on tire rack rated junk tires bad doesn't mean everyone feels the same way. Majority of Lexus owners...or car owners in general post their thoughts on a tire sales website.

First off no Lexus 3rd generation GS has any kind of "Active Suspension" package. So saying you have one on your 3rd gen GS is a flat out lie. The only Lexus models with a true "active" suspension package are LS models with air suspension, GX Premium and LX. These models continuously adjust suspension height according to load balance and speed. The LS has a 2 standard dampening (Norm/Sport) and also a HIGH HEIGHT (which raises the car). The LS' dampening works like AVS in the GS, but is all controlled by air pressure in the bag not mechanical shock valve dampening.

**** (Active Stabilizer Suspension System, not to be confused with an "active suspension package") was available for 450h/460 but in very limited quantities. Yes the GS350 comes with a standard non adjustable suspension. The GS350 did have an option for ADAPTIVE VARIABLE SUSPENSION (again AVS..not to be confused with a real "Active Suspension System", starting in 2008). As for standard handling, the GS handles equal to the GS460's AVS NORM setting. The power steering on all Lexus vehicles are variable assist...it just has no VGRS to artificially amplify the feel. I have driven every configuration of 3rd gen GS from GS300 AWD all the way to GS460 with ****. They have their subtle differences but they are all the same...uninspiring to drive. I thought hard about buying my GS 350 late in 2007 and waiting for an 08 GS 460 instead. But in all practicality, I didn't find the extra $11k (my car stickered just under 52k) for mediocre engine performance, lesser gas mileage and a few odds and ends that came standard on the 460 worth the money. The GS 450h in comparison is faster than the GS 460...especially off the line. The first 3 short gears in the GS 460's 8 speed auto hamper its performance. Initial acceleration in the GS 460 is really slow. Blame that on the 342hp.


This MT test comparison a few years ago summed it up best on the GS460. Vague:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JUDSZIih3D0

flipside909

M5 and 997 are tuned performance cars...they are not even in the same category of comparison. Maybe compare a comparable 545/550 with the GS460. The 5 series is more fun to drive than the GS460.

LexFather

You know I had a bunch of responses written but I realized I'm repeating the same **** over and over and quite frankly I'm a little tired of correcting misinformation.

Gonna just wait for the car to debut, hear more complaining and hear more complaining.

I am going to say for goodness sakes, the GS 430 debuted with 300hp, not 295 and again until recently the 3GS sold 3rd best in class after the 5/E.

Utterly frustrating to re-read the same things over and over.

rominl

iTrader: (4)

sorry mike but i will also remind it's a distant 3rd

regarding driving, well, i guess it all depends on what each individual is looking for. when i had the ls460l, every time i got into the STOCK gs350 and i told myself damn this thing is fun to drive. however now having the m3, and driven a lot of higher performance cars, driving my MODDED gs350 doesn't excite me one bit anymore. sorry but it's just a form of transportation for me now.

in fact, just the other day i had to take my wife and baby in the gs350, and i was commenting to my wife how the steering wheel is not as precise as a lot of other cars i have driven, loose, and pointing everywhere.

however, i never purchased the gs350 with "fun to drive" in my mind anyway, that would have been a very stupid mistake. i got the gs350 for his overall balance on driving conditions. smoother than most other rides, a little bit of sportiness, and good navigation / sound system.

factory system wise, avs and vgrs imho are more about marketing than real performance gain. they are both marginal changes. apsss is awesome stuff (again, all driving conditions considered) and probably the only handling option i have no problem paying for. but still, after driving other factory performance vehicles, my conclusion is that the root of driving dynamics can't change with mods. no matter what i do to the gs350 (or 460), i can't make it into a 550i sport, or m5, for that matter.

that's pretty much where i set my expectation on fun to drive vs sensible buys. i am sure the next guy will be different.

*Batman*

Pointing this out doesn't change the validity of the message. 5 hp is epsilon. If you want to point out such small mistakes, why not also correct punctuation errors.

flipside909

Well said.

If the whole platform doesn't drive great as a whole (and everyones standards are different), no amount of electronic gadgets, mods and imaginary active suspension packages are going to truly fix the car's flaws. Period.

Lexuslvr91

Has anyone seen this chop?

Mr. Burns

Nice chop but fail on the door handles.

LexFather

Henry, my point is not to say the 3GS sold close to the E/5 but to say stop bringing up the years it sold bad and not pointing out when it sold well and not stating it has been 3rd best selling in class the majority of the time since 1998. Those facts not stated means a lot of information is not being presented. We both know the GS nor any other sedan will sell as well as the 5/E in this class. The M37/56 is brand new and has sold like crap and I've yet to read one article or review or anything stating "what a damn flop". However people are harping over and over on the 3GS when sales went down the tubes in 08-10 while skipping 06/07.

As for driving dynamics your post is on point and I am also fine with my car, I know where its opportunities lie and I still bought it. The fact of the matter is for all the fapping about sport this and that the VAST MAJORITY OF THIS CLASS are non-sport sold cars, not V-8 cars and not AMG etc models. They are base cars driven to work, the mall and driven leisurely.



Its not valid. Its your opinion. There is a lot of things missing in your rants and some things are not accurate. Its fine to hold them as your opinion but it is far from fact/valid.

Sorry but its hard to take an opinion serious and see as anything other than a good "Rant(s at this point as this is now being said over and over in now different forums and threads here) when something as simple as the original HP rating is wrong.

rominl

iTrader: (4)

i don't mind seeing a gs type wagon. though i am not sure about the market

LexFather

THat is fantastic!

rominl

iTrader: (4)

we are definitely on the same page. we all bought the car for the reasons we each justified, and while i disagree with some others, i do respect their opinions. everything is a matter of perspective the gs is above a lot of cars, but there are also a lot of cars on top of the gs.

ABC

wow, the GS wagon is NICE! Although a new one would likely be out of my price range, i would not mind waiting 3ish years for a good used one off lease

*Batman*

It's hard to take someone seriously when they are so focused on the tiny details that they can't see the big picture.

Your views have no explanation of why the share of the GS V8 collapsed when the previous GS400/430 sold quite well.

jre002

I think your expectations may be unrealistic. I mean what is it that you want from your GS? You can say that you feel that it is uninspiring, but maybe you are expecting Porsche 911-like handling from a luxury sedan.

I feel like a broken record here, but there must be some option that changes the steering feel on certain models. The steering on my 2006 feels sportier than my 2010. Then again, the 2010 is still fun to drive with the extra power.