4GS mega thread (UPDATED; preview drives, specs, more interior pics)
07-11-11, 03:07 PM
#2417
At this point I'm more interested to know if the new GS hybrid can beat the M35h in terms of power and fuel economy, as the M35h has surpassed the GS450h in both areas, particularly fuel economy, where M35h eclipses the GS450h by 26%. The GS450h does still beat the M35h in official 0-60mph acceleration times though. If the 21% fuel economy jump we've seen from the rumored new Camry Hybrid specs is true and the new GS hybrid can switch to Li-ion batteries like the M35h (and the Prius alpha and the Prius Plug-in), I think it is possible for the new GS hybrid to beat the M35h; otherwise let's hope it at least beats it in trunk space.
M35h has poor trunk, like Sonata Hybrid... both also seem to be slower than HSD hybrids, so this usage of AT transmission is definitively hurting performance.
i wonder whats the real mpg for M35h, nobody is posting anything yet... GS450h was not optimized for new EPA tests, just like Camry, so many people do better than EPA in both Camry and GS. Heck, in all tests Camry gets as good or even better mpg than Fusion Hybrid for instance that should be 20% better.
07-11-11, 03:17 PM
#2418
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M35h has poor trunk, like Sonata Hybrid... both also seem to be slower than HSD hybrids, so this usage of AT transmission is definitively hurting performance.
i wonder whats the real mpg for M35h, nobody is posting anything yet... GS450h was not optimized for new EPA tests, just like Camry, so many people do better than EPA in both Camry and GS. Heck, in all tests Camry gets as good or even better mpg than Fusion Hybrid for instance that should be 20% better.
Last edited by ydooby; 07-11-11 at 03:31 PM.
07-11-11, 03:58 PM
#2419
Either that, or a Li-ion battery can store more energy with the same weight so that the car has better chance of running the electric motors longer and harder, thereby helping mpg.Agreed. There's a definite advantage in always being on the optimal RPMs and not losing time shifting with e-CVT.Right, but the fact the V6 in the GS450h is not on Atkinson cycle also hurts its fuel economy quite a bit, so I expect the new GS hybrid to do better just by switching to an Atkinson cycle engine.
As to the performance, i wonder if it is because system is simply not as integrated. PSD in HSD is power split device,not real CVT... it allows for smooth integration of different powertrains. Generally CVT cars are not any faster than other transmissions.
07-11-11, 05:07 PM
#2421
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As to the performance, i wonder if it is because system is simply not as integrated. PSD in HSD is power split device,not real CVT... it allows for smooth integration of different powertrains. Generally CVT cars are not any faster than other transmissions.
Last edited by ydooby; 07-11-11 at 05:11 PM.
07-11-11, 05:10 PM
#2422
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but will never happen 
07-11-11, 05:23 PM
#2423
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http://www.insideline.com/lexus/lf-x...exus-lf-x.html
07-11-11, 05:35 PM
#2424
True that.Theorically CVT should be faster, but I can't find consistent performance stats on cars that have equipped both AT and CVT throughout its model cycle (e.g. the last-gen Maxima) to support that theory. If being always on the power band and not having to shift are not enough reasons why Toyoat's HSD is faster, then maybe it's because HSD's PSD doesn't have a torque converter that sacks away power like the conventional AT does.
new AT's dont have problems with sapping power since they lock-up torque convertor...
Hybrid Sonata at 9.2s 0-60 is pretty slow with 209hp, compared to Camry Hybrid with 187hp and 8.3s...
I just read on chinese site that new Camry will be a little bit lighter so thats great for performance... even if it is 30kg like new Yaris.
07-11-11, 06:32 PM
#2425
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They still haven't figured out the right formula for GS from the start. Gen 1 GS was cool but it had an awkward rear end...and a weak engine. They made noise with 2nd Generation because they offered the 1UZ-FE V8 with 300hp. Bringing on a VVT-i version of the same engine was okay but really wasn't the reason why many desired a GS. Unfortunately with 2nd Gen, they dragged their feet 8 yrs too long. With 3rd Gen...they screwed up the engine choices and carried over an old engine (the 3UZ-FE 4.3L V8).
My expectations are not unrealistic because Lexus took a step backward in their focus with 3rd generation as the midsize "sports sedan" performer. 2nd Gen GS400 when it was introduced in 97 as a 1998 model was exciting...and desirable. For 3rd Gen, L-Finesse was more important than anything on the whole car. I bought my GS 350 because I wanted something bigger than the 04 IS300 I had traded it in for. But after owning the GS 350 after 15 months and modding it in just 5 months of ownership, it left me looking for more. The 3rd gen GS is probably one of the best looking GS to date, but again looks are subjective...not everyone will agree. In reality, the 3rd gen GS has a pretty weak trunk capacity and crappy opening (I can fit more in my IS F), not so great leg room in the rear, and so-so seating comfort in the front. Blame that on the poorly designed, short seatback height and non-adjustable seat cushion for those with longer legs.
Lets hope 4th generation improves on this.
All my references were to GS 350 RWD. AWD versions are a very small percentage of GS 350 sales nationwide anyway.
Last edited by flipside909; 07-11-11 at 06:36 PM.
07-11-11, 07:53 PM
#2426
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my opinion is that it is due to the fact they are not integrated as well... electric motor is like an addon in that system.
new AT's dont have problems with sapping power since they lock-up torque convertor...
Hybrid Sonata at 9.2s 0-60 is pretty slow with 209hp, compared to Camry Hybrid with 187hp and 8.3s...
I just read on chinese site that new Camry will be a little bit lighter so thats great for performance... even if it is 30kg like new Yaris.
new AT's dont have problems with sapping power since they lock-up torque convertor...
Hybrid Sonata at 9.2s 0-60 is pretty slow with 209hp, compared to Camry Hybrid with 187hp and 8.3s...
I just read on chinese site that new Camry will be a little bit lighter so thats great for performance... even if it is 30kg like new Yaris.
07-11-11, 08:16 PM
#2427
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I honestly think the 2nd Gen GS had better steering feel than the 3rd generation (even with the L-Tuned steering ECU...which later became a standard for 430 models). Even the steering wheel was thicker in diameter than the current GS. The materials in the 2nd Gen GS felt a lot more substantial than 3rd Gen. Dash rattle, trim rattle, windshield and back glass clicking...those are 3rd Gen GS attributes...that's unheard of in the 2nd gen.
They still haven't figured out the right formula for GS from the start. Gen 1 GS was cool but it had an awkward rear end...and a weak engine. They made noise with 2nd Generation because they offered the 1UZ-FE V8 with 300hp. Bringing on a VVT-i version of the same engine was okay but really wasn't the reason why many desired a GS. Unfortunately with 2nd Gen, they dragged their feet 8 yrs too long. With 3rd Gen...they screwed up the engine choices and carried over an old engine (the 3UZ-FE 4.3L V8).
My expectations are not unrealistic because Lexus took a step backward in their focus with 3rd generation as the midsize "sports sedan" performer. 2nd Gen GS400 when it was introduced in 97 as a 1998 model was exciting...and desirable. For 3rd Gen, L-Finesse was more important than anything on the whole car. I bought my GS 350 because I wanted something bigger than the 04 IS300 I had traded it in for. But after owning the GS 350 after 15 months and modding it in just 5 months of ownership, it left me looking for more. The 3rd gen GS is probably one of the best looking GS to date, but again looks are subjective...not everyone will agree. In reality, the 3rd gen GS has a pretty weak trunk capacity and crappy opening (I can fit more in my IS F), not so great leg room in the rear, and so-so seating comfort in the front. Blame that on the poorly designed, short seatback height and non-adjustable seat cushion for those with longer legs.
Lets hope 4th generation improves on this.
They still haven't figured out the right formula for GS from the start. Gen 1 GS was cool but it had an awkward rear end...and a weak engine. They made noise with 2nd Generation because they offered the 1UZ-FE V8 with 300hp. Bringing on a VVT-i version of the same engine was okay but really wasn't the reason why many desired a GS. Unfortunately with 2nd Gen, they dragged their feet 8 yrs too long. With 3rd Gen...they screwed up the engine choices and carried over an old engine (the 3UZ-FE 4.3L V8).
My expectations are not unrealistic because Lexus took a step backward in their focus with 3rd generation as the midsize "sports sedan" performer. 2nd Gen GS400 when it was introduced in 97 as a 1998 model was exciting...and desirable. For 3rd Gen, L-Finesse was more important than anything on the whole car. I bought my GS 350 because I wanted something bigger than the 04 IS300 I had traded it in for. But after owning the GS 350 after 15 months and modding it in just 5 months of ownership, it left me looking for more. The 3rd gen GS is probably one of the best looking GS to date, but again looks are subjective...not everyone will agree. In reality, the 3rd gen GS has a pretty weak trunk capacity and crappy opening (I can fit more in my IS F), not so great leg room in the rear, and so-so seating comfort in the front. Blame that on the poorly designed, short seatback height and non-adjustable seat cushion for those with longer legs.
Lets hope 4th generation improves on this.
07-11-11, 10:50 PM
#2428
