4GS mega thread (UPDATED; preview drives, specs, more interior pics)
12-06-10, 11:04 PM
#1142
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I would start a thread titled "Acura's are the greatest cars ever made" if the 4GS was around 3500lbs.
That is how confident I am that it won't happen. No way in hell. Every flipping car gets bigger and gains weight. Most cars in its class are all 4,000lbs plus today.
It would cost some serious dough to make the car lose weight and consumers for these cars don't give a squat about weight. Now they do care somewhat on performance/MPG which gets better with lighter weight. However marketing/advertising "hey we are the lightest vehicle" in the luxury sport market ain't gonna sell cars.
The IS F is over 3700lbs and its way smaller.
That is how confident I am that it won't happen. No way in hell. Every flipping car gets bigger and gains weight. Most cars in its class are all 4,000lbs plus today.
It would cost some serious dough to make the car lose weight and consumers for these cars don't give a squat about weight. Now they do care somewhat on performance/MPG which gets better with lighter weight. However marketing/advertising "hey we are the lightest vehicle" in the luxury sport market ain't gonna sell cars.
The IS F is over 3700lbs and its way smaller.
The 3,500 weight is just what I read from the article. So don't shot the messenger.
12-07-10, 04:53 AM
#1143
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an electric GS with no trunk space. 
12-07-10, 06:08 AM
#1144
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New A6 is saving weight. And rumors are next XF will do same with aluminum structure.
One interesting tid-bit though. The 2011 BMW 5 uses less aluminum than the previous model (one factor which contributed to increased weight). BMW said that the M division complained that the excessive use of aluminum in the E60 posed too limiting performance constraints, and lobbied for more steel and a more rigid structure in the F10.
One interesting tid-bit though. The 2011 BMW 5 uses less aluminum than the previous model (one factor which contributed to increased weight). BMW said that the M division complained that the excessive use of aluminum in the E60 posed too limiting performance constraints, and lobbied for more steel and a more rigid structure in the F10.
The A8 has always used aluminum and its never been light. From my understanding the 5 is based on the 7 series for one reason, to cut costs. Sadly when a smaller car is based on a larger car it always will weigh more and the new 5 weighs a lot compared to the last model. The last model was more expensive to produce.
Looking at sales, people don't care about the weight at all, it simply isn't a buying factor.
Well, we do know that Lexus plans to use a lot of Carbon Fiber parts on the GS-F, and if the base msrp of $85k holds true, than it makes sense for the car to be light, due to the high volume of CF parts.
The 3,500 weight is just what I read from the article. So don't shot the messenger.
The 3,500 weight is just what I read from the article. So don't shot the messenger.
I just don't see it happening. CF is also very expensive to replace if something happens and I don't think its ready for mass production. A 3500lbs GS F would literally be potentially 800-1000 lbs lighter than the future M5.
12-07-10, 06:30 AM
#1145
I agree that weight isn't a buying factor, but fuel efficiency and cornering ability are.
I think you can solve the cornering ability issue on heavy cars with good suspension and the right tires - Porsche Panamera weighs 4000lbs and manages 0.96g. Maybe that's the way to go.
My gut feeling is that the rattles and chassis flex that plague the 3GS are direct consequences of Lexus' unhealthy obsession of weight. I'd rather have a heavier car that feels solid like a German car, then a light car that feels like it is built out of cardboard.
I think you can solve the cornering ability issue on heavy cars with good suspension and the right tires - Porsche Panamera weighs 4000lbs and manages 0.96g. Maybe that's the way to go.
My gut feeling is that the rattles and chassis flex that plague the 3GS are direct consequences of Lexus' unhealthy obsession of weight. I'd rather have a heavier car that feels solid like a German car, then a light car that feels like it is built out of cardboard.
12-07-10, 07:32 AM
#1146
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I agree that weight isn't a buying factor, but fuel efficiency and cornering ability are.
I think you can solve the cornering ability issue on heavy cars with good suspension and the right tires - Porsche Panamera weighs 4000lbs and manages 0.96g. Maybe that's the way to go.
My gut feeling is that the rattles and chassis flex that plague the 3GS are direct consequences of Lexus' unhealthy obsession of weight. I'd rather have a heavier car that feels solid like a German car, then a light car that feels like it is built out of cardboard.
I think you can solve the cornering ability issue on heavy cars with good suspension and the right tires - Porsche Panamera weighs 4000lbs and manages 0.96g. Maybe that's the way to go.
My gut feeling is that the rattles and chassis flex that plague the 3GS are direct consequences of Lexus' unhealthy obsession of weight. I'd rather have a heavier car that feels solid like a German car, then a light car that feels like it is built out of cardboard.
Crap you got me thinking about that car now
12-07-10, 10:20 AM
#1148
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and what's the price? i'm guessing $150k since the roadster is over $100k.tesla does not impress me whatsoever!
12-07-10, 10:56 AM
#1149
The Roadster is $100k+ because the body is carbon fiber, with a aluminum+carbon-fiber chassis (just like the LFA).
Tesla may not impress everyone, but they are making one Hell of a splash in the automotive community, especially since the Model S is their first-time mass-produced sedan.
12-07-10, 11:01 AM
#1150
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I truly would be more interested in an ES, IS, GS 300 or 300h. Afterall, the base models of midsize luxury vehicles were always in the low 200 HP range and now we're venturing north of 300. High gas prices should be a reality check, but not something that prevents one from having a comfortable, luxury vehicle.
12-07-10, 07:09 PM
#1151
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With the GS-F being 3,500 lbs, thats 1k lighter than an M5. This makes sense to have the car be that light. IF the 464 HP rumor is true, then what's there to worry about?
The GS-F will be 22% lighter than the M5 (assuming it weighs 4,500 lbs), and if the M5's 578 HP is true, then it will just have 20% more power than the GS-F. Both cars should be about equal. The M5 does have 530 lbs of torque and a 0-60 in 4.4 seconds.
I don't know how much torque the GS-F will have, but if it gets enough to manage a 0-60 in 4.4 or less, than I'm sure that everyone will start taking Lexus more seriously.
I truly believe that the GS-F will be a strong contender against the M5, and I can't wait to see some actual specs and the design of the car.
12-07-10, 09:03 PM
#1152
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12-07-10, 09:25 PM
#1153
Exactly! The 550i currently weighs around 4,400 lbs, the M5 is definitely going to weigh over 4,500 lbs.
With the GS-F being 3,500 lbs, thats 1k lighter than an M5. This makes sense to have the car be that light. IF the 464 HP rumor is true, then what's there to worry about?
The GS-F will be 22% lighter than the M5 (assuming it weighs 4,500 lbs), and if the M5's 578 HP is true, then it will just have 20% more power than the GS-F. Both cars should be about equal. The M5 does have 530 lbs of torque and a 0-60 in 4.4 seconds.
I don't know how much torque the GS-F will have, but if it gets enough to manage a 0-60 in 4.4 or less, than I'm sure that everyone will start taking Lexus more seriously.
I truly believe that the GS-F will be a strong contender against the M5, and I can't wait to see some actual specs and the design of the car.
With the GS-F being 3,500 lbs, thats 1k lighter than an M5. This makes sense to have the car be that light. IF the 464 HP rumor is true, then what's there to worry about?
The GS-F will be 22% lighter than the M5 (assuming it weighs 4,500 lbs), and if the M5's 578 HP is true, then it will just have 20% more power than the GS-F. Both cars should be about equal. The M5 does have 530 lbs of torque and a 0-60 in 4.4 seconds.
I don't know how much torque the GS-F will have, but if it gets enough to manage a 0-60 in 4.4 or less, than I'm sure that everyone will start taking Lexus more seriously.
I truly believe that the GS-F will be a strong contender against the M5, and I can't wait to see some actual specs and the design of the car.
i really don't mind seeing this coming from lexus, i mean it. but at the same time realistically i don't see this happening. all the hopes can be up, but given the current gs at 3700lb, and 4gs likely heavier, i don't see how gsf will come back down to 3500lb, with the same kind of safety features, amenities, insulation, etc...
and don't take 0-60 that seriously, when it comes to cars with this kind of power, 0-60 becomes more pointless
12-07-10, 09:34 PM
#1154
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Exactly! The 550i currently weighs around 4,400 lbs, the M5 is definitely going to weigh over 4,500 lbs.
With the GS-F being 3,500 lbs, thats 1k lighter than an M5. This makes sense to have the car be that light. IF the 464 HP rumor is true, then what's there to worry about?
The GS-F will be 22% lighter than the M5 (assuming it weighs 4,500 lbs), and if the M5's 578 HP is true, then it will just have 20% more power than the GS-F. Both cars should be about equal. The M5 does have 530 lbs of torque and a 0-60 in 4.4 seconds.
I don't know how much torque the GS-F will have, but if it gets enough to manage a 0-60 in 4.4 or less, than I'm sure that everyone will start taking Lexus more seriously.
I truly believe that the GS-F will be a strong contender against the M5, and I can't wait to see some actual specs and the design of the car.
With the GS-F being 3,500 lbs, thats 1k lighter than an M5. This makes sense to have the car be that light. IF the 464 HP rumor is true, then what's there to worry about?
The GS-F will be 22% lighter than the M5 (assuming it weighs 4,500 lbs), and if the M5's 578 HP is true, then it will just have 20% more power than the GS-F. Both cars should be about equal. The M5 does have 530 lbs of torque and a 0-60 in 4.4 seconds.
I don't know how much torque the GS-F will have, but if it gets enough to manage a 0-60 in 4.4 or less, than I'm sure that everyone will start taking Lexus more seriously.
I truly believe that the GS-F will be a strong contender against the M5, and I can't wait to see some actual specs and the design of the car.
Might be a custom A1.
12-07-10, 10:03 PM
#1155
Lexus Champion
How much does the Camry weigh? Around 3200lbs. if I'm not mistaken, and that car isn't 'loud' nor does it 'ride rough'. Sound deadening materials are what take up a lot of weight. I heard the next GS is supposed to be smaller in terms of dimensions but roomier. I don't think it's impossible. Space saving, and lighter weight materials can be used. Look at the CT and the HS. Maybe the F version will be the lightweight champ, and the other GS versions will be around the same weight they are now. I don't see how it'll be hard to reduce weight by 100lbs. Chassis stiffness can be solved in a few ways, it doesn't have to be weakened because of weight loss. The IS-F wasn't it's own project, if the GS-F is, than we could see this happen. Remember the IS-F was the idea of a few people, not the whole Lexus group. If the GS-F is a 'group' effort and a 'works' project, it could very well be a big deal.