4th Generation GS Reviews Thread
04-09-13, 09:07 AM
#482
Lead Lap
Thread Starter
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Think about Lexus for a second. Odds are your gray matter is busy regurgitating images of the company's middle-aged RX crossover or possibly the midsize ES sedan. As the volume movers for Toyota's luxury fleet, the 2 are the default ambassadors for everything with an italicized L pinned to the grille, and that's a damned shame. As the 2013 GS450h is so willing to point out, Lexus engineers are busily crafting models that offer drivers more than a safe luxury choice.
As the master of fuel-sipping battery propulsion, Lexus has brought the impressive width of Toyota hybrid engineering to bear on the GS450h. The result is a vehicle that manages to sneak its hybridness by you with buttery acceleration, stone quiet operation and brakes that don't feel like you're trying walk around the house in Velcro socks. The drivetrain doesn't feel the need to beat you over the head with its battery pack or announce to the neighborhood that you're saving the world 1 whispery mile at a time. Both driver and passengers get to enjoy a luxury car that just so happens to be a hybrid instead of the other way around.
There's no denying just how striking the GS has become outside. For all the ridicule Lexus endured for its new Predator-maw corporate look, the design snatches eyeballs quicker than a cross Master Pai Mei. Up front, the nose manages to look fresh without straying into garishness, though Lexus designers are walking a fine line here. While the LED daytime running lamps are a bit derivative, we love the complex and sculpted lower valance. Like other hardware in the Lexus toolbox, the GS gives you plenty to look at head on.
Shift to the machine's side, and the GS offers a familiar profile. Attractive forked-spoke 18-inch wheels do a smart job of filling the fender wells, and the contoured lower sill adds a little bit of drama to an otherwise safe broadside. Look closely and you can see 1 of the few hybrid badges tucked just below the rear door and ahead of the back wheel. We can cope with advertising on this scale, especially in a segment that's been known to employ gaudy vinyl graphics on more than 1 occasion.
Around back, the 2013 GS450h boasts a set of aggressive LED taillamps joined by a tasteful chrome strip. The lights join a gently arched trunk deck that gives the sedan's tail some personality, and the hidden exhaust outlet goes a long way toward cleaning up the machine's derrière. Miraculously, Lexus managed to resist the temptation to slap another hybrid badge on the trunk lid, a feat worthy of copious applause.
Step indoors, and the big cruiser reveals a strikingly handsome cabin, thanks in no small part to a slathering of matte bamboo wood trim. The carpentry finds its way onto the door panels, the dash, the steering wheel and center console to offer up a sharp contrast from the black and white hides found elsewhere inside. Throw in a few brushed aluminum accents and the 2013 GS450h easily bests comparably appointed BMW cabins. What's more, the GS delivers an impressive amount of space, with rear passengers enjoying a bit more leg room than those getting hauled about in a 5 Series. The big Lexus also bests the BMW in front legroom, as well.
But if the GS shines anywhere inside, it's on the tech front. Lexus continues to eschew a traditional touchscreen infotainment interface in favor of its Remote Touch center console-mounted mouse and button system, and while the gadgetry takes a bit of time to use confidently, we found the system to be considerably less distracting than trying to reach halfway across the cabin to mash a screen with your finger. The gear also allows Lexus to employ a massive 12.3-inch LCD that can house plenty of information about climate control, navigation and audio settings.
More importantly, the cabin still retains simple buttons and dials that make adjusting the vehicle's systems simple and intuitive. In an era when so many manufacturers are keen to jump on touch capacitive and touchscreen-only interfaces, Lexus deserves an award for showing some restraint.
By and large, the cabin is gimmick free, though the gauge cluster does have 1 trick up its sleeve. When the driver switches between the various drive modes in the GS450h, the tachometer switches suits accordingly. You can take a look at the tech in action in the Short Cut below.
Pop the hood and you'll find an Atkinson-cycle 3.5-liter V6 paired with a water-cooled electric motor. The 2 can propel the GS independently or as a team with a total system output of 338 horsepower. Alone, the direct-injected engine can crank out 286 hp at 6,000 rpm and 254 pound-feet of torque at 4,600 rpm while sucking down the required premium fuel. The 650-volt electric motor, meanwhile, is good for a maximum of 200 hp. Technically, there's a 2nd 650-volt motor on board to handle duties ranging from controlling engine speed and starting the gas engine as well as generating power for the 6.5 amp-hour nickel-metal hydride batteries, but that motor doesn't spin the rear wheels or play a role in the regenerative braking process.
Power from both the engine and the electric drive motor gets funneled to the back tires courtesy of an electronically controlled continuously variable transmission, and while that's typically a recipe for driving death, the GS450h actually manages to keep the transmission from raining on everyone's parade. Thanks to a little electronic wizardry, the driver can choose between a total of 5 drive modes, including Snow, Eco, Normal, Sport S and Sport S+. There's technically an EV mode, too, though given the laughably short range under electron-only power, it's more for sneaking up on unsuspecting friends in the grocery store parking lot than saving fuel.
Eco mode smoothes out throttle inputs, mutes seat heating and dampens climate control output in an attempt to get the absolute best fuel economy possible. Technically, the Environmental Protection Agency says the 2013 GS450h should be good for 29 miles per gallon in the city and 34 mpg on the highway. We didn't spend too much time in Eco mode, and saw around 30 mpg in combined driving. Let's just take a moment to focus on that number. That's 30 mpg with our notoriously frisky right foot in a vehicle that tips the scales at 4,190 pounds and can scoot to 60 miles per hour in 5.6 seconds. Numbers like that can bring a tear to a grown man's eye.
And it's not as if the GS is a straight-line pointer. True, Eco and Normal drive modes offer up the kind of driving dynamics typically associated with Oldsmobiles of days gone by, but drop the car into Sport S mode, and the big barge cleans up nicely. Throttle mapping and transmission logic grow a bit more energetic, and Sport S+ mode sharpens up the steering and suspension damping in ways that shouldn't be possible. The transformation isn't so much Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde as it is Betty White and Optimus Prime. This jam shouldn't be possible.
Sport S+ offers fairly communicative steering, and paired with the sedan's excellent brakes, you get something bordering on a sport sedan the size of a small Kansas county. While we're accustomed to regenerative brakes that are more binary than progressive, the GS450h slowed in a nice, easy and predictable manner every time we kissed the pedal. Other automakers would do well to replicate the system.
Of course, Lexus is plenty proud of what it has created here. The GS450h starts at $59,450, but our tester came loaded with $11,040 in options. That put our final figure at $71,385, including an $895 destination fee. If that number's not big enough for you, keep in mind a similar stack of cash will land you in hardware like a Mercedes-Benz CLS, or even a well-appointed, drop-dead sexy Audi A7. Those machines are more stylish, offer a better driving experience and a more attractive cabin. Odds are we don't have to tell you where our hardly earned dollar bills would go if we were we handing over a stack of 70,000 of them, fuel economy be damned.
Cool your jets with the option sheet, however, and the 2013 Lexus GS450h is an impressive all-around package, managing to provide a nice slice of driving enjoyment while also delivering excellent technology, attractive aesthetics and plenty of room for everyone onboard. If this is the new face of Lexus and the shape of hybrid propulsion moving forward, we like what we see.
Last edited by GS69; 04-09-13 at 09:12 AM.
04-09-13, 09:26 AM
#483
Think about Lexus for a second. Odds are your gray matter is busy regurgitating images of the company's middle-aged RX crossover or possibly the midsize ES sedan. As the volume movers for Toyota's luxury fleet, the 2 are the default ambassadors for everything with an italicized L pinned to the grille, and that's a damned shame. As the 2013 GS450h is so willing to point out, Lexus engineers are busily crafting models that offer drivers more than a safe luxury choice.
As the master of fuel-sipping battery propulsion, Lexus has brought the impressive width of Toyota hybrid engineering to bear on the GS450h. The result is a vehicle that manages to sneak its hybridness by you with buttery acceleration, stone quiet operation and brakes that don't feel like you're trying walk around the house in Velcro socks. The drivetrain doesn't feel the need to beat you over the head with its battery pack or announce to the neighborhood that you're saving the world 1 whispery mile at a time. Both driver and passengers get to enjoy a luxury car that just so happens to be a hybrid instead of the other way around.
There's no denying just how striking the GS has become outside. For all the ridicule Lexus endured for its new Predator-maw corporate look, the design snatches eyeballs quicker than a cross Master Pai Mei. Up front, the nose manages to look fresh without straying into garishness, though Lexus designers are walking a fine line here. While the LED daytime running lamps are a bit derivative, we love the complex and sculpted lower valance. Like other hardware in the Lexus toolbox, the GS gives you plenty to look at head on.
Shift to the machine's side, and the GS offers a familiar profile. Attractive forked-spoke 18-inch wheels do a smart job of filling the fender wells, and the contoured lower sill adds a little bit of drama to an otherwise safe broadside. Look closely and you can see 1 of the few hybrid badges tucked just below the rear door and ahead of the back wheel. We can cope with advertising on this scale, especially in a segment that's been known to employ gaudy vinyl graphics on more than 1 occasion.
Around back, the 2013 GS450h boasts a set of aggressive LED taillamps joined by a tasteful chrome strip. The lights join a gently arched trunk deck that gives the sedan's tail some personality, and the hidden exhaust outlet goes a long way toward cleaning up the machine's derrière. Miraculously, Lexus managed to resist the temptation to slap another hybrid badge on the trunk lid, a feat worthy of copious applause.
Step indoors, and the big cruiser reveals a strikingly handsome cabin, thanks in no small part to a slathering of matte bamboo wood trim. The carpentry finds its way onto the door panels, the dash, the steering wheel and center console to offer up a sharp contrast from the black and white hides found elsewhere inside. Throw in a few brushed aluminum accents and the 2013 GS450h easily bests comparably appointed BMW cabins. What's more, the GS delivers an impressive amount of space, with rear passengers enjoying a bit more leg room than those getting hauled about in a 5 Series. The big Lexus also bests the BMW in front legroom, as well.
But if the GS shines anywhere inside, it's on the tech front. Lexus continues to eschew a traditional touchscreen infotainment interface in favor of its Remote Touch center console-mounted mouse and button system, and while the gadgetry takes a bit of time to use confidently, we found the system to be considerably less distracting than trying to reach halfway across the cabin to mash a screen with your finger. The gear also allows Lexus to employ a massive 12.3-inch LCD that can house plenty of information about climate control, navigation and audio settings.
More importantly, the cabin still retains simple buttons and dials that make adjusting the vehicle's systems simple and intuitive. In an era when so many manufacturers are keen to jump on touch capacitive and touchscreen-only interfaces, Lexus deserves an award for showing some restraint.
By and large, the cabin is gimmick free, though the gauge cluster does have 1 trick up its sleeve. When the driver switches between the various drive modes in the GS450h, the tachometer switches suits accordingly. You can take a look at the tech in action in the Short Cut below.
Pop the hood and you'll find an Atkinson-cycle 3.5-liter V6 paired with a water-cooled electric motor. The 2 can propel the GS independently or as a team with a total system output of 338 horsepower. Alone, the direct-injected engine can crank out 286 hp at 6,000 rpm and 254 pound-feet of torque at 4,600 rpm while sucking down the required premium fuel. The 650-volt electric motor, meanwhile, is good for a maximum of 200 hp. Technically, there's a 2nd 650-volt motor on board to handle duties ranging from controlling engine speed and starting the gas engine as well as generating power for the 6.5 amp-hour nickel-metal hydride batteries, but that motor doesn't spin the rear wheels or play a role in the regenerative braking process.
Power from both the engine and the electric drive motor gets funneled to the back tires courtesy of an electronically controlled continuously variable transmission, and while that's typically a recipe for driving death, the GS450h actually manages to keep the transmission from raining on everyone's parade. Thanks to a little electronic wizardry, the driver can choose between a total of 5 drive modes, including Snow, Eco, Normal, Sport S and Sport S+. There's technically an EV mode, too, though given the laughably short range under electron-only power, it's more for sneaking up on unsuspecting friends in the grocery store parking lot than saving fuel.
Eco mode smoothes out throttle inputs, mutes seat heating and dampens climate control output in an attempt to get the absolute best fuel economy possible. Technically, the Environmental Protection Agency says the 2013 GS450h should be good for 29 miles per gallon in the city and 34 mpg on the highway. We didn't spend too much time in Eco mode, and saw around 30 mpg in combined driving. Let's just take a moment to focus on that number. That's 30 mpg with our notoriously frisky right foot in a vehicle that tips the scales at 4,190 pounds and can scoot to 60 miles per hour in 5.6 seconds. Numbers like that can bring a tear to a grown man's eye.
And it's not as if the GS is a straight-line pointer. True, Eco and Normal drive modes offer up the kind of driving dynamics typically associated with Oldsmobiles of days gone by, but drop the car into Sport S mode, and the big barge cleans up nicely. Throttle mapping and transmission logic grow a bit more energetic, and Sport S+ mode sharpens up the steering and suspension damping in ways that shouldn't be possible. The transformation isn't so much Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde as it is Betty White and Optimus Prime. This jam shouldn't be possible.
Sport S+ offers fairly communicative steering, and paired with the sedan's excellent brakes, you get something bordering on a sport sedan the size of a small Kansas county. While we're accustomed to regenerative brakes that are more binary than progressive, the GS450h slowed in a nice, easy and predictable manner every time we kissed the pedal. Other automakers would do well to replicate the system.
Of course, Lexus is plenty proud of what it has created here. The GS450h starts at $59,450, but our tester came loaded with $11,040 in options. That put our final figure at $71,385, including an $895 destination fee. If that number's not big enough for you, keep in mind a similar stack of cash will land you in hardware like a Mercedes-Benz CLS, or even a well-appointed, drop-dead sexy Audi A7. Those machines are more stylish, offer a better driving experience and a more attractive cabin. Odds are we don't have to tell you where our hardly earned dollar bills would go if we were we handing over a stack of 70,000 of them, fuel economy be damned.
Cool your jets with the option sheet, however, and the 2013 Lexus GS450h is an impressive all-around package, managing to provide a nice slice of driving enjoyment while also delivering excellent technology, attractive aesthetics and plenty of room for everyone onboard. If this is the new face of Lexus and the shape of hybrid propulsion moving forward, we like what we see.
04-09-13, 09:52 AM
#484
04-09-13, 10:03 AM
#486
Suggest you widen your search to surrounding states (esp. Southeast.) I think you'll be surprised at the discounting. I've seen these hybrids sitting on the lot displaying dealer prices right at invoice and that's BEFORE any horsetrading goes on. Also, check the Costco pricing program around your area and compare it to other regions of the country (generally doable to get Costco pricing over the phone.) YMMV of course. Please post what you find if you get into this. Good luck.
04-09-13, 10:14 AM
#487
Suggest you widen your search to surrounding states (esp. Southeast.) I think you'll be surprised at the discounting. I've seen these hybrids sitting on the lot displaying dealer prices right at invoice and that's BEFORE any horsetrading goes on. Also, check the Costco pricing program around your area and compare it to other regions of the country (generally doable to get Costco pricing over the phone.) YMMV of course. Please post what you find if you get into this. Good luck.
The '14's are getting closer so there will be or maybe there is bigger discounting now but not in Dec when I got my GS.My dealer didn't have any and I was told no discounting on a GSh.I'm sure if they had one in stock they would take off at least $500.However,no 1.9% financing.
RWD is probably why there are a few in my area.No RWD GS350 are allotted to my area.
Last edited by Joeb427; 04-09-13 at 10:19 AM.
04-09-13, 10:37 AM
#488
Guest
Posts: n/a
There just isnt' a huge market for this car, the Infiniti M35h 5 hybrid, E hybrid all sell very poorly which makes Acura's decision to sell another 70k hybrid when the RLX long name awd comes just dumb. The Panamera hybrid doesn't sell great either.
The fact is there isn't much of a market for expensive hybrids, even if they are great cars like the GS 450h.
http://www.hybridcars.com/march-2013-dashboard/
Last month
58 M hybrids sold
56 GS 450h sold
51 5 series hybrid sold
25 E class hybrid sold
11 Porsche Panamera hybrid sold
Not sure why anyone chased Lexus into this market to be honest....there are no buyers.... And this is coming from the previous GS 450h owner. I think the current model offers a true "Best of Both World", MPG/Sport but we didn't have interest in the bamboo interior and wanted an F-sport (which is offered everywhere but here).
The fact is there isn't much of a market for expensive hybrids, even if they are great cars like the GS 450h.
http://www.hybridcars.com/march-2013-dashboard/
Last month
58 M hybrids sold
56 GS 450h sold
51 5 series hybrid sold
25 E class hybrid sold
11 Porsche Panamera hybrid sold
Not sure why anyone chased Lexus into this market to be honest....there are no buyers.... And this is coming from the previous GS 450h owner. I think the current model offers a true "Best of Both World", MPG/Sport but we didn't have interest in the bamboo interior and wanted an F-sport (which is offered everywhere but here).
Last edited by LexFather; 04-09-13 at 11:27 AM.
04-09-13, 11:12 AM
#489
I suppose what I find most curious about this discussion is the regionalism implied. Who cares what your local dealers are charging or what their stock consists of? If you want something they don't have for a price they won't agree to, find it elsewhere. You can do the whole deal over the phone and by email, at cost savings of somewhere around $5,000. Then, get on a plane, have the dealer pick you up at the airport, sign all the paperwork, and enjoy a nice leisurely drive back to your home in your new car. Your dealer is obligated to treat your vehicle the same as one purchased from him/her as far as scheduled maintenance, warranty repairs, etc. Even if the dealer is somewhat miffed and doesn't offer you free diagnostics or personal settings when you wish, $5,000 covers an awful lot of "freebies," no?
04-09-13, 11:39 AM
#490
I guess I'm missing something here. I bought my GS450h around the same time you bought your GS350. Mine had a dealer price tag just a hair above invoice. With $1,500 dealer loyalty incentive (could also have used Conquest i.e. competitive brand incentive), deal was for well under invoice. I DID have to sign up for LFS ripoff rate of 3.9%, but I refi'd that to 1.9% at a local credit union within a few days. My subsequent purchase of an LS460 showed me how the Costco buying program can produce even bigger savings with no hassle pre-agreed pricing.
I suppose what I find most curious about this discussion is the regionalism implied. Who cares what your local dealers are charging or what their stock consists of? If you want something they don't have for a price they won't agree to, find it elsewhere. You can do the whole deal over the phone and by email, at cost savings of somewhere around $5,000. Then, get on a plane, have the dealer pick you up at the airport, sign all the paperwork, and enjoy a nice leisurely drive back to your home in your new car. Your dealer is obligated to treat your vehicle the same as one purchased from him/her as far as scheduled maintenance, warranty repairs, etc. Even if the dealer is somewhat miffed and doesn't offer you free diagnostics or personal settings when you wish, $5,000 covers an awful lot of "freebies," no?
I suppose what I find most curious about this discussion is the regionalism implied. Who cares what your local dealers are charging or what their stock consists of? If you want something they don't have for a price they won't agree to, find it elsewhere. You can do the whole deal over the phone and by email, at cost savings of somewhere around $5,000. Then, get on a plane, have the dealer pick you up at the airport, sign all the paperwork, and enjoy a nice leisurely drive back to your home in your new car. Your dealer is obligated to treat your vehicle the same as one purchased from him/her as far as scheduled maintenance, warranty repairs, etc. Even if the dealer is somewhat miffed and doesn't offer you free diagnostics or personal settings when you wish, $5,000 covers an awful lot of "freebies," no?
If I were I would have looked on Autotrader or Cars.com and do a deal out of state over the phone to save that $5K.I'm not new to buying out of state.I bought a new ES w/UL pkg in VA and new IS 350 in MA.
All I can say is in a casual mention of a GSh at my dealer,I was told none in stock,not many around and no discount or incentives if they get one from another dealer on have one coming in..
04-09-13, 12:15 PM
#491
Then why not say so in your comment on the reveiw?
Then why comment that no discounting/incentives are available on the GS450h with NO regional qualification? Other readers, like me if I did not know better, could reasonably take your comment as applying all over the country as Lexus policy or something.
Once again, you did not mention this was a casual, inconsequential comment by your dealer. The impression you left is that discounts and incentives on GS450h models are not generally available. This is not accurate. You should own up to your error and try to give proper context for future comments.
...I would ... do a deal out of state over the phone to save that $5K.I'm not new to buying out of state.
...All I can say is in a casual mention of a GSh at my dealer,I was told none in stock,not many around and no discount or incentives if they get one from another dealer on have one coming in..
04-09-13, 12:22 PM
#492
Then why not say so in your comment on the reveiw?
Then why comment that no discounting/incentives are available on the GS450h with NO regional qualification? Other readers, like me if I did not know better, could reasonably take your comment as applying all over the country as Lexus policy or something.
Once again, you did not mention this was a casual, inconsequential comment by your dealer. The impression you left is that discounts and incentives on GS450h models are not generally available. This is not accurate. You should own up to your error and try to give proper context for future comments.
Then why comment that no discounting/incentives are available on the GS450h with NO regional qualification? Other readers, like me if I did not know better, could reasonably take your comment as applying all over the country as Lexus policy or something.
Once again, you did not mention this was a casual, inconsequential comment by your dealer. The impression you left is that discounts and incentives on GS450h models are not generally available. This is not accurate. You should own up to your error and try to give proper context for future comments.
You've got to be kidding...
People can see what state I live in and I doubt my post would stop one from shopping for a GSh if they really wanted one.
It was my experience.Just like you getting $5K off last Dec would not be the norm for a GSh purchase everywhere.
04-09-13, 02:46 PM
#495
Lexus Fanatic
