So much for predictions of the 4GS being a flop
08-03-12, 04:58 PM
#211
yes those were the good years and great economy so it's hard to compare to those numbers
i compiled some numbers before
https://www.clublexus.com/forums/7202931-post73.html
i compiled some numbers before
https://www.clublexus.com/forums/7202931-post73.html
In addition, people that buy luxury cars are usually not the people most affected by the economy. They are the business owners or executives of business, not the poor smuck who lost his job because the top level either downsized, subcontracted or moved overseas.
The E class sells well cause it looks good. The A5, A6 and A7 Audi's seem to be selling well. I see them a lot. What do they have? Good looks.
Although I loved the E60 it was not deemed attractive by many but the F10 seems to doing pretty well. I see them everywhere.
I rarely see 4GS cars. Guess what, they don't look as nice as the competitors. The spindle is starting to grow on me but it doesn't flow as well on the GS as it does on the other models imo. Plus, there are other issues for the GS like the bland, econo looking rear. The slab sided and tall looking sides. Its just not a beautiful car and sales are suffering.
08-03-12, 05:15 PM
#212
The E-Class sells well because of the enormous discounts they are giving on them. When I was shopping for another car in May of this year, the E-350 was the car I spent the most time with. I was told by my salesman that with my USAA discount and my Conquest discount I could get 10K off of MSRP on any E-350 on their lot. None of the other cars I was looking at offered that much of a discount. It was tempting, but the quality, performance, styling, and interior of the GS350 made my decision easy. The styling of the E-Series is growing long in the tooth. It's due for a major overhaul. The performance of the E-Series doesn't even compare to that of the GS350.
08-03-12, 05:28 PM
#213
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Let's not forget that the third generation GS was also introduced before the "Credit Crunch".
08-03-12, 08:04 PM
#215
The economy was not so great back then. So many people think the economic situation is new or caused by present leadership. Things were going down hill even before the war started.
In addition, people that buy luxury cars are usually not the people most affected by the economy. They are the business owners or executives of business, not the poor smuck who lost his job because the top level either downsized, subcontracted or moved overseas.
The E class sells well cause it looks good. The A5, A6 and A7 Audi's seem to be selling well. I see them a lot. What do they have? Good looks.
Although I loved the E60 it was not deemed attractive by many but the F10 seems to doing pretty well. I see them everywhere.
I rarely see 4GS cars. Guess what, they don't look as nice as the competitors. The spindle is starting to grow on me but it doesn't flow as well on the GS as it does on the other models imo. Plus, there are other issues for the GS like the bland, econo looking rear. The slab sided and tall looking sides. Its just not a beautiful car and sales are suffering.
In addition, people that buy luxury cars are usually not the people most affected by the economy. They are the business owners or executives of business, not the poor smuck who lost his job because the top level either downsized, subcontracted or moved overseas.
The E class sells well cause it looks good. The A5, A6 and A7 Audi's seem to be selling well. I see them a lot. What do they have? Good looks.
Although I loved the E60 it was not deemed attractive by many but the F10 seems to doing pretty well. I see them everywhere.
I rarely see 4GS cars. Guess what, they don't look as nice as the competitors. The spindle is starting to grow on me but it doesn't flow as well on the GS as it does on the other models imo. Plus, there are other issues for the GS like the bland, econo looking rear. The slab sided and tall looking sides. Its just not a beautiful car and sales are suffering.
And as for the E-Class, evidently Mercedes doesn't think it looks so great because it is on the verge of a major overhaul, and those who bought them will be driving the "overly decorated" models with the pontoon fenders...
http://www.automobilemag.com/new_and..._cycle_update/
08-04-12, 08:08 AM
#216
Now for the other side, just to remind everyone I am a Lexus fan all the way.
I do like the pics I have seen of some modded 4GS a lot better. Especially the one with the Wald kit. A nice front lip can bring symmetry to the chaotic front. Side and rear pieces can add style to the blandness of stock. Lowering the car can reduce the height of the taller roof.
I do like the car more than I did.
Problem is enthusiasts make up a small part of the buying public. Most people are not going to make the changes to make this car design flow better. Stock, its just not as attractive as the other choices. I just don't see it ever becoming a success.
Instead of having a problem with me you guys who love it should be disappointed in Lexus for not putting more thought into this car. Maybe they don't think its important enough. I happen to think every model is important.
I want the car to do well. I want Lexus to do well. Looks like they are bringing more coupes in the future. If they do, it will make up for all the not-so-greats......I hope.
I do like the pics I have seen of some modded 4GS a lot better. Especially the one with the Wald kit. A nice front lip can bring symmetry to the chaotic front. Side and rear pieces can add style to the blandness of stock. Lowering the car can reduce the height of the taller roof.
I do like the car more than I did.
Problem is enthusiasts make up a small part of the buying public. Most people are not going to make the changes to make this car design flow better. Stock, its just not as attractive as the other choices. I just don't see it ever becoming a success.
Instead of having a problem with me you guys who love it should be disappointed in Lexus for not putting more thought into this car. Maybe they don't think its important enough. I happen to think every model is important.
I want the car to do well. I want Lexus to do well. Looks like they are bringing more coupes in the future. If they do, it will make up for all the not-so-greats......I hope.
08-04-12, 02:31 PM
#218
OMG, I just sore the new LS.
I am shocked!
The new LS says everything about the new GS.
The new LS and GS styling speaks for itself.
Unfortunately, Lexus is certainly an inconsistent company when it comes to styling.
And the styling has a major effect on the sales.
Also, very few people will buy the 4GS in F Sport down the track, and even fewer will buy the LS in F Sport.
Watch the sales dwindle.
OMG.
Remember in 2005, 33,457 3GS were sold, and in 2007, 35,226 4LS were sold.
It seems that neither the 4GS nor the 5LS will match the sales of their predecessors.
We'll have to wait another generation before the 5GS and 6LS will re-instate the sales.
The styling is the biggest culprit.
Sad...
I am shocked!
The new LS says everything about the new GS.
The new LS and GS styling speaks for itself.
Unfortunately, Lexus is certainly an inconsistent company when it comes to styling.
And the styling has a major effect on the sales.
Also, very few people will buy the 4GS in F Sport down the track, and even fewer will buy the LS in F Sport.
Watch the sales dwindle.
OMG.
Remember in 2005, 33,457 3GS were sold, and in 2007, 35,226 4LS were sold.
It seems that neither the 4GS nor the 5LS will match the sales of their predecessors.
We'll have to wait another generation before the 5GS and 6LS will re-instate the sales.
The styling is the biggest culprit.
Sad...
Last edited by peteharvey; 08-04-12 at 02:39 PM.
08-04-12, 06:35 PM
#219
It's really comforting to know that the Lexus Fans like the styling of the new 4GS and 5LS, and that Lexus Fans like sporty variants of the cars.
However, we must always remember the mass public prefer conventional luxury cars, and it is the mass public who determine whether the the 4GS and 5LS will be a success or not, which is what this thread is all about.
The fans can prefer unpopular designs to the mass public, however what's important is that Lexus sells in sufficient/satisfactory numbers, to make enough profit to remain viable.
In other words, Lexus needs to keep in mind that they must sell in sufficient numbers, to amass enough profit, to pour back into Research and Development; because without sufficient funding, the future developments will be duds, eg only a 6 speed auto tranny, which a Camry takes for granted...
However, we must always remember the mass public prefer conventional luxury cars, and it is the mass public who determine whether the the 4GS and 5LS will be a success or not, which is what this thread is all about.
The fans can prefer unpopular designs to the mass public, however what's important is that Lexus sells in sufficient/satisfactory numbers, to make enough profit to remain viable.
In other words, Lexus needs to keep in mind that they must sell in sufficient numbers, to amass enough profit, to pour back into Research and Development; because without sufficient funding, the future developments will be duds, eg only a 6 speed auto tranny, which a Camry takes for granted...
08-05-12, 11:16 AM
#220
Lexus Champion
^^^
Great points and all
EXCEPT......that this is NOT a 5LS. The recently facelifted LS is still part of the 4th generation (model code is still USF4x/XF40). It's a major facelift BUT NOT AN ALL NEW MODEL.
Consider it like a 4.5LS or a 4.75LS. Something like that.....but yeah it's obviously NOT a full model change.....but a facelift 'albeit' a major one.
Anyways
It's interesting.
Now that I see both the 4GS F-sport and this facelifted LS F-sport, I'm now wondering which is a better car overall. Both are fantastic though but it's hard to see a clear-winner imho.
Obviously for the LS, you have V8 engine standard and dimensions are bigger but the 4th gen GS has an all-new body. In another aspect, the GS has heads-up display while some people are telling me that this new LS facelift does not yet have HUD (that would probably require an all-new model for that).
Nevertheless, even with its numerous strong points and probably a few shortcomings, I would have to say that Lexus has squeezed the most of what they can from the 4th gen LS when making this 'major facelift'. Lexus has added as much new features and amenities and some minor improvements (like the engine power increase). They did even in the face of the truth that Lexus is working as much as they can on a current/existing platform.
Now
As for styling/aesthetics, this may be subjective........but imho (btw, I'm not a Lexus/Toyota fan..........fact is, I'm a general car lover that supports any brand), both new 4GS and facelifted LS are winners in the styling department. There is no clear winner for me in this aspect.
Point here: I know that the Germans (5-series, E-class) will be the sales kings in this segment. However, as long as the Lexus GS can hold on its own, then that's good enough for me.
And looking it that way, it's also a strong point to be unique. I mean, in a sea of 5-series and E-class units, your 4th generation GS will stand out indeed.
Just saying
Great points and all
EXCEPT......that this is NOT a 5LS. The recently facelifted LS is still part of the 4th generation (model code is still USF4x/XF40). It's a major facelift BUT NOT AN ALL NEW MODEL.
Consider it like a 4.5LS or a 4.75LS. Something like that.....but yeah it's obviously NOT a full model change.....but a facelift 'albeit' a major one.
Anyways
It's interesting.
Now that I see both the 4GS F-sport and this facelifted LS F-sport, I'm now wondering which is a better car overall. Both are fantastic though but it's hard to see a clear-winner imho.
Obviously for the LS, you have V8 engine standard and dimensions are bigger but the 4th gen GS has an all-new body. In another aspect, the GS has heads-up display while some people are telling me that this new LS facelift does not yet have HUD (that would probably require an all-new model for that).
Nevertheless, even with its numerous strong points and probably a few shortcomings, I would have to say that Lexus has squeezed the most of what they can from the 4th gen LS when making this 'major facelift'. Lexus has added as much new features and amenities and some minor improvements (like the engine power increase). They did even in the face of the truth that Lexus is working as much as they can on a current/existing platform.
Now
As for styling/aesthetics, this may be subjective........but imho (btw, I'm not a Lexus/Toyota fan..........fact is, I'm a general car lover that supports any brand), both new 4GS and facelifted LS are winners in the styling department. There is no clear winner for me in this aspect.
Point here: I know that the Germans (5-series, E-class) will be the sales kings in this segment. However, as long as the Lexus GS can hold on its own, then that's good enough for me.
And looking it that way, it's also a strong point to be unique. I mean, in a sea of 5-series and E-class units, your 4th generation GS will stand out indeed.
Just saying
08-05-12, 03:18 PM
#221
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It's really comforting to know that the Lexus Fans like the styling of the new 4GS and 5LS, and that Lexus Fans like sporty variants of the cars.
However, we must always remember the mass public prefer conventional luxury cars, and it is the mass public who determine whether the the 4GS and 5LS will be a success or not, which is what this thread is all about.
However, we must always remember the mass public prefer conventional luxury cars, and it is the mass public who determine whether the the 4GS and 5LS will be a success or not, which is what this thread is all about.
Now my daughters like the Acura.
08-05-12, 05:52 PM
#223
Seems to make sense that Lexus is offering both conventional luxury and sportier (F-Sport) versions in not only the GS and LS but also the RX. One would think that will attract more buyers. My wife has had many ES sedans, but although nice cars, I preferred my Acura over her Lexus. However, the GS F-Sport changed that for me which is why I invested in my first Lexus.
Now my daughters like the Acura.
Now my daughters like the Acura.
08-05-12, 07:14 PM
#224
The GS F Sport is a polarizing design, with some saying it looks weird or plain (depending on the view) and some loving it. All I know is, I get lots of looks in mine, and many are from BMW 5 Series drivers. I don't see any looks of disgust, so that's okay, and even if they're thinking "WTF" at least it stands out in a "sea of sameness".
I really hope Lexus introduces the SC Coupe replacement, and I hope it follows the current GS/LS interior design. Lexus created a timeless design with the SC300/400, and if they do it again my deposit will be at the dealership the minute it becomes available!
I really hope Lexus introduces the SC Coupe replacement, and I hope it follows the current GS/LS interior design. Lexus created a timeless design with the SC300/400, and if they do it again my deposit will be at the dealership the minute it becomes available!
08-06-12, 12:06 AM
#225
^^^
Great points and all
EXCEPT......that this is NOT a 5LS. The recently facelifted LS is still part of the 4th generation (model code is still USF4x/XF40). It's a major facelift BUT NOT AN ALL NEW MODEL.
Consider it like a 4.5LS or a 4.75LS. Something like that.....but yeah it's obviously NOT a full model change.....but a facelift 'albeit' a major one.
Anyways....
Great points and all
EXCEPT......that this is NOT a 5LS. The recently facelifted LS is still part of the 4th generation (model code is still USF4x/XF40). It's a major facelift BUT NOT AN ALL NEW MODEL.
Consider it like a 4.5LS or a 4.75LS. Something like that.....but yeah it's obviously NOT a full model change.....but a facelift 'albeit' a major one.
Anyways....
The current 4LS was released in 2007.
That means it is only 5 years old, from usually a 7 year model cycle.
So, it is indeed only a 4.5 or 4.75LS.
I was wondering why the back of it looked so similar to the current model...