natnut

Hi JOELC,

what are the features your E60 has that the GS F-Sport is lacking? Lexusenthusiast.com has a website that allows Lexus fans to post their feedback directly to Andrew Kirby, general manager of Lexus global product & marketing planning in Japan. He reads the feedback posted on this website. Here's what it says :
You should post the advantages the your E60 has that the GS F-Sport lacks. Who knows, Lexus may take your feedback and incorporate your suggestions into the next facelift of the 4GS.

Here's the link :
http://lexusenthusiast.com/2012/06/0...-andrew-kirby/

Vasili

2000 Dodge Neon.

Awesome car...





...not really.

JOELC

Hey Thanks! I just posted my ideas. Here is what I said FYI:

BMW vs LEXUS GS350F


I feel it is great Mr. Kirby is reaching out to the consumers for more rubber on the road insights. I hope the Lexus Brass also take time to view the online reviews for more info on how to improve for the future.


Coming from a BMW 550I I had massive buyers remorse once I bought the new GS350F. It took a while and some customization to subside that feeling. Placing all the interior and exterior comparisons aside, the two major areas I feel the Lexus 4GS is inferior to the BMW are the seats and the torque.

1. The first sense of feeling your body and soul is exposed to when you get into any car is the seat. The BMW "Comfort Seats" are the best in the industry. Hands down the side bolsters and the degree of tilt up, down and through the upper back available in the BMW Comfort Seat package is far superior to the Lexus seats. For example, I had to attach a back head rest to my new Lexus because of the uncomfortable angle of the head rest that cannot be adjusted. This along with the inability to move the upper back panel separately creates uncomfortable to no neck support. All around the degree of angle available in the Lexus seats are extremely limited in every way compared to the limitless angle you can achieve from the BMW Comfort Seats. I would suggest Lexus to study the BMW Comfort Seats for their line up. This could be a big draw for consumers in the future.

2. The BMW is known as the "Ultimate Driving Machine." Lexus is known for reliability and luxury. I sold the BMW for its unreliability. I do not miss that aspect. I do miss the power however. I feel the new GS350F is very comparable in handling to the BMW 5 series. Lexus did quite a good job this time around with limiting body roll, one reason I sold my Lexus GS 300 some years ago. However, for Lexus to truly compete with BMW sport sedan customers they must study the HP to Torque ratio. Torque is the other component that hands down sells the car to the sport sedan consumer. The BMW is an even 300 HP to 300 Foot Pounds of Torque which enables a driver to feel the G force of the car once you hammer the pedal. From 0-60 or hitting the pedal on the highway at 65 for that get away feeling, Torque is what separates the men from the boys. Unfortunately the Lexus set up is 300 HP to 278 Foot Pound of Torque, so your "get up and go" off the line is mediocre at best and so is your "G force" acceleration at high speeds.

If I had my wish the next GS350F would have these two additions. It would make all the difference to so many sport sedan driving enthusiasts out there.

Thanks for your consideration and your time!

Rexus300

iTrader: (1)

To respond to Joelc as a previous owner of the latest BMW 535i with 1 year ownership and 15k miles.


1. I have to first have to agree that the BMW toque curve is better then Lexus and feels more of a nice push back feel from stop but he had a 545 and it was lighter than my ovedbloated luxobarge BMW 5. The BMW 535i suffered from turbo lag. So the Lexus does feel faster on highways then my BMW. However more torque at lower speed is needed badly. The MPG on the Lexus is lower a bit then the BMW 5 with the efficient dynamics. The Lexus accelerates alot more smoother but have more engine noise which is good.

2. As for the seats, I have always hated BMW seats even the comfort ones. TOO MUCH stiffness in lumbar area and a bit firm. The headrest on my BMW was like rock and seats felt cheap and rattled too much. Lexus wins on complete comfort for me with good firmness and support as i am 5"10 and late 20s. The rear legroom is more spacious then the 5.

Lexus wins here because the Lexus fsport steering is much more precise with great body composure on turns compared to the new 5 which was numb and the brakes are more responsive and quicker. The ride is more planted yet supple with excellent road feel with the Michelins with no annoying runflats or choppy ride like the BMW. The interior quality trumps the BMW and the styling is more exciting and shaper. The GS has more soul feel then the newer BMW 535.

Overall the new Lexus GS F-sport is a far better car then the latest 2011/2012 BMW 5. I want Lexus to put more torque into the new updated GS engines and do not be afraid to give their cars more power and please for god sake get the new 7 or 8 speed transmission to help improve gas mileage. And also get a bigger gas tank! 17.5 gallons is pathetic! Our Audi A8L has 26 gallon tank and the highway MPG is 28 mpg! We can get more than 450 miles on a tank and I cannot get more than 320 on the GS city driving.

Outrage

The GS Luxury trim level has more seat adjustments and different headrests than the Base and F Sport models. Additionally, the GS 350 is equipped with real leather seats. BMW charges the customer $1,000 if they want to move from the standard vinyl seats to leather.

The Lexus GS 350 RWD weighs 3,795 pounds. The BMW 535i RWD weighs 4,090 pounds. 300 pounds is not an insignificant weight difference. That discrepancy eats away much of the power difference and contributes adversely to braking and handling performance. What's I find fascinating is that the GS 450h, which includes an electric motor and an associated battery pack, manages to weigh 4,190 pounds. That's fairly close to the BMW 535i. Additionally, the GS 450h's supplemental electric motor should contribute to higher levels of torque at all RPM ranges.

LexPaul

This is indeed a big deal. BMW owners trading up their cars for the GS. I have to give BMW their props, it's a fantastic car. How many domestic companies could do this?. Lexus engineering is finally showing through, no longer held back by the 'conservative-wing' of Lexus, they are taking more chances, and I think we have Mr. Toyoda to thank for this, because before him, Lexus had almost no chance of getting BMW owners to switch up.

Dharp65

The S5 was hot!

ECL

I was waiting to take and post these pictures until I had time to wash the SC400, my DD for the past eighteen years. It came off the production line in December, 1993, and I purchased it new in February, 1994. This car has been virtually trouble free. Over the past eighteen years and 120,000 miles, I have replaced the brake pads (once), an alternator, one window regulator, and a bunch of batteries and tires. Even with a four liter V8, I get 23-24 MPG in town.



I loved the SC, and could not imagine a better car. Then I drove the GS-F, but was not convinced until I took it home and compared the cars side by side. Although the SC was a fantastic vehicle, there is no comparison between 20th century and 21st century technology.



For the time being, I am keeping the SC. It is the vehicle I use to carry my bike. When a hitch is available to mount a bike rack on the GS, maybe the SC will be put out to pasture.......or maybe not.

ThomasGS4

iTrader: (19)

That SC is beautiful. Let me know if you ever have plans to sell it.

Outrage

I previously owned a 2012 Ford Edge Sport in Red Candy.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/79087095@N03/7429824680/http://www.flickr.com/photos/79087095@N03/7429824680/ by http://www.flickr.com/people/79087095@N03/, on Flickr