GS vs ES?
10-13-13, 07:37 AM
#1
Pit Crew
Thread Starter
GS vs ES?
Posted this on ES forum...thought I might get different thoughts here on the GS forum??
Good Morning...first post.
I had my 2004 Land Cruiser into Lexus for service and they gave me a 2013 GS loaner...for overnight. I liked the GS quite a bit and as we are thinking of upgrading our 2008 Accord to something new I have begun looking into the GS and also the ES.
Our desire is to have a great sport/touring auto...we enjoy taking driving trips 4-6,000 mile "rides" The Accord actually is a nice driving vehicle with tight suspension and very firm European type ride. While we like the Accord we are very disappointed in the road noise...which appears to be a common complaint about the Accords. Since it now has 105K miles we are thinking of an upgrade before this winters trip.
After driving the GS my wife and I went to the dealership and drove an ES yesterday...both were 2013s. We like a lot about the ES bur I just didn't get a "great" feeling from the test drive. Hard to explain but sitting in the front seat it "felt" much larger than the GS. It actually is not that much larger than the Accord (4" length) but the feel seemed more like a Lincoln Towncar than a sport sedan...I did not get that feeling in the GS...maybe because I only drove the GS while I also rode in the ES as a passenger??
ES road reports do address that the suspension is still quite "soft" but somewhat improved? I have sometimes increased sway bar diameter to improve cornering "feel" at a modest price? Is there a practical sway bar upgrade and maybe shock upgrade for the ES?...or is it not necessary or possible. I do not want a canyon carver...just a clover leaf comfort level
ES seems to be a real value when compared directly to the GS? Probably would get different comments on the GS forum but I would guess many have either owned or looked at both.
Also, did notice the engine "noise" in the GS more than the ES...guess that is on purpose?
Thanks in advance...seems like a well attended forum...Tom
Good Morning...first post.
I had my 2004 Land Cruiser into Lexus for service and they gave me a 2013 GS loaner...for overnight. I liked the GS quite a bit and as we are thinking of upgrading our 2008 Accord to something new I have begun looking into the GS and also the ES.
Our desire is to have a great sport/touring auto...we enjoy taking driving trips 4-6,000 mile "rides" The Accord actually is a nice driving vehicle with tight suspension and very firm European type ride. While we like the Accord we are very disappointed in the road noise...which appears to be a common complaint about the Accords. Since it now has 105K miles we are thinking of an upgrade before this winters trip.
After driving the GS my wife and I went to the dealership and drove an ES yesterday...both were 2013s. We like a lot about the ES bur I just didn't get a "great" feeling from the test drive. Hard to explain but sitting in the front seat it "felt" much larger than the GS. It actually is not that much larger than the Accord (4" length) but the feel seemed more like a Lincoln Towncar than a sport sedan...I did not get that feeling in the GS...maybe because I only drove the GS while I also rode in the ES as a passenger??
ES road reports do address that the suspension is still quite "soft" but somewhat improved? I have sometimes increased sway bar diameter to improve cornering "feel" at a modest price? Is there a practical sway bar upgrade and maybe shock upgrade for the ES?...or is it not necessary or possible. I do not want a canyon carver...just a clover leaf comfort level
ES seems to be a real value when compared directly to the GS? Probably would get different comments on the GS forum but I would guess many have either owned or looked at both.
Also, did notice the engine "noise" in the GS more than the ES...guess that is on purpose?
Thanks in advance...seems like a well attended forum...Tom
10-13-13, 07:53 AM
#2
Lexus Test Driver
Honestly if u see little difference between ES and GS then get the ES and save some $$$.
99% of ppl on the forum would never consider the ES bec its FWD, poor handling, lower quality interior etc.
GS competition is 5series, Eclass, A6.
99% of ppl on the forum would never consider the ES bec its FWD, poor handling, lower quality interior etc.
GS competition is 5series, Eclass, A6.
10-13-13, 08:12 AM
#3
Pit Crew
Thread Starter
I have also looked at 5 series/A6 and E series. Curious if many 5 series or even A6 owners have traded for GS? Any "compare" articles with A6/5 series/GS with GS judged number one?....or even number 2?
Thanks
10-13-13, 08:29 AM
#4
Coming from German cars, the reliability still isn't anywhere close to the Japanese.
The ES caters to the older crowd (sorry if this offends bit I've never seen a 30-40 something buy an ES) who are generally retired or about that age. It's designed to be softer and just float along. The FWD verses rear wheel on the GS makes a large difference. Judging by your mentioning BMW and Audi, I'd venture to say the ES isn't for you. But the interior materials are second only to the LS and size is larger inside as well. The GS makes the front seem a little smaller because it doesn't have one of those large slanted windshields.
I've enjoyed mine, which is an F Sport and am very pleased with it. Firm when in sport and comfy when not.
A '13 right now would net you a good deal or get a '14 in December to remember which is the other great time of year to get in.
The ES caters to the older crowd (sorry if this offends bit I've never seen a 30-40 something buy an ES) who are generally retired or about that age. It's designed to be softer and just float along. The FWD verses rear wheel on the GS makes a large difference. Judging by your mentioning BMW and Audi, I'd venture to say the ES isn't for you. But the interior materials are second only to the LS and size is larger inside as well. The GS makes the front seem a little smaller because it doesn't have one of those large slanted windshields.
I've enjoyed mine, which is an F Sport and am very pleased with it. Firm when in sport and comfy when not.
A '13 right now would net you a good deal or get a '14 in December to remember which is the other great time of year to get in.
10-13-13, 08:45 AM
#5
Pit Crew
Thread Starter
Coming from German cars, the reliability still isn't anywhere close to the Japanese. That is also my concern...I have enjoyed over 20 years of Toyota Land Cruisers (1991/1994 and current 2004) My 1994 was 210K miles at ten years old and had nothing but maintenance performed and was still a great vehicle when I sold it. 2004 is at 140K, 10 years and I will probably keep a few more years.
The ES caters to the older crowd (sorry if this offends bit I've never seen a 30-40 something buy an ES) who are generally retired or about that age. It's designed to be softer and just float along. As they say "I resemble that remark"
I do not like a "floater" and depise Lincoln Towncars and the older Cadillacs. The FWD verses rear wheel on the GS makes a large difference. Living in Minnesota I really do not mind front wheel drive and would have to have 4 wheel drive on the GS.Judging by your mentioning BMW and Audi, I'd venture to say the ES isn't for you. While I like the 5s and A6s I am a bit too conservative to spend for that performance with higher repair costs. May be right...GS may be the right combination...if I can get price "right" at all? But the interior materials are second only to the LS and size is larger inside as well. The GS makes the front seem a little smaller because it doesn't have one of those large slanted windshields.That must be what I felt...particularly in the passenger seat.
I've enjoyed mine, which is an F Sport and am very pleased with it. Firm when in sport and comfy when not. Haven't seen an F-Sport yet...will have to take a look.
A '13 right now would net you a good deal or get a '14 in December to remember which is the other great time of year to get in.
The ES caters to the older crowd (sorry if this offends bit I've never seen a 30-40 something buy an ES) who are generally retired or about that age. It's designed to be softer and just float along. As they say "I resemble that remark"
I do not like a "floater" and depise Lincoln Towncars and the older Cadillacs. The FWD verses rear wheel on the GS makes a large difference. Living in Minnesota I really do not mind front wheel drive and would have to have 4 wheel drive on the GS.Judging by your mentioning BMW and Audi, I'd venture to say the ES isn't for you. While I like the 5s and A6s I am a bit too conservative to spend for that performance with higher repair costs. May be right...GS may be the right combination...if I can get price "right" at all? But the interior materials are second only to the LS and size is larger inside as well. The GS makes the front seem a little smaller because it doesn't have one of those large slanted windshields.That must be what I felt...particularly in the passenger seat. I've enjoyed mine, which is an F Sport and am very pleased with it. Firm when in sport and comfy when not. Haven't seen an F-Sport yet...will have to take a look.
A '13 right now would net you a good deal or get a '14 in December to remember which is the other great time of year to get in.
Thanks for the input...btw...not an easy way to "improve" ES handling just a bit with larger sway bars and improved shocks??? Just remove the "floater" sensation??
Thanks...Tom
10-13-13, 08:59 AM
#6
Pole Position
10-13-13, 09:07 AM
#7
If you can afford it, GS is the one to go. I'm not sure what es owners tell you but i would give more weights to gs owners opinion. We drive our car daily and get to drive the es as loaners. Its not the same with es owners. Imo there is no comparison. The only pluses I can think of are a bit more room and less cost.
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10-13-13, 09:35 AM
#8
Even if you do somehow end up stiffening the suspension, it's not going to change the fact that the ES is a fwd vs the GS's rwd/awd. Ive had an ES loaner before and the quality just can't compare.
10-13-13, 09:46 AM
#9
The F Sport line also is an indication of Lexus trying to diversify their design language and cater their cars to two different market sub types.
10-13-13, 10:10 AM
#11
Here are the reviews:
http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...s/viewall.html
http://www.windingroad.com/articles/...gs350-f-sport/
http://www.roadandtrack.com/car-revi...dern-warfare-1
10-13-13, 11:54 AM
#12
I owned the ESh for a year before getting my GS and there is just absolutely no comparison. The ES is a glorified Avalon while the GS can stand alone on it's merits including the interior and exterior styling. As someone else mentioned, the ES is FWD and the GS is RWD...all the difference I needed for my personal preference!
10-13-13, 01:57 PM
#13
Well I came from 2007 ES350 to the GS and I can assure you the GS is a huge difference in every way!
I want to comment on something very important here .. you mentioned you do lots of trips and your accord has over 100k .. if you are going to german cars good luck maintain that guy! I had my ES for 4 years and bought the extended warranty for 2k after I my odometer passed the 50k and it was the worst investment I have ever put in a car. The car did not ask me for one single thing during 4 years ownership a part from gas, oil, filters, one battery, and 2 sets of tires! thats it. Go with Japanese
I want to comment on something very important here .. you mentioned you do lots of trips and your accord has over 100k .. if you are going to german cars good luck maintain that guy! I had my ES for 4 years and bought the extended warranty for 2k after I my odometer passed the 50k and it was the worst investment I have ever put in a car. The car did not ask me for one single thing during 4 years ownership a part from gas, oil, filters, one battery, and 2 sets of tires! thats it. Go with Japanese
10-13-13, 02:23 PM
#14
gs is sportier, but much smaller if you compare it to es back room.
long distance trips are a lot nicer in the ES, better on gas, more room, and no large hump in the middle from the awd/rwd drive shaft.
i love my GS, but hate that theres no room if you want to take 5 people...
long distance trips are a lot nicer in the ES, better on gas, more room, and no large hump in the middle from the awd/rwd drive shaft.
i love my GS, but hate that theres no room if you want to take 5 people...