peteharvey

We can't just tap-off existing wiring from the main outer brake light LED's, and connect that tapped wire into the inner LED's so that the inner LED's also light up on braking?

jgscott

iTrader: (1)

That's what we did, and it worked.

AJLex19

Yeah - I feel like the pre-refresh tails look better illuminated at night compared to the newer ones. Each style is unique - i feel like the older ones are more luxurious while the newer ones are sportier.

The video below has the newer and older lights installed at the same time to give an idea of the key differences (wish they had show it at night as well!).

The newer tails have a solid red lamp/light below the that illuminates (but don't get brighter while pressing the brake).
The older tails have two solid red lamps below the reverse - both illuminate (but don't get brighter while pressing the brake).
The newer tails have a stock LED for the turn signals. The older tails have a standard halogen for turn signals (but can be easily upgraded to LEDs).

achip5188

So to sum this up.
inner lights lit up with brake lights - possible
inner lights lit up as bright as brake light - impossible

peteharvey

I think I understand now.
We can make the inner red lights light up under braking - however, the inner red lights will NOT light up as bright as the outer red lights under braking - is that right?

In other words, would this mean that at night, with the outer and inner red lights already on at medium intensity, pressing the brake pedal will only brighten the outer red lights, while the inner red lights will NOT get any brighter?

achip5188

.........................

peteharvey

I see.
If the inner red light was incandescent, it would be easy to change from a 5 Watt to a 20 Watt bulb.
However, it is very difficult to change the inner red LED's to higher wattage LED's, because it would require melting, soldering new more powerful LED's, and even changing drivers.

When you tap-off wiring from the outer red brake lights to the inner red park lights, did you have to put in resistors too?

achip5188

I did not use resistor. I used a diode below to keep the current flow from brake light to inner park light but not the other way around. Otherwise, at night, when your headlights come on, the brake light will be lit as well

Also, my wiring is for "all park lights lit up with brake light once tap brake" which means all park lights, including front park lights (the orange LED dot at the end of DRL strip), rear side markers and license plate lights. They are all lit up, but I bet no one notice at day time.

gsintokyo

Ah thankful for this forum, I think that’s good enough for me. I’m gonna try that and stay with the older ones, I did order the newer tails and just a resistor not the harness. I think I’ll put it up on the MP later

EAST

You should be able to put a diode on the taillight running wire as well to solve the issue of tail lights turning on with brakes. As you see, a lot of other lights key off the tail lights turn on.

You're basically making a diode OR gate, with the inner tail lights turning on either either brake OR tail light are powered. The diodes also block back feeding.

If I find a cheap set, I might crack one open later on to see how to do it properly, but it'll likely require opening the light. Ideally the diodes and any resistors would be inside the light. As it is, I know the 3rd brake lights and the overhead lights of the 4.5 GS use resistors to current limit. Not efficient but more reliable. So I wouldn't be surprised if there's just a resistor inside.

gsintokyo

Okay so correct me but the only possibilities would be these:

-Outer and inner tailight leds are running along with headlights. With headlights off once braking, the outer brighter led along with inner leds light up but not as bright and other parking lights turn on as well.

OR

-Only outer tailight leds are running with headlight on. When braking, the outer and inner taillight leds come on, not any other parking light.

also would the latter be compatible with this add on function. Would it be too much wiring at that point?

EAST

I'll start by saying wow that is an expensive brake flasher. I'm guessing it includes the OEM connectors for that price? I've used this before: (not in the GS). It allows you to select your flash rate and pattern. They also have an X1/X2 model that also have timeout (so if you're in stop and go traffic, you're not constantly flashing).

From their description, it looks like they might be using the OEM emergency flasher sequence? Maybe that's why it's so expensive? Is it that the 3rd brake light doesn't flash, only the tail light brake lights? All the wiring for the pre-facelift for stop lights should be doing through the rear luggage compartment relay box (connectors 6A and 6B). One input goes to many outputs (outer and inner tail lights and 3rd brake light). So depending how you want it, it shouldn't be too hard to put a flasher in between.

For your other question, it also depends what you want and what you're willing to do (open the lights?).

Non-modified mode:
OFF -> Outer Tails : OFF || Inner tail: OFF
Braking (lights off)-> Outer Tails: Bright || Inner Tail: OFF
Headlight/parking lights ON -> Outer Tails: Dim || Inner Tail: Dim
Braking (light on) -> Outer Tails: Bright || Inner tail: Dim

If you tap the stop light, and put a diode, and feed that into the existing inner parking light, you'll have:
OFF -> Outer Tails : OFF || Inner tail: OFF
Braking (lights off)-> Outer Tails: Bright || Inner Tail: Dim
Headlight/parking lights ON -> Outer Tails: Dim || Inner Tail: Dim
Braking (light on) -> Outer Tails: Bright || Inner tail: Dim
It also sounds like there's some backfeeding into the tail circuit, so you'd energize anything that feeds off that (plate lights, corner lights, etc). Not an issue at night because you'd already have your lights on anyways. This can be fixed by putting a diode in series with the parking light wire (so before your brake light connection)

If you unpin your parking lights, and instead feed your new brake light wire with diode in, then you could have the other scenario you mention:
OFF -> Outer Tails : OFF || Inner tail: OFF
Braking (lights off)-> Outer Tails: Bright || Inner Tail: Dim
Headlight/parking lights ON -> Outer Tails: Dim || Inner Tail: OFF
Braking (light on) -> Outer Tails: Bright || Inner tail: Dim

If you open the lights, then it could be seen what is being used to drive the LED (to see if it can be changed possibly have a parallel connection with different value resistors). You might even be able to use the rear fog pin that is likely unused. Hard to tell without having one open in front of me.

peteharvey

So basically, we must find the brake wiring to the outer red lights.
Then tap off that with a one-way diode.
Then join that tapped wire to the wire supplying the two inner red lights?
Or even split the tapped wire with diode, and send the two ends directly to the inner red LED's.

If we join the tapped wire with diode to the rear wire bundle, then when the brake is pressed, this will not only cause the inner red lights to light up, but it will also cause the rear number plate light to light up too?

Also, do you have any Amazon or Ebay links to purchase whatever gauge wiring and the appropriate diode?

EAST

Duplicate... Didn't realize it made this post.

EAST

Sorry, I think that last paragraph about backfeeding made the post confusing. Let me try again.

The one@achip5188 posted should work. Their current rating (85A) is overkill, but they look nice and sealed so should last a long time.

These should also work. These are 3A, but should be more than enough. They might even be lighter, making them easier to double-side tape to the car:

T-tap kit (I've used this one pretty successfully for wiring projects):

Spade connectors kit:

Wire going to the lights looks to be 20-22? AWG. so anything 22AWG or thicker should work. I'd say 16-18 AWG is a happy medium, especially if you want to do other wiring projects. I've had good luck with this brand (silicone wire) but any automotive wire should work:

I'm assuming you already have a wire stripper and crimper?

Either way, here are a few options, depending what y'all want to happen.
/////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
Option 1:
If you don't care that your "front park lights (the orange LED dot at the end of DRL strip), rear side markers and license plate lights" turn on while braking the minimum, then you can wire them as such. You'd technically only need one of the diodes since the tail wiring is all shared. That's why you get all the other lights also turning on when you brake. The pro is that it's less wiring you have to do, and you don't have to cut any of the factory wires.

Result:
OFF -> Outer Tails : OFF || Inner tail: OFF
Braking (headlights off)-> Outer Tails: Bright || Inner Tail: Dim || Plate lights, corner lights would illuminate. DRL might dim to "headlights on" level (but not 100% sure).
Headlight/parking lights ON -> Outer Tails: Dim || Inner Tail: Dim || Plate/corner lights illuminated
Braking (headlights on) -> Outer Tails: Bright || Inner tail: Dim || Plate/corner lights illuminated


/////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
Option 2:
If you don't mind cutting the tail light wire, then you can wire them as below, and it should stop the above behavior from happening (where activating the brakes is lighting up the plate/corner lights). You'd need one diode set for each inner tail light. You'd make the cut some distance from the OEM inner light connector. You'd take that wire and crimp some maroon female connectors so you can connect them to the diode (one to output, one to one of the inputs, as shown below).

For the Stop light wire, technically, you'd only need 1 T-tap on the stop wire, then make a Y on the wire coming from the male connector to power the "stop light input" of both diodes. If I were to be wiring this, I'd tap the right hand stop wire, then run a single wire up the right trunk door arm (along with the OEM wiring harness), then once "inside" covered part of the trunk door, I'd make the Y there.

This should end you up with the below behavior:
OFF -> Outer Tails : OFF || Inner tail: OFF
Braking (headlights off) -> Outer Tails: Bright || Inner Tail: Dim
Headlight/parking lights ON -> Outer Tails: Dim || Inner Tail: Dim
Braking (headlights on) -> Outer Tails: Bright || Inner tail: Dim


/////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
Option 3:
This is if you want to have your inner tail lights serve as weaker brake lights, and no longer serve as tail lights. You also don't have to worry about lighting up your plate/corner lights every time you brake.

OFF -> Outer Tails : OFF || Inner tail: OFF
Braking (headlights off) -> Outer Tails: Bright || Inner Tail: Dim
Headlight/parking lights ON -> Outer Tails: Dim || Inner Tail: OFF
Braking (headlights on) -> Outer Tails: Bright || Inner tail: Dim

/////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
That is about what you can do without opening them up to swap resistors/LEDs to get a brighter output.

Hopefully I didn't make it more confusing.