Cwang

I'm not saying there weren't any, as I said I'm in my 30s. I'm just yet to see a single GS driver on the road without grey hair - just my experience. Australia has a forum just like this but there's only one other bloke on there with a 4GS....most owners here are too old to use forums.

Never said there was anything wrong with that but my GS was clearly aimed at young people. My dad wanted one until he drove mine. Lexus made this generation hard and aggressive but the market was wrong.
Here the cost of an Fsport 350 is 2.5x the cost of a Camry with an identical ​3.5L engine. The market the car is aimed at is better equipped to buy the Camry. (which sells well)
Here young people buy BMW and MB, their 6 figure $ vehicles (talking AUD here sorry) don't have a similarly sized lesser cousins for sale for 1/3 of the cost with the same engine.
I love my GS but most of my colleagues thought I was driving a FWD Camry with a better interior - that's not good for sales nor image.

IMO those vehicles are aimed at older drivers with money. My pre facelift GS has hard suspension and the seats are even firmer, I can understand why older people are looking elsewhere. I believe the facelift addressed this somewhat but it was too late, with Tesla offering something new and innovative the GS has little chance.

mrminsky

My 2015 White F Sport is as attractive as any car out there today. It is still one of the most beautiful cars and it looks pretty current as anything. Just give me an extra 50 to 70 HP and update the tech. It is beyond me why a company as successful as Toyota was not able to execute these easy updates starting with the 2015/16 model when the market was already adjusting/calling to these things. We are now in 2020 and they are still selling the same car that they were selling in 2013. No wonder nobody is buying Why Toyota? Why? Answer my question!!!!!!

mikesrx350

for the same reason the ls 500 after 10 years of development is failing and still the tech is 4 years behind the germans
These large companies are struggling with identifying the market, the demographics, and the product to bring to consumers
think about the change to trucks, small and large suv, hybrids , electric , gas
the market is going thru an inflection point and add a big beaurocratic company like Toyota with a mindset for business that is not aligned with United States entrepreneurship and that's your answer why

mikedozz

Exactly - the GS is down on sales due to old tech and performance - a redesign with latest tech and hp bump should cure that like anything new, shouldn't be hard.

All4Lexus

You may get a chuckle out of this in light of GS sales numbers. They're trying to spin a positive trend for the eTron.

Audi e-tron is selling better and near-term perspectives are also positive.

https://insideevs.com/news/386544/audi-e-tron-sales-us-november-2019/

Since April, Audi delivered 4,623 e-tron.

These sales will not move the needle in the EV space. Model 3 does that sales volume in one week. It shows what an enormous advantage Tesla has over petrol vehicle companies. It is a major rethink of normal car operations -- car computer, it's electronics, sensors, and more. Too hard to be stuck in the old ways of ICE components. By these sales numbers of the eTron model, does it encourage Audi to go all in into EV's ? No way. Management are probably complaining that their research expenses are being blown off with the EV waste of time and resources in a 2nd or 3rd wave of "I told you so" denial.

The facts are obvious here -- in 2020, Tesla will approach 1 million vehicles sold globally. In 2 more years, it will likely hit the 2 million mark (based on ramp up of China Gigafactory). In 4 years, it will likely hit 5 million (based on the ramp up of the Berlin Gigafactory). If you wanted an EV that has proven itself, Tesla is becoming obvious no-brainer choice. The pre-order sales process (1-3 year lead time) may very well become the future to optimize vehicle production runs. eTron not only needs 100k+ in sales --- it also needs time to work out lingering issues, cost reduction, and vehicle safety refinements. I just dont see how Lexus could bring back a refined GS when they have given up on the vehicle since the 2015 glory days. It's potential buyers have moved on elsewhere where the cool tech factor reigns. Yes, that includes BMW, Audi, Genesis, and Stinger, and Tesla. No way can Lexus try to cook up a new GS and hope there is a market for it at more than 20k units per year. Maybe Lexus may have something exciting in the works and it's already dead on arrival due to continued tech and infotainment issues (they can build the car and posh up the interiors. tech is lexus' kryptonite)

JeffKeryk

Buying a used car does not help new car sales numbers. There is a difference.

mrminsky

I not would compare a Tesla to a GS. But the simple execution of putting a more relevant engine along with some improve mileage and simple tweaks to the tech could have been done years ago in order to keep up with the market. Having said that, I bought my 2015 (the first month of service was January 2016 probably as a leftover lease) as a CPO early this year. I knew full well this is the car is slightly underpowered. The lack of tech does not bother me as much since I like to keep things somewhat simple, however, I only paid $28K for a low mileage GS350 F-Sport. But there is nothing about my car that makes me want a brand new GS350. Nothing!. Happy with my purchase and the overall value that I got. When I took the car for service, the only product that I walked to while I waited was the LC. Unless you have the desire to buy an SUV, a preowned Lexus car is where it's at.

JDR76

The only “tech” that I wished Lexus provided in the GS is a surround view camera. I am not concerned with CarPlay (though they should provide it) as I wouldn’t use it anyway.

Agree with others that the GS could really benefit from more power, though I’m basically fine with it as is.

UDel

The GS came out in 2012 as a 2013 model, it has been out for almost 8 years, it is not unusual at all for a car that has been out so long to not sell well in its last few years unless it keeps getting big updates buyers like, buyers clearly did not like the 2016 update. The people who want one, generally have already bought one and there are enough good used ones on the market now to satisfy buyers who don't need to buy them new.

A FWD Camry/Avalon based family sedan does not replace a balanced RWD sedan even if it gets AWD. There will be a big gap in the Lexus lineup if they kill the GS especially considering the LS500 is basically a failure, they will have no real good sedan option above a entry level IS/ES.

UDel

I don't think I have ever seen a LS460 driver under 65 but I do know younger people buy them especially after seeing all the people commenting on this site. I was in the market for a LS too, again, there are not many people under 60 that can afford to buy cars like the LS new which is why you mostly see older people driving them, same with S classes and 7 series. Australia is very different from the US, different tastes, I have read they have to pay enormous prices on foreign cars or certain foreign cars which makes many of them undesirable/rare there, I don't think there are many Japanese lux car dealerships in Australia either so it is understandable GS's are rare there and mainly older people own them.

I don't find the GS aggressive or hard at all or just aimed at younger people, it is actually a lot closer to the way a LS460 rides and drives then I thought, it is just the GS is also a good handler and nimble where the LS isn't at all. Did you do anything to your F Sport to tighten up the suspension or do they give Australia a harder suspension, I just don't find even F Sports harsh to drive unless you expect a pillow soft ride like a old school lux car. Did you dad ever try a GS Luxury model, it is very comfortable, not harsh at all. The only aggressive/harsh GS is the GS-F and that is a very different animal then a GS350.

UDel

Shows that electric cars are not the way to go for mainstream sellers, they sell more on image then anything which is why Tesla can sell such a ugly car, even Audi doesn't have the image to move electrics in good numbers, neither does BMW, the i3 has been a flop, Lexus can't move hybrids, most are low selling failures, Acura or Infiniti can't move hybrids either. The last thing Lexus should do with a GS is turn it into a electric unless they want to spend a ton of money on another car that is likely just going to sell in double digit numbers at most per month.

Aznluder

I don’t think it’s hilarious at all given that I’m a typical Lexus buyer (3 and love them all). After buying my wife a Tesla Model 3, I seriously considered getting a Tesla myself. Was debating between GSF, RCF, M5, M3, and Tesla Model S. I shopped around, researched, test drove for months and was 50/50 between model S and GSF. I ended up getting GSF but there’s still a few things I like/dislike about both. Although i ultimately decided on Lexus, the Tesla was very close and I think if they make a few changes/improvements on the Model S, I would surely switch over.

i doubt Tesla’s (model s) are cutting into GS sales much though as the price points are so different. The Model 3 is closer in price so maybe they’re losing sales there? Model 3 is more like an IS to me than a GS though.

mrminsky

There is no doubt that Tesla has been a game-changer for every car manufacturer. They are all trying to catch up to them. But when you consider the premium these electrics are fetching, it leaves 99 percent of the population out of the affordability range. It is the same thing with Hybrids. The extra 20 to 30% (in some cases much much more) does not justify the amount of gas savings any owner would have in the years they might own the car. I would think that 10 years from now, electric offerings will pretty much be mainstream and perhaps accessible to everyone.

Porsche just came out with a 4 door super electric car. Who can afford $180K? Maybe this is not a good example due to being a Porsche and unaffordable, to begin with, It seems that all these companies are not making cars for the majority of the population. It will be interesting to see how the new Mustang SUV (cough!!!) does in the $50K to $60K category. Back to Lexus and the GS. A GS-F like with a six-cylinder twin-turbo with 350 HP engine should have been in place in 2016. This is why the car died 3 years ago. Better yet, why not stay ahead of the competition rather than wait to see what others are doing? However, Lexus is not even playing catch up, they are stale. Of course, Acura and Infiniti are no different. Perhaps, these who they view solely as their competition. Based on some of the pictures I have seen the new 2021 TL-X could be a strong seller for Acura.