LexusGSboy

Keep in mind if you want to drop the wheel size down you may end up running into issues with the caliper clearance if the car is an F-Sport. Don't quote me exactly on that, I just remember lots of discussions about clearances.

Also - I would totally agree with you that the ES's ride is much more forgiving but as others have mentioned, at the cost of fun and enjoyment. 13-15 F sports, as folks have mentioned, are definitely stiff. While I do notice road imperfections in my '16, they don't seem to be too bad of a trade off.

LexUhs65

Thanks again everyone - looking into a 2013 Luxury AWD with the AVS suspension tomorrow - very excited! This is a 90K car with an excellent service history through Lexus. Any input on the lifespan of the variable dampers? I'm pretty sure these are the original units and wondering if I will need to add replacements into the calculated cost at this mileage. Thanks!

peteharvey

Yes, the 2016-20 GS's are a brilliant compromize between the sportiness/harshness of the 2013-15 GS's and the blandness/softness of the 2015 ES.
2016-20 GS's still handle very well, but so much easier to live with.

Anyone who wants outright handling almost like a compact sedan and doesn't mind a harsh ride, must get GS with 2015 springs and shock absorbers.
My 2015 shock absorbers were really tied down for body control, so I had to retrofit 2013-14 shock absorbers.
However, the original December 2011 to 2012 shock absorbers may have have been even slightly softer with less body control, but I never got a chance to test drive these earlier versions.

peteharvey

Toyota shock absorbers last a long long time, and their official bulletins are NOT to replace a Toyota leaking shock absorber until the leak has dropped past the lower coil spring seat.
Forward to 00:06'15".

azipod

I came from the ES. Except for size, the GS is a better car in every way. The ES is softer than the GS, but not by much. It could be the tire or suspension setup you drove on the GS.

I do miss the ES though, sometimes I wished I had the ES as an extra car. Back in 2013, when both cars were sold in the same showroom, it's no wonder why the ES outsold the GS by a huge margin -- the ES is one heck of a deal when compared to the GS.

LexUhs65

Yes the ES is tough to beat! My 2015 was a one owner car with only 40K miles, luxury pkg as many are. It rides beautifully on the 17" wheels and looks amazing after my detail work and ceramic coat. The full size sedan market is so depressed that these are an insane value! Definitely a keeper! For the second lexus I'm thinking the GS should be a great option. It's also pretty amazing that you can look at these with higher mileage and not be totally worried about the car falling apart in a month........can't say that about many other makes in the industry! If you ever decide to pick up an extra ES there are MANY great options out there as so many people leased them!

JeffKeryk

Sounds like you are used to the ES...
When I used to take our '13 F-Sport (CPO services), I would take a different loaner home.
The ES is a beautiful FWD car. I felt like I was on a choppy lake in a houseboat in comparison.

You will love your GS.

LexusGSboy

In my book, the ES should be cheaper - it's based on the Camry/Avalon. There should be economies of scale with parts, etc... That's not to say it's not a nice car - I remember the first time I test drove one (2000 MY) it was the quietest car I had ever been in and I was amazed. For me the issue is that at it's core the ES, with it's FWD, isn't what Lexus set out to build - it's a car to fill the high volume entry slot in their line up. What would have happened if instead they had made the GS that car with some other variants? Folks from other countries have commented on here about how the GS250 was a good daily car that possibly could have filled that slot but in the US we got screwy things like the 200t. A GS250 with a lux package that softened the ride and had other touches to make it less "sporty" could have worked if it wasn't for international politics and CAFE standards. The design can be pushed to sport or lux pretty easily. It has great trunk space, the back seat is a bit tight in leg room but the new ES sucks with headroom. If you look at the newest Crown - they push it from sporty to lux and they both look great and it's right in the range with it's dimensions.

From what I've read, it's easier to get an older person into a young person's car than a young person into an older person's car - I think this was in reference to Cadillac. The ES probably isn't going anywhere but I'm not counting the mid-sides sports sedan out completely for Lexus. I don't know if they're planning to slowly move the IS up into the GS's spot and introduce something new at the small end (Toyota and Honda have both done this before) or wait a couple years and release a completely new model/name or stick with the GS name but they're just taking a break. Any way you look at it, the mid sized sport sedan is a hole in their current line up and even with it's small numbers, as others have pointed out in the forums, there are plenty of other cars out there with lower production numbers. There are too many of us that can't fit in an IS and don't want the size of an LS. We won't go German because of the reliability issues. The Koreans look interesting but are still at that early stage and don't quite have the fit/finish thing there quite yet. And the Americans....well what can I say - just when they start to do something right the board or bean counters or brilliant managers type go and do something stupid and kill the momentum.

peteharvey

Below, GRL10 is the code for GS350, while GRL11 is the code for GS250 2.5 V6.
Meanwhile ARL10 is the code for GS200t/GS300, with GRL12 as the code for 2016-20 refreshed 4.5GS350.
In other words, the GS250 and GS350 used the same suspension part numbers, ie the same spring, shock absorber and roll bars.
Meanwhile the 2016 GS200t/GS300 used the same spring, shock absorber and roll bar part numbers as the 2016 GS350.
Hence their ride/handling compromize would have been the same.
However, no need to worry because the 2016-20 refreshed GS350 like yours had a beautiful ride/handling compromize...

byungkuk

I drove a 13 ES until few months ago when I switched to my '16 GS 350 AWD Lux... I don't miss the ES even for a second. While the GS isn't as forgiving as the ES - the overall cabin feel is waaaayyy better. The GS feels so much more upscale compared to the ES. Put the car into Sport+ mode and that's an experience I cannot get from the ES ever. (But still a Lexus)

LexUhs65

Is there any reason I should be concerned about getting into a 2013 Luxury GS with 110K miles and an excellent service history? The car has been well cared for.......thoughts?

JDR76

Getting a GS is never wrong...

LexusGSboy

Except that it'll ruin you for all other cars

natnut

Have an independent workshop that you trust do a full inspection.

703

I would look for something with lower miles. Once you own it and drive it more. It would have such high mileage that no one would really want to buy it when you sell.