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The ECU engine Maps for Timing and throttle response are different in Sport mode & Sport +, in addition to the Trans shift points and redline.
While throttle response becomes much more aggressive in S/S+, I have not seen any evidence of timing advance or rev limiter increase in any mode. A timing advance should result in additional power at the risk of additional knock. Perhaps someone local to a drag strip can go to a test & tune night and make passes in Eco, Normal, and S+ to compare trap speeds. I would not expect them to be beyond a standard deviation of each other, even considering potential heat soak.
When I apply full throttle, even in Manual/S+ and T/C and VSC off, the transmission will upshift itself at about 6250rpm, which is the exact same behavior it exhibits at full throttle in Drive/Normal. I have not seen any indication of an increase in rev limiter, especially considering that the transmission will not let me reach the rev limiter in any combination of modes and settings.
The redline is at 6800 right? I wonder why it upshifts very early at 6250. Mine does the same too but sometimes it went a bit longer but never at 6800.
I've noticed different gear auto upshifts at different RPM. This is just leaving the shifter in M and floor it all the way and let the car upshifts itself but I never really go through all the gears. Basically by the end of 3rd gear or 4th I could be in jail already.
I usually drive in Eco mode just because I am commuting somewhere with speed limits of 45 or less and stop lights every half mile it seems. But when I do put it in Sport plus, the throttle response is night and day. I like having the variability options available. I think I am spoiled and would probably never go back to a normal non customized car. Though I hate to say that my next car will probably be all electric, so I think those have all those variable drive modes at least. 2025 is the plan. Maybe.
While throttle response becomes much more aggressive in S/S+, I have not seen any evidence of timing advance or rev limiter increase in any mode. A timing advance should result in additional power at the risk of additional knock. Perhaps someone local to a drag strip can go to a test & tune night and make passes in Eco, Normal, and S+ to compare trap speeds. I would not expect them to be beyond a standard deviation of each other, even considering potential heat soak.
When I apply full throttle, even in Manual/S+ and T/C and VSC off, the transmission will upshift itself at about 6250rpm, which is the exact same behavior it exhibits at full throttle in Drive/Normal. I have not seen any indication of an increase in rev limiter, especially considering that the transmission will not let me reach the rev limiter in any combination of modes and settings.
I reloaded the D3 Performance Pro Tuner Map and extracted the Stock Tune file. I confirmed with D3's Tuner. The Stock Tune in Sport and Sport + was Mapped more aggressive as I said. My Custom Tune is now also set up to work with Sport to be even more aggressive. While Normal and ECO are the same as it was Stock.
The redline is at 6800 right? I wonder why it upshifts very early at 6250. Mine does the same too but sometimes it went a bit longer but never at 6800.
I've noticed different gear auto upshifts at different RPM. This is just leaving the shifter in M and floor it all the way and let the car upshifts itself but I never really go through all the gears. Basically by the end of 3rd gear or 4th I could be in jail already.
Sport shifts and hold a longer higher rpm. ECO shifts earlier.
Redline is 6250. At least my 6sp Tach shows it at that. Without the right changes and Mods... at 6800 you will run out of engine breathing breath. You would be losing hp from 6250 to 6800.
While throttle response becomes much more aggressive in S/S+, I have not seen any evidence of timing advance or rev limiter increase in any mode. A timing advance should result in additional power at the risk of additional knock. Perhaps someone local to a drag strip can go to a test & tune night and make passes in Eco, Normal, and S+ to compare trap speeds. I would not expect them to be beyond a standard deviation of each other, even considering potential heat soak.
When I apply full throttle, even in Manual/S+ and T/C and VSC off, the transmission will upshift itself at about 6250rpm, which is the exact same behavior it exhibits at full throttle in Drive/Normal. I have not seen any indication of an increase in rev limiter, especially considering that the transmission will not let me reach the rev limiter in any combination of modes and settings.
Correct, regardless of which Drive Mode you might be in - including ECO - at WOT the engine performance (ignition timing and fuel mapping) is the same. The transmission upshift points are the same too. The car can be drag raced in ECO mode, automatic shift or manual shift and the transmission will 'automatically' upshift at the same rpm, regardless of Drive mode or transmission shifting style/selection. Putting the car in ECO Drive Mode would have no disadvantage over any other Drive Mode, including Sport or Sport+ Drive Mode in e.t. or trap speed with a WOT run from the line.
I reloaded the D3 Performance Pro Tuner Map and extracted the Stock Tune file. I confirmed with D3's Tuner. The Stock Tune in Sport and Sport + was Mapped more aggressive as I said. My Custom Tune is now also set up to work with Sport to be even more aggressive. While Normal and ECO are the same as it was Stock.
Is that full throttle or part throttle map? Advancing the timing at part throttle would be another way to improve throttle response, but I would be very surprised to learn that, at full throttle, the car is making less or more power in any mode, as receiving the full available power when demanded is actually a safety feature. See below.
Originally Posted by bclexus
Correct, regardless of which Drive Mode you might be in - including ECO - at WOT the engine performance (ignition timing and fuel mapping) is the same. The transmission upshift points are the same too. The car can be drag raced in ECO mode, automatic shift or manual shift and the transmission will 'automatically' upshift at the same rpm, regardless of Drive mode or transmission shifting style/selection. Putting the car in ECO Drive Mode would have no disadvantage over any other Drive Mode, including Sport or Sport+ Drive Mode in e.t. or trap speed with a WOT run from the line.
Is that full throttle or part throttle map? Advancing the timing at part throttle would be another way to improve throttle response, but I would be very surprised to learn that, at full throttle, the car is making less or more power in any mode, as receiving the full available power when demanded is actually a safety feature. See below.
I'm not sure? When I talk to Dennis at D3 again I will ask him to look at the tables. But then again I did Not say or specify part or full, some how the spin on this point started.
Even from Lexus see Page 11 about More about "Alters the Gear Changes, and more Dynamic Throttle Mapping"
I have a few friends here with GS350's but no equal year or Mods to run and test against. I can't do mine because my Sport mode now turns the Tune on or off. Would be interesting to do. Again I said it does change Not that it's not the same on full throttle. The links with rpm and gears Do not indicate what mode?
I used to only drive on Sport+ then one time I had it on Sport but forgot and noticed that the same rough part of the road was not as before (body memory) then I decided at that point to only drive in Sport mode for the throttle response.... later on I switched to custom and set A/C to ECO since I didn't like the red anyways and I prefer the "weaker" version of A/C air
Okay, if the engine would be losing power between 6250 to 6800, then folks with 7200 redline have no benefit at all?
Can u guys with 2016+ check ur tach and see where ur redline is at? I thought it was a bit lower with my old 2014 GS with the 2GR-FSE engine. Did something change with the FKS?
This is not my car but the tach looks exactly the same. The needle actually goes past 6500 when it auto upshifts in manual mode, it just doesn't really hit exactly 6800 but sometimes it gets really close to it.
Okay, if the engine would be losing power between 6250 to 6800, then folks with 7200 redline have no benefit at all?
Can u guys with 2016+ check ur tach and see where ur redline is at? I thought it was a bit lower with my old 2014 GS with the 2GR-FSE engine. Did something change with the FKS?
This is not my car but the tach looks exactly the same. The needle actually goes past 6500 when it auto upshifts in manual mode, it just doesn't really hit exactly 6800 but sometimes it gets really close to it.
Yea it could be that the FKS and FKE redline are different. I would like to know what some are getting on Redline myself? My car is modded so it would not be a good comparo. Even though there were post saying different I was sure that ECO mode and Sport mode produced different Redline shifts with Sport Mode being higher.
About the 6250 - 7000 shifts? I did lots of research a years a long time ago on Dynos of both the Stock FKS and FSE. Even compared more recent when D3 and RR Posted Stock Dyno's compared to their Tunes. Appeared to me that after 6300ish STOCK, the hp dived down. Again...... I am Not talking Tunes, just Stock.
There are many FKS and FSE Dyno charts to compare. See what you think about the horse power to the 6250rpm plus powerband yourself?
Why does it feel like the car accelerates better if you don't floor the throttle? There seems to be a sweet sport when you accelerate and you feel the shove.
Also my is350 f sport 2016 redlines at 7200. Interesting that my gs350 2018 f sport red lines at 6800.
04-11-22, 01:37 PM
