When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.
Did you ever have the car pre inspected yourself before you purchased it? If not.... Lesson - #1. Never buy a used car without getting a independent inspection at a competent shop for yourself. Especially at that price.
Glad you were able to get it fixed. I'm actually shocked Lexus did that for you with the prior history of the suspension.
Did you ever have the car pre inspected yourself before you purchased it? If not.... Lesson - #1. Never buy a used car without getting a independent inspection at a competent shop for yourself. Especially at that price.
Glad you were able to get it fixed. I'm actually shocked Lexus did that for you with the prior history of the suspension.
You can’t do a pre purchase inspection if you buy from Carvana like I did. They do their internal 150pt inspection then you have a 7day period where you can return the vehicle and get your money back. My plan was buy the car, get it inspected, then if I wanted to return it and get my money back then I could within the 7day period. I have heard some pretty cool stories of great Lexus customer service, another reason I will be a customer for life. Maybe an example of finding the right people that know and care about the car and go the extra mile because they know how special it is. Glad it is over but the fight was well worth it to now be able to enjoy the car as it was intended.
You can’t do a pre purchase inspection if you buy from Carvana like I did. They do their internal 150pt inspection then you have a 7day period where you can return the vehicle and get your money back. My plan was buy the car, get it inspected, then if I wanted to return it and get my money back then I could within the 7day period. I have heard some pretty cool stories of great Lexus customer service, another reason I will be a customer for life. Maybe an example of finding the right people that know and care about the car and go the extra mile because they know how special it is. Glad it is over but the fight was well worth it to now be able to enjoy the car as it was intended.
it really depends on dealership and service advisor if he/she knows how special the F car within Lexus line up. Especially the GS no longer in production, in your case the service advisor goes extra miles and claims with Lexus warranty.
he could easily said that “suspension was modified therefore it void the warranty” and in this was the case. I would stick to that dealer to service your GSF and i am happy that it works out for you.
You can’t do a pre purchase inspection if you buy from Carvana like I did. They do their internal 150pt inspection then you have a 7day period where you can return the vehicle and get your money back. My plan was buy the car, get it inspected, then if I wanted to return it and get my money back then I could within the 7day period. I have heard some pretty cool stories of great Lexus customer service, another reason I will be a customer for life. Maybe an example of finding the right people that know and care about the car and go the extra mile because they know how special it is. Glad it is over but the fight was well worth it to now be able to enjoy the car as it was intended.
Again I am glad this worked out for you but seemed too, too much stress in buying a car I would have not wanted. I want to be happy about it not stressed. I bought my Wife's 2023 per owned Kia K5 GT, from Carvana in another State. I was only Dealing with the Sales Manager directly. I always bypass the Sales person to avoid them communicating back and fourth, to speak for myself. Because it was priced about $4k lower than others just like it, and every Option Package you could get on it. I flew 1 hour and 15mins to the Carvana out of state from me to look at and drive the car myself. I personally can not buy a car by pic's and just have it shipped to me without seeing and driving it myself. When I checked it out it looked prefect and only had 9k miles on it. When I drove it I discovered that the front brake rotors were warped. Likely someone there took it out riding and warped them.
When I went back the sales manager he explained why they were selling it lower because it sat there for past 60 days being missed to be ready to sell and that was at their turn limit. I presses him to get it checked out because I mentioned their failure in missing the warped Rotors. After speaking with a Kia Dealer there they agreed I could bring it then for a inspection on a lift. Everything checked out except the Rotors. The Carvana Sales Manger agreed to install new Pads and Rotors. In that agreement I was to pay a small fee for the Kia brand Rotors and Pads, not aftermarkets. I leaned on him about the reviews I may post of actual experience on the different websites. He waived me paying anything, and took care of it. I flew back to Atlanta and they then delivered the car. I also advised him that I did not want the car on the bottom row of the car carrier transport truck, for top car spills of fluids above, and not to place it top front either. I guess it depends on you being there? Or not. Congrats on your GS F!!!!!!!
Would you just buy a car again from Carvana the same way you just did?
Again I am glad this worked out for you but seemed too, too much stress in buying a car I would have not wanted. I want to be happy about it not stressed. I bought my Wife's 2023 per owned Kia K5 GT, from Carvana in another State. I was only Dealing with the Sales Manager directly. I always bypass the Sales person to avoid them communicating back and fourth, to speak for myself. Because it was priced about $4k lower than others just like it, and every Option Package you could get on it. I flew 1 hour and 15mins to the Carvana out of state from me to look at and drive the car myself. I personally can not buy a car by pic's and just have it shipped to me without seeing and driving it myself. When I checked it out it looked prefect and only had 9k miles on it. When I drove it I discovered that the front brake rotors were warped. Likely someone there took it out riding and warped them.
When I went back the sales manager he explained why they were selling it lower because it sat there for past 60 days being missed to be ready to sell and that was at their turn limit. I presses him to get it checked out because I mentioned their failure in missing the warped Rotors. After speaking with a Kia Dealer there they agreed I could bring it then for a inspection on a lift. Everything checked out except the Rotors. The Carvana Sales Manger agreed to install new Pads and Rotors. In that agreement I was to pay a small fee for the Kia brand Rotors and Pads, not aftermarkets. I leaned on him about the reviews I may post of actual experience on the different websites. He waived me paying anything, and took care of it. I flew back to Atlanta and they then delivered the car. I also advised him that I did not want the car on the bottom row of the car carrier transport truck, for top car spills of fluids above, and not to place it top front either. I guess it depends on you being there? Or not. Congrats on your GS F!!!!!!!
Would you just buy a car again from Carvana the same way you just did?
To answer your question, yes I would definitely buy from Carvana again. Two main reasons: #1 you just cannot buy a used car anywhere nowadays that has a 7day return period to get your money back outside of something like Carvana and maybe Carmax. No used dealership and no private party would let you do that so even with PPI's something could come up a few days later. Also the 100 day warranty if vehicle is outside of the manufacturer warranty. #2 is that I think you can find good deals especially on more rare vehicles like the GSF. Mine was blue book listed at $6k under KBB (if you put any worth into that service).
I did my research on Carvana and the vehicle going in. I knew Carvana had been getting obliterated in the press for various reasons and I read the service history on the vehicle that had notes about suspension issues. The plan was to prepare myself and be protected in case things went south. To be frank, I put a lot of emphasis on the knowledge on this board that I could find a solution even if it meant me spending $2k in new suspension and installing it myself. That was my worst case scenario and still, I would have had one of my long time dream cars for under $4k of book value.
Had the car not been low mileage (18k) in the last model year (2020) in the color I wanted (Cavier or White) then added cherry on top was the white/black interior combo and in near excellent condition inside and out, I would have just returned it and not decided to fight. I definitely agree with what you said about hounding Carvana...I spoke with an associate who extended the pre-purchase hold window for me to 24hrs, tried to fly to the vehicle but multiple people didn't know where it was (also buying a car in CA means they MUST ship to you at an address in CA), even tipped the delivery guy who then became my inside man for extending the 7day window ultimately to three weeks. I was communicating daily with their insurance company and the local repair shop. My battle could have been shortened had the local Lexus dealer not incorrectly assessed the suspension as aftermarket when it was OEM and thrown a $9,000 tag on repairs. (I will take the blame on that because I should have lifted it up or removed the wheels to see that the suspension was OEM)
As most you F owners and owners of the 2UR 5L V8 engine it brings a smile to your face every time you start the engine. Even though that car drove like a lumber truck with blown suspension, I became attached to it and there became a deeper motivation to that fight. Yes it was a lot to deal with and yes it consumed about a month of my life but now I have years with the car I wanted and it is even more special to me because of what I endured to get here. And in the end, it only cost me $500 instead of $9,000.
Love to hear your story about dealings with Carvana and the purchase of your wife's Kia. This is exactly why I posted my story so that others can prepare for what they might be dealing with if buying a car from Carvana. IMO you were prepared and took your precautions to the limit. Some of the other members have bought GSFs on there and had no issues. There was a 2020 Matador Red that sold last month on there and would love to hear that person's story if they are a member.
So yes, I definitely would buy another vehicle from Carvana just knowing what I may be getting into, preparing for that, and taking all the necessary precautions. And btw, as you know, outside of the suspension, it has been a breeze...fast, easy communication, car delivered to my doorstep, registration and plates taking care of like a traditional dealer, etc.
Last edited by lobuxracer; 02-21-24 at 05:49 PM.
Reason: Carvana /= Caravan
To answer your question, yes I would definitely buy from Carvana again. Two main reasons: #1 you just cannot buy a used car anywhere nowadays that has a 7day return period to get your money back outside of something like Carvana and maybe Carmax. No used dealership and no private party would let you do that so even with PPI's something could come up a few days later. Also the 100 day warranty if vehicle is outside of the manufacturer warranty. #2 is that I think you can find good deals especially on more rare vehicles like the GSF. Mine was blue book listed at $6k under KBB (if you put any worth into that service).
I did my research on Carvana and the vehicle going in. I knew Carvana had been getting obliterated in the press for various reasons and I read the service history on the vehicle that had notes about suspension issues. The plan was to prepare myself and be protected in case things went south. To be frank, I put a lot of emphasis on the knowledge on this board that I could find a solution even if it meant me spending $2k in new suspension and installing it myself. That was my worst case scenario and still, I would have had one of my long time dream cars for under $4k of book value.
Had the car not been low mileage (18k) in the last model year (2020) in the color I wanted (Cavier or White) then added cherry on top was the white/black interior combo and in near excellent condition inside and out, I would have just returned it and not decided to fight. I definitely agree with what you said about hounding Carvana...I spoke with an associate who extended the pre-purchase hold window for me to 24hrs, tried to fly to the vehicle but multiple people didn't know where it was (also buying a car in CA means they MUST ship to you at an address in CA), even tipped the delivery guy who then became my inside man for extending the 7day window ultimately to three weeks. I was communicating daily with their insurance company and the local repair shop. My battle could have been shortened had the local Lexus dealer not incorrectly assessed the suspension as aftermarket when it was OEM and thrown a $9,000 tag on repairs. (I will take the blame on that because I should have lifted it up or removed the wheels to see that the suspension was OEM)
As most you F owners and owners of the 2UR 5L V8 engine it brings a smile to your face every time you start the engine. Even though that car drove like a lumber truck with blown suspension, I became attached to it and there became a deeper motivation to that fight. Yes it was a lot to deal with and yes it consumed about a month of my life but now I have years with the car I wanted and it is even more special to me because of what I endured to get here. And in the end, it only cost me $500 instead of $9,000.
Love to hear your story about dealings with Carvana and the purchase of your wife's Kia. This is exactly why I posted my story so that others can prepare for what they might be dealing with if buying a car from Carvana. IMO you were prepared and took your precautions to the limit. Some of the other members have bought GSFs on there and had no issues. There was a 2020 Matador Red that sold last month on there and would love to hear that person's story if they are a member.
So yes, I definitely would buy another vehicle from Caravan just knowing what I may be getting into, preparing for that, and taking all the necessary precautions. And btw, as you know, outside of the suspension, it has been a breeze...fast, easy communication, car delivered to my doorstep, registration and plates taking care of like a traditional dealer, etc.
I am glad that a Lexus Dealer bailed you out on this one. Looking at the real situation you would have not been $4k under. You would have needed $6k - $9k out of pocket to resolve if not for that 1 Lexus dealer. Did Carvana Warranty cover any of this problem for you?
Lets make sure others know that Carvana will also Not refund the shipping cost paid with the 7 day return. I don't know if you have to pay the shipping back to them also? They also would not give your Trade back if you traded. I personally won't do business with Carvana again. The check out inspection does not seem legit to me, nor does the Warranty claims process.
Carvana also has problems with getting customers titles. They had a Class action suit filed against them just recently. I just want to make sure everyone knows that Carvana is not the great experience for the majority. Big W that you went to that many shops and came out the W!!!
I am glad that a Lexus Dealer bailed you out on this one. Looking at the real situation you would have not been $4k under. You would have needed $6k - $9k out of pocket to resolve if not for that 1 Lexus dealer. Did Carvana Warranty cover any of this problem for you?
Lets make sure others know that Carvana will also Not refund the shipping cost paid with the 7 day return. I don't know if you have to pay the shipping back to them also? They also would not give your Trade back if you traded. I personally won't do business with Carvana again. The check out inspection does not seem legit to me, nor does the Warranty claims process.
Carvana also has problems with getting customers titles. They had a Class action suit filed against them just recently. I just want to make sure everyone knows that Carvana is not the great experience for the majority. Big W that you went to that many shops and came out the W!!!
I think every Carvana situation is different. I’ve read where they have returned people’s trade ins and in my situation, they said they would refund the shipping fee if I decided to return. Just probably depends who you get, how nice you are, and the severity of the situation I suppose. You are right though not the best press from them. I think they were also banned from doing business in one of the 50 states! (Maybe Michigan or somewhere)
The cost I was quoting was cost for parts quoted at Bell Lexus in North Scottsdale during a year end sale. It would have been just over $2k of I did the labor myself. $5k if I serviced it in Scottsdale and a whopping $9k in parts and labor if done in Santa Monica, CA.
Definitely a big Win as I was fully prepared to buy the parts and attack the install myself.
Last edited by lobuxracer; 02-21-24 at 05:48 PM.
Reason: Caravan /= Carvana
First off I apologize for such a long post. After two years of searching and reading up on this board, finally pulled the trigger on a 2020 GSF that I found on Carvana. Sharing my story if it may help any others looking to purchase a GSF from Carvana (there is a Red 2020 for sale on there now https://www.carvana.com/vehicle/2892381) and also if anyone like me is not a mechanic and relies heavily on the Lexus dealership for advanced work on this rare vehicle. Ultimately, this board is only as powerful as its members and there are some incredible members with a wealth of knowledge and experiences. If it wasn't for this board, it would have certainly cost me tons more money and I would not be the happy GSF owner that I am today.
Carvana: I come across a 2020 GSF with 18k miles, no accidents, and service records from a few Lexus dealerships at a good price. I read many many reviews of the nightmare situations people have dealt with buying a car from Carvana so I fully prepared myself for the worst. They have a 7-day return window for a full refund and also a 100 day limited warranty to cover any repairs that the 150 point Carvana Inspection may have missed. The car appeared to be in near perfect condition so I decided to roll the dice. The entire purchase process was a breeze. All automated and delivered to my doorstep. Did a once over of the vehicle and it was just as advertised.
Drove the car around the block and immediately I knew something was wrong because the suspension was shot. I had driven some GSFs of different model years but never a 2020 and this one drove like a lumber truck. Shout out to @Tom44 for his insight on the 2020 drive quality. Every bump, every imperfection, every expansion joint was felt deep in my bones. I felt like a bobble head driving it and even a colleague of mine got sick from riding in it. This car drove so bad you could never drive it around where I live in West Los Angeles let alone ever have a passenger. Even the valet guy at my office who drove it 20 feet was asking what was wrong with it when I picked it up. I had an appointment scheduled at Lexus Santa Monica first thing the next morning.
Lexus Santa Monica pulled up the Lexus records which was the same I could see. Original owner complained about noise from front suspension at 4,500 miles but no repairs done then sold the vehicle. At 9,500 miles the car was in for same noises and Lexus of Glendale (CA) mentions notes of "aftermarket suspension installed". It is still unclear when/who/what was installed but after that point, car came back into same dealer in Glendale at 15,000 miles with owner complaining vehicle riding "overly stiff" and the response from Lexus was "driving characteristics normal being an F model". Immediately after, the car was sold to owner in Georgia. Owner #2 in Georgia brings the car into Nalley Lexus in Roswell, GA because its driving "bumpy" and dealership tells them "suspension to have same characteristics of other GSF models driven before". About 1,000 miles later the 2nd owner sells the car to Carvana. And thus I purchased the car from Carvana.
Here is where the plot thickens. Lexus of Santa Monica told me that the suspension was aftermarket which would jive with some of the previous Lexus service records. I thought "great, this will be easy. I will tell Carvana they sold me a vehicle with aftermarket parts and file a warranty claim within the 100 days and they will pay to bring back to OEM and working condition." Lexus Santa Monica quoted about $9k worth of repairs and spoke to the Carvana Warranty company. And this was the first time Carvana denied the claim. Called, complained, yelled, threatened. Took the vehicle to an in-network repair shop that works with Carvana and they said the same thing. Needs all new suspension and its going to cost $6k. Filed another warranty claim...denied again. Called, complained, yelled, threatened. I demanded that they re-open the claim to which they said they would send out an inspector. Inspector came and looked at vehicle (but did not ride in it) then went back and entered notes. Carvana denied the claim again. Demanded the inspector come back out to ride in the vehicle which I was there to drive him around. I even brought my 2016 GS350 so I could have him ride in for contrast. He said "I've driven many cars and this is not how a Lexus is supposed to drive." Great. Submits his notes and once again, Carvana denies the claim.
At this point I am faced with two options...#1 return the car and get my money back (the easy option) or #2 continue to fight and try to get this thing fixed (either on someone else's dime or on my dime.) I chose Option #2. My next call was to Lexus Corporate. They were super nice and helpful but ultimately, since this was dealing with "aftermarket parts", there was nothing they could do under Lexus Warranty. I decided to drive the vehicle out to Scottsdale (where my parents live) since I have had success buying cheaper priced Lexus parts via Bell Lexus North Scottsdale and if I was going to replace myself I would buy the parts there.
Here is another plot twist. On my drive from LA to AZ about halfway I hit something on the freeway and noticed my air pressure plummet from my passenger rear tire. Pulled off the road, inspected it, and luckily there was a tire repair shop at the same exit. The guys jacked her up, took off the wheel, and patched the hole. While doing this I got to look at the suspension and to my surprise, the rear suspension was OEM! I was shocked (pun intended) and this means that Lexus Santa Monica either didn't fully inspect or worked on so few (or zero) 2020 GSFs they had no idea what they were looking at. Granted there are way more 2016s produced than 2020 MY. My next stop was Bell Lexus North Scottsdale to have them inspect everything and see what is what. I assumed since they are a massive dealership that they had more experience with F cars. Shout out to @lobuxracer for the intel that the suspension pics I snapped were in fact OEM and also that it could be ECU related. That lead me to a post by @SkyPara82 about similar ride quality he experienced in his RCF after suspension repair where Lexus forgot to re-calibrate by doing a "system initialization". Post here: https://www.clublexus.com/forums/rc-...ion-issue.html
Unfortunately after speaking with the Bell Lexus North Scottsdale Service Manager and Lead Tech, it was pretty clear they didn't know much about the vehicle or service very often. They were also pretty rude and arrogant when I was telling them my story. When the tech said they don't need to do a re-calibration on the suspension after a replacement, that was the final straw for me. I am no mechanic but I spent hours investigating what was going on with this vehicle and they were not open to hearing any of it. Saying similar things like "well the F cars do ride stiffer" and maybe the springs were aftermarket. I told them I am not trying to be high maintenance or a jerk but was only sharing with them what other dealerships had been telling me and what I learned was probably incorrect. It rubbed me the wrong way so I decided not to bring in the GSF and have them inspect.
Shout out to @sickpuppy who mentioned Lexus Superstition Springs where he knew a few guys there and had positive experiences. About an hour drive away from Scottsdale but well worth it. Spoke to service tech Chris and asked him about experience working on GSFs and my story. He informed me they work on many GSFs and even an LFA or two in the area. Mentioned one of their performance advisors (not sure his exact title) who had been in many GSFs would be happy to ride around with me to see what is going on. WOW what a completely different experience. Everyone was super nice and legitimately concerned about my situation and cared to get this F back to full health. Mike the knowledgeable GSF tech rode around and in minutes confirmed the car was not driving like it should. Popped the hood and was poking around giving his initial thoughts with about 8 other techs and employees standing around like he was giving a TED talk. Said it could have been blown suspension from aftermarket pieces or possibly ECU when they tried to return it to OEM parts. They were committed to figuring out the issue and how it could be fixed. I get a call from Chris the next morning and he tells me they are submitting this as a suspension "part failure" and fixing under Lexus warranty. Brand new parts at all 4 corners. Said there was aftermarket sway bar links and I could keep them or return to stock for $500. Paid the $500 to get it back to 100% OEM. Ultimately what started as a $9k repair quote from Lexus Santa Monica to a $6k repair quote from Firestone and after multiple phone calls and countless hours spent with warranty companies and online resulted in a $500 out of pocket cost to fix.
As you would imagine I couldn't be happier but learned a few valuable lessons:
#1 - ClubLexus and this message board is an extremely powerful resource and I will be eternally grateful for all the insight members have shared here. I only hope I could possibly help someone 1% as much as you all have helped me.
#2 - Not all Lexus dealerships are created equal when it comes to the GSF. These F cars are a rare breed and with that comes an understanding that if you have to take them to a Lexus dealership, you better find a dealership that is experienced in working with these cars. Some of them probably never see them. The group at Superstition Springs Lexus took great pride in restoring a special vehicle back to its Lexus-intended driving condition and had the experience to do so. Lexus Santa Monica has been great to me over the years and I will continue to take my GS350 there...just not the GSF.
#3 - If you buy from Carvana, you never know what you will get. They have been ripped for issues not delivering cars, not delivering license plates, not registering titles, etc. In my case, they sold me a car with completely busted suspension and could have been anywhere from $2k if I bought parts and fixed myself to $9k if I had Lexus Santa Monica fix it.
Again, sorry for such a long post but hopefully any part of my story could possibly help out any fellow Lexus owners or prospective owners. Big shoutout to those on this board who helped along this crazy purchase journey of mine. I am a proud Lexus owner, proud GSF owner, and proud to be a member of ClubLexus. Now the real fun begins...
What parts needed to be replaced and if you could provide part numbers too.
I think every Carvana situation is different. I’ve read where they have returned people’s trade ins and in my situation, they said they would refund the shipping fee if I decided to return. Just probably depends who you get, how nice you are, and the severity of the situation I suppose. You are right though not the best press from them. I think they were also banned from doing business in one of the 50 states! (Maybe Michigan or somewhere)
The cost I was quoting was cost for parts quoted at Bell Lexus in North Scottsdale during a year end sale. It would have been just over $2k of I did the labor myself. $5k if I serviced it in Scottsdale and a whopping $9k in parts and labor if done in Santa Monica, CA.
Definitely a big Win as I was fully prepared to buy the parts and attack the install myself.
Hey nothing is perfect in the world! They can mess up just as well going down to your local Dealer buying a car. lol!
@Fis4Forty Thank you for sharing your story. I’ve had my GS F serviced at Bell these last few years, but your post prompted me to compare with Superstition Springs. I didn’t have any bad experiences with Bell, but great experiences (as mentioned above) go a long way. My 60k is coming up… I only need the spark plugs and the oil change. The price difference between the two dealerships was wildly different. Looks like i’m making my next appt with SS.
@Fis4Forty Thank you for sharing your story. I’ve had my GS F serviced at Bell these last few years, but your post prompted me to compare with Superstition Springs. I didn’t have any bad experiences with Bell, but great experiences (as mentioned above) go a long way. My 60k is coming up… I only need the spark plugs and the oil change. The price difference between the two dealerships was wildly different. Looks like i’m making my next appt with SS.
I think you will be pleased with them over there. All great people and a bit more down to earth. I think they also regulate oil changes to be in a “similar range” for pricing. Our cars take more oil and I was prepared to have a much higher oil change bill but it was about the same as my GS350. Give a shoutout to my service tech Chris Bates when you go in there. Another member has worked with Randy Wright also with a great experience. All good guys and GM Brent Adkisson also seems to really care about the brand and us GSF owners.
And btw, if you ever want to do an AZ cruise, there is a few GSFs out here in the valley. Need to get out with @cyfi66 and let the F’s run!
Did you keep the aftermarket sway bar endliks? What brand were they? I am hoping they didn’t think the OEM rear sway bar endlinks which are adjustable were aftemarlet due to them being adjustable!
Did you keep the aftermarket sway bar endliks? What brand were they? I am hoping they didn’t think the OEM rear sway bar endlinks which are adjustable were aftemarlet due to them being adjustable!
I honestly didn’t even really look at them longer than a few seconds. They asked me if I wanted to keep them and I said just toss them. Was so happy to have the car back to normal it was all kind of a blur!
Crazy story!!! Glad it worked out though. Do you know what exactly they replaced on your suspension? I’d be interested to hear what was damaged by the previous air ride suspension. I remember seeing this car for sale several times.
02-17-24, 07:40 PM
