Originally Posted by Hoovey2411

If the M's and AMG's are increasing in size, power, price, then the GS F is inheriting a spot once occupied by the formers. Carving out a nice little niche for itself.

Originally Posted by 4TehNguyen

GSF is what the one of the best M5s used to be, the E39 M5. Similar weight, similar engine size, but with 70+ more hp. Heck the MSRP of the E39 is pretty much what is speculated for the GSF. starting $70k. If you want a modern E39 M5, here it is.

Originally Posted by Nights

No one seems to care about that these days though. Just reading through this thread, it seems to all be about "more horsepower, more horsepower". I see M5 mentioned more than any other car in this thread, yet no-one seems to talk about the fact that the current generation M5 is seen as one of the worst M5s, and most M purists consider it to be bloated and handles like a pig. It can barely get the power down on the track, and essentially has far too much engine for it's chassis/tyres.

The fact that M are talking about AWD to be able to properly put the power down and to control the torque says something about maybe we've got TOO much power/torque now, at the expense of handling etc. I think most true M fans would have a heart attack if the M range went AWD.

The same issue occurred with the M3/4, and people seem to keep referring to that in the RCF forum, yet again many comparos have stated that the current M3/4 also has issues with getting its power down on the track and is not particularly "fun" to drive.

The E39 M5 was a hoot to drive, and I expect the GSF to be the same.

But I guess for many, having a fast car really just means going fast in a straight line. Traffic light heros maybe? :/

Originally Posted by SW13GS

We get it...a few of you guys think the GS-F sucks. How long are we going to post the exact same arguments back and forth to each other.

Originally Posted by RNM GS3

But as its being brought to market as a "true" F car - it is significantly outmatched vs its rivals. That to a certain extent makes it failure.

Originally Posted by RNM GS3

Also i have said if its priced right (base 70k - loaded 80k) it will have success in terms of sales.

Originally Posted by bitkahuna

not sure why you're thinking there might be a 10k spread from 'base' to loaded. given how few they're bringing to market i expect almost every one to be entirely loaded and if you want a BIT less equipment you'll have to order it, but i doubt it will be $10k less.

so my bet is $80+ out the door for most of them.

Originally Posted by obturator

Whoa, whoa, whoa! Has the GSF been universally praised like the E39 M5? Last I checked, no one has even driven it yet. Well, if you consider the GSF an RCF sedan, then maybe you have an argument. But even then, the RCF, itself, hasn't been universally praised. Where's the picture of the cart before the horse?

Originally Posted by 4TehNguyen

youre imagining things no one said. All we said were the specs were similar and if someone liked a car like the E39, then the GSF is similar. E39 was an excellent M car, the V10 M5 after that wasnt even that much faster on the Ring. It had to gain turbochargers in the current one to make it significantly faster than the E39, but it gained almost 400# over the E39.

Even when the RCF nearly matched the M4 laptime many people just conveniently ignore it. Heck even goes back to when the 2012 ISF matched the previous M3. Ignored except by us. You are correct in that they wont be universally praised but its not due to the performance but perception that M > *. Never mind that the M cars have been losing their way since the E46/E39 days. Now they are thinking of going AWD... If you miss a car like the E39 M5, then the GSF seems like a modern revival of it but in a Lexus of all things.

Originally Posted by 4TehNguyen

Never mind that the M cars have been losing their way since the E46/E39 days. Now they are thinking of going AWD... If you miss a car like the E39 M5, then the GSF seems like a modern revival of it but in a Lexus of all things.

Originally Posted by obturator

Am I imagining that you guys are praising the GSF as if it's the E39 M5? A modern revival, you say? You are calling it that even before the car has been test driven--just like when you defend against the naysayers and say they haven't driven it. It goes both ways. You guys speak of the GS chassis as if it's the best in the segment, while the Car of the Year CTS with its V sitting on its over 600hp lightweight magnetic ride and laughing. If that's too much hp for you guys, then there's the V sport that has outperformed the GS F sport. I'm sure the GSF will be a great driver's car. You guys are just jumping the gun a bit.

Originally Posted by 4TehNguyen

GSF is what the one of the best M5s used to be, the E39 M5. Similar weight, similar engine size, but with 70+ more hp. Heck the MSRP of the E39 is pretty much what is speculated for the GSF. starting $70k. If you want a modern E39 M5, here it is.

Originally Posted by Hoovey2411

Another thought about the GS F. Hopefully Head's Up Display (HUD) is available..

Originally Posted by 4TehNguyen

yea and the new M lead is thinking about AWD for the next Ms to try to control the increasing power. This wont make the car lighter nor cheaper. M5 is already way out of its price range and it will keep going out the GSFs price range.

Originally Posted by 4TehNguyen

GSF is what the one of the best M5s used to be, the E39 M5. Similar weight, similar engine size, but with 70+ more hp. Heck the MSRP of the E39 is pretty much what is speculated for the GSF. starting $70k. If you want a modern E39 M5, here it is.

Originally Posted by Gojirra99

I really like the E39 M5, and it is available in 6 speed manual only

Originally Posted by natnut

In reality, all the excess horsepower of the M5,E63 and RS7 is just consolation prize for the fact that these cars are no longer fun to drive except at life threatening/law breaking speeds. Reason : weight, turbo lag,Nose heaviness list goes on.

GS-F is far more purist in its approach : RWD,V8,predictable, progressive engine/throttle response,relative light weight.

The GS-F might be a return to the roots of a true driving enthusiast's car : fun to drive anytime, any speed.