Kinetic Suspension Question
11-21-03, 04:10 PM
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Kinetic Suspension Disapointment
I just got a call from my Dealer who should be seeing some of the 2004 GX 470s with Kinetic Suspension and Backup Cameras the early part of Dec , 2003. He stated that none will have tow package because Lexus does not recommend towing with the Kinetic Suspension. 
Can anyone confirm this? This will suck big time if we can't tow with our GX 470 that we plan to purchase.
Later,
Calvis
I did find this press release. It doesn't have anything related to towing with the Kinetic Suspension, but I found it interesting.
http://www.shareholder.com/tenneco/n...014-120178.cfm
Tenneco Automotive's Exclusive Kinetic® Suspension Technology To Debut On 2004 Lexus GX 470 SUV
Lake Forest, Illinois, October 14, 2003 - Tenneco Automotive (NYSE: TEN) announced that its patented Kinetic® suspension technology will be featured on the 2004 Lexus GX 470 sport utility vehicle. Lexus - the luxury division of Toyota - is launching its Kinetic Dynamic Suspension System, a version of the Kinetic® Reversible Function Stabilizer (RFS) technology, as an option on the luxury SUV through a licensing agreement with Tenneco Automotive.
"We are very excited to introduce our break-through Kinetic® suspension performance technology to the marketplace on the 2004 Lexus GX 470," said Mark Frissora, chairman and CEO of Tenneco Automotive. "We are proud that Toyota has recognized the special capabilities of Kinetic® that provide drivers with enhanced comfort and stability."
In a recent Lexus news release regarding the 2004 GX 470, the company described the Kinetic® suspension system as adding "another layer to the GX 470's impressive on-road ride and handling prowess and off-highway capability."
"The GX 470 offers the ultimate in luxurious adventures," said Lexus Group Vice President and General Manager Denny Clements in a recent news announcement. "Enhancements for 2004 emphasize our commitment to offering the most luxurious and most capable SUVs in the market."
Kinetic® RFS technology performance has been tested under rigorous conditions through Citroen's use of the technology in recent World Rally Championship events where RFS action gave Citroen's entries more even wheel loading, consistent handling and improved traction. The Citroen team made a historic first, second and third-place victory sweep at Monte Carlo in its first full event of the season with the RFS system and they currently lead the manufacturer's championship.
Tenneco Automotive continues to create and develop breakthrough suspension solutions for all segments of the automotive market. The company is currently pursuing several development opportunities with OE customers involving its Kinetic® technology.
About Kinetic® Technology
Kinetic® RFS is a distinctive variation of the basic proprietary Kinetic® suspension concepts that provide reduced articulation stiffness, increased roll stiffness and decoupled roll and bounce damping in a passive system without use of motors, pumps, sensors or computers. The RFS interconnects the front and rear stabilizers of the vehicle in order to optimize suspension performance in both on and off road environments.
On road, the system provides greater sway stiffness when required for crisp handling response, while at the same time providing improved comfort over bumpy surfaces. Off road, RFS enhances wheel travel and articulation freedom, allowing the vehicle to traverse obstacles with greater ease and comfort, all without requiring power or sensors for operation - a suspension approach and functionality entirely unique in the automotive market.
Tenneco Automotive is a $3.5 billion manufacturing company with headquarters in Lake Forest, Illinois and approximately 19,600 employees worldwide. Tenneco Automotive is one of the world's largest producers and marketers of ride control and exhaust systems and products, which are sold under the Monroe® and Walker® global brand names. Among its products are Sensa-Trac® and Monroe Reflex® shocks and struts, Rancho® shock absorbers, Walker® Quiet-Flow® mufflers and DynoMax® performance exhaust products, and Monroe® Clevite® vibration control components.
This press release contains forward-looking statements regarding the company's anticipated introduction of a ride control product and technology for a customer. Words such as "will," "plans," "become" and similar expressions identify these forward-looking statements. These forward-looking statements are based on the current expectations of the company (including its subsidiaries). Because these forward-looking statements involve risks and uncertainties, the company's plans and actual results could differ materially. For example, realization of future sales from awarded business is inherently subject to risks and uncertainties regarding, among other things, new technologies that reduce the demand for certain of our products or otherwise render them obsolete. In addition, the company's customers generally have the right to replace the company (or its subsidiaries) with another supplier at any time for a variety of reasons and have increasingly demanded price decreases over the life of awarded business. Consumer and customer acceptance of new products and technologies also present risks and uncertainties. Other factors that could cause the company's plans and results to differ materially from current expectations are described in the company's annual report on Form 10-K for the year ended December 31, 2002, to which you are referred for additional information. The company undertakes no obligation to update any forward-looking statement to reflect events or circumstances after the date of this press release."
Can anyone confirm this? This will suck big time if we can't tow with our GX 470 that we plan to purchase.Later,
Calvis
I did find this press release. It doesn't have anything related to towing with the Kinetic Suspension, but I found it interesting.
http://www.shareholder.com/tenneco/n...014-120178.cfm
Tenneco Automotive's Exclusive Kinetic® Suspension Technology To Debut On 2004 Lexus GX 470 SUV
Lake Forest, Illinois, October 14, 2003 - Tenneco Automotive (NYSE: TEN) announced that its patented Kinetic® suspension technology will be featured on the 2004 Lexus GX 470 sport utility vehicle. Lexus - the luxury division of Toyota - is launching its Kinetic Dynamic Suspension System, a version of the Kinetic® Reversible Function Stabilizer (RFS) technology, as an option on the luxury SUV through a licensing agreement with Tenneco Automotive.
"We are very excited to introduce our break-through Kinetic® suspension performance technology to the marketplace on the 2004 Lexus GX 470," said Mark Frissora, chairman and CEO of Tenneco Automotive. "We are proud that Toyota has recognized the special capabilities of Kinetic® that provide drivers with enhanced comfort and stability."
In a recent Lexus news release regarding the 2004 GX 470, the company described the Kinetic® suspension system as adding "another layer to the GX 470's impressive on-road ride and handling prowess and off-highway capability."
"The GX 470 offers the ultimate in luxurious adventures," said Lexus Group Vice President and General Manager Denny Clements in a recent news announcement. "Enhancements for 2004 emphasize our commitment to offering the most luxurious and most capable SUVs in the market."
Kinetic® RFS technology performance has been tested under rigorous conditions through Citroen's use of the technology in recent World Rally Championship events where RFS action gave Citroen's entries more even wheel loading, consistent handling and improved traction. The Citroen team made a historic first, second and third-place victory sweep at Monte Carlo in its first full event of the season with the RFS system and they currently lead the manufacturer's championship.
Tenneco Automotive continues to create and develop breakthrough suspension solutions for all segments of the automotive market. The company is currently pursuing several development opportunities with OE customers involving its Kinetic® technology.
About Kinetic® Technology
Kinetic® RFS is a distinctive variation of the basic proprietary Kinetic® suspension concepts that provide reduced articulation stiffness, increased roll stiffness and decoupled roll and bounce damping in a passive system without use of motors, pumps, sensors or computers. The RFS interconnects the front and rear stabilizers of the vehicle in order to optimize suspension performance in both on and off road environments.
On road, the system provides greater sway stiffness when required for crisp handling response, while at the same time providing improved comfort over bumpy surfaces. Off road, RFS enhances wheel travel and articulation freedom, allowing the vehicle to traverse obstacles with greater ease and comfort, all without requiring power or sensors for operation - a suspension approach and functionality entirely unique in the automotive market.
Tenneco Automotive is a $3.5 billion manufacturing company with headquarters in Lake Forest, Illinois and approximately 19,600 employees worldwide. Tenneco Automotive is one of the world's largest producers and marketers of ride control and exhaust systems and products, which are sold under the Monroe® and Walker® global brand names. Among its products are Sensa-Trac® and Monroe Reflex® shocks and struts, Rancho® shock absorbers, Walker® Quiet-Flow® mufflers and DynoMax® performance exhaust products, and Monroe® Clevite® vibration control components.
This press release contains forward-looking statements regarding the company's anticipated introduction of a ride control product and technology for a customer. Words such as "will," "plans," "become" and similar expressions identify these forward-looking statements. These forward-looking statements are based on the current expectations of the company (including its subsidiaries). Because these forward-looking statements involve risks and uncertainties, the company's plans and actual results could differ materially. For example, realization of future sales from awarded business is inherently subject to risks and uncertainties regarding, among other things, new technologies that reduce the demand for certain of our products or otherwise render them obsolete. In addition, the company's customers generally have the right to replace the company (or its subsidiaries) with another supplier at any time for a variety of reasons and have increasingly demanded price decreases over the life of awarded business. Consumer and customer acceptance of new products and technologies also present risks and uncertainties. Other factors that could cause the company's plans and results to differ materially from current expectations are described in the company's annual report on Form 10-K for the year ended December 31, 2002, to which you are referred for additional information. The company undertakes no obligation to update any forward-looking statement to reflect events or circumstances after the date of this press release."
Last edited by calvis; 11-21-03 at 04:30 PM.
add on for 2003
11-23-03, 06:43 AM
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Calvis,
Heard the same thing. I bet when they installed the RFS unit, they had to change things around to accomodate the cylinders under the vehicle. This probably meant they had to change the spare tire position; hence forth, the no tow package. This is pure speculation on my part, but I would find it pretty offensive if they were to produce a vehicle that actually was not capable of towing.
Anyway, for what its worth.
Heard the same thing. I bet when they installed the RFS unit, they had to change things around to accomodate the cylinders under the vehicle. This probably meant they had to change the spare tire position; hence forth, the no tow package. This is pure speculation on my part, but I would find it pretty offensive if they were to produce a vehicle that actually was not capable of towing.
Anyway, for what its worth.
12-11-03, 03:00 PM
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This blows
After researching SUV's for six months, I finally made a decision to purchase the '04 GX. I have postponed the purchase a couple of months so that I could get all the promised '04 additions, including KDSS. One of the main criteria I have for an SUV was the ability to easily tow my boat... plus I want KDSS! This news about no towing with KDSS is just the kind of crap that kept making me waffle on the GX for the past 6-months. I have no doubt that the GX is a superior truck, but Lexus as a company keeps making me feel like the GX is a hack! I keep feeling like I am purchasing their test version. If you pull up the carpet, I wonder if you would see the word "DRAFT" watermarked into the body...
12-11-03, 03:19 PM
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Confirmed
I emailed my local dealer with a few questions and he confirmed the towing vs KDSS snafu:
"...The 9700c series now available does include the
backup camera with navagition of course. Also included is the RSCC, Rear
Sensing Curtain Airbags on/off switch. The KDSS suspension system does not
come with the tow option due to the fact that KDSS and tow adversley
effects the system. The KDSS option is an additional $1750.00..."
I may need to test drive it again. The original reason I wanted KDSS is that when my wife test drove it, the truck seemed to body roll and become a little unstable when she braked with moderate pressure and the suspension was on one of the two softest comfort settings. We tried it several times and each time she felt that she had to really have a firm two-handed grip to keep the truck under control during moderate to hard braking. I was hoping that KDSS would improve this situation. Now I may need to start shopping around again... crap!
"...The 9700c series now available does include the
backup camera with navagition of course. Also included is the RSCC, Rear
Sensing Curtain Airbags on/off switch. The KDSS suspension system does not
come with the tow option due to the fact that KDSS and tow adversley
effects the system. The KDSS option is an additional $1750.00..."
I may need to test drive it again. The original reason I wanted KDSS is that when my wife test drove it, the truck seemed to body roll and become a little unstable when she braked with moderate pressure and the suspension was on one of the two softest comfort settings. We tried it several times and each time she felt that she had to really have a firm two-handed grip to keep the truck under control during moderate to hard braking. I was hoping that KDSS would improve this situation. Now I may need to start shopping around again... crap!
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12-11-03, 04:33 PM
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We did try "sport" mode and it was fine. But I don't plan to be in "sport" mode much during my normal everyday driving. It will probably remain in the 2nd softest spot most of the time (#1 is a little too spongy and floating-on-a-cloudish... like the sloppy handling feel of a Cadi ). I don't want to worry about my wife losing control if she borrows it and has to slam on her brakes going 65 down the highway as traffic comes to a stand-still, as it often does lately in Sac (a big thanks to all the SF bay area folks that have moved up here 
12-11-03, 05:34 PM
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Re: This blows
Originally posted by SacKen
After researching SUV's for six months, I finally made a decision to purchase the '04 GX. I have postponed the purchase a couple of months so that I could get all the promised '04 additions, including KDSS. One of the main criteria I have for an SUV was the ability to easily tow my boat... plus I want KDSS! This news about no towing with KDSS is just the kind of crap that kept making me waffle on the GX for the past 6-months. I have no doubt that the GX is a superior truck, but Lexus as a company keeps making me feel like the GX is a hack! I keep feeling like I am purchasing their test version. If you pull up the carpet, I wonder if you would see the word "DRAFT" watermarked into the body...
After researching SUV's for six months, I finally made a decision to purchase the '04 GX. I have postponed the purchase a couple of months so that I could get all the promised '04 additions, including KDSS. One of the main criteria I have for an SUV was the ability to easily tow my boat... plus I want KDSS! This news about no towing with KDSS is just the kind of crap that kept making me waffle on the GX for the past 6-months. I have no doubt that the GX is a superior truck, but Lexus as a company keeps making me feel like the GX is a hack! I keep feeling like I am purchasing their test version. If you pull up the carpet, I wonder if you would see the word "DRAFT" watermarked into the body...
But of course everytime I say anything all the Lexus faithfuls comes to it's aid. Like I am in the wrong for expecting something that was well thought out and released with the proper R&D.
All I ever heard about Lexus was how great they are and how good their quality is. Well the quality is NOT that good on the GX.
But to each their own I guess.
12-11-03, 06:29 PM
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This is my sixth Lexus and by far the only Lemon I have had, from vibrations to rear end clunks, to terrible fuel milage, rattles like a $9K Chevy S-10. Information center accuracy real bad. Rock and roll suspention ect. I wonder if they realize how much repeat business they have lost with this looser? They will not admit they have a problem. Flame me if you like just MHO.
12-11-03, 06:39 PM
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Don't say too many bad things about the GX as the moderators will edit your thread without letting you know. I know because it has happened to me before. My dealer told me that KDSS is mainly for off-road use and that is why the towing feature is not available on it. This is bizzare. If you do put a hitch on it does it become a safety hazzard?
If I wanted a vehicle that wouldn't tow a boat I would buy a Mini Cooper.
If I wanted a vehicle that wouldn't tow a boat I would buy a Mini Cooper.
12-11-03, 07:14 PM
#12
Oh boy! What next? Here I am with a bullet proof GS400 and so far, perfect ES330 and now waiting for the KDSS option GX? Fortunately, I don't want the trailer towing option but also, don't want the third row seat "option" as well as the rear entertainment "option". The salesman at the dealership says that all the trucks will be coming with those "options", which comes to about $3600 list price. Yeah, yeah the options are good for the next owner but I want the car my way for me and my $50+K..
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