GX newbie questions, please bear with me
01-01-12, 10:22 PM
#1
Advanced
Thread Starter
GX newbie questions, please bear with me
Hello folks,
Im an LS430 owner and also have an AP2 S2000 and a 4runner. Looking to upgrade my 4runner with a 1st gen GX470, 05 or newer and had a few basic questions. Reading through a bunch of threads has me a little worried about the vehicle as the air suspension seems a little troublesome as do a few other areas, but then I could be worried about nothing. So here goes, thanks in advance
1. What are the major differences between the 05/06 and 07/08? I drove an 05 that seemed to shake a lot at 60-65 mph and so did a friend of mine, but an 08 I drove felt great. Also just felt put together better and had a much nicer looking navi screen. From my research though, I think the drivetrains and essentially the whole truck is pretty much identical inside and out so what am I missing?
2. Were HIDs ever offered on the GX? I have yet to see any with HIDs and thats disappointing
3. What gives with the cheapo keys? I still havent seen one with touchless keyless entry and keyless start, but rather keys with buttons for unlocking and a key that has to be used to start the truck. Is that how they all are?
4. What are some key areas of concern to look out for when looking at a used one?
5. How troublesome are the air suspensions, how long do they tend to last and how costly are they to replace?
6. What is KDSS?
7. What years are known to be free of the bad, crack prone dashes? If only buying 05+ should I be safe?
Im also considering an Infiniti FX45 but really Im a Lexus guy. Thanks in advance folks and happy new year!
Im an LS430 owner and also have an AP2 S2000 and a 4runner. Looking to upgrade my 4runner with a 1st gen GX470, 05 or newer and had a few basic questions. Reading through a bunch of threads has me a little worried about the vehicle as the air suspension seems a little troublesome as do a few other areas, but then I could be worried about nothing. So here goes, thanks in advance
1. What are the major differences between the 05/06 and 07/08? I drove an 05 that seemed to shake a lot at 60-65 mph and so did a friend of mine, but an 08 I drove felt great. Also just felt put together better and had a much nicer looking navi screen. From my research though, I think the drivetrains and essentially the whole truck is pretty much identical inside and out so what am I missing?
2. Were HIDs ever offered on the GX? I have yet to see any with HIDs and thats disappointing
3. What gives with the cheapo keys? I still havent seen one with touchless keyless entry and keyless start, but rather keys with buttons for unlocking and a key that has to be used to start the truck. Is that how they all are?
4. What are some key areas of concern to look out for when looking at a used one?
5. How troublesome are the air suspensions, how long do they tend to last and how costly are they to replace?
6. What is KDSS?
7. What years are known to be free of the bad, crack prone dashes? If only buying 05+ should I be safe?
Im also considering an Infiniti FX45 but really Im a Lexus guy. Thanks in advance folks and happy new year!
Last edited by Muti007; 01-01-12 at 10:25 PM.
01-02-12, 07:22 AM
#2
The difference between 05 and 08 are relatively minor, they both use the newer engine, the 08 will have an updated navigation system and a few other cosmetic changes.
There is a TSB issued for shake/shimmy problems. It seems some vehicles are worse then others, Another member attached it to this post -- It effects up to model year 2008 vehicles. Other common causes of this problem are bad tires, poorly balanced tires, stuck brake callipers and distorted brake rotors. An older vehicle has older parts and may contribute more significantly to the problem, but it seems ALL first gens are susceptible to this problem. I would value the service history over the model year.
I am not aware of a HID option, but the headlights do use projector elements and can be easily retrofitted to HID for under $200. There are a bunch of posts describing this modification.
They all use the old RX based key design, that doesn't change until the 2nd generation model.
Key areas of concern are the 2 well known TSBs (clunk-fix and shimmy/shake) plus the common problems like air suspension sensor issues, cracked dashboards, navigation unit failures, interior leather wear...
The air suspension is actually very reliable, as compared to other air suspension units. Most of these issues occur after 100k miles at which point even a traditional spring and shock suspension would require replacement. KDSS is a beefier suspension option with disconnecting sway bars for additional off road clearance.
I don't think they improved the dash material to prevent cracking until much mater in the model run, so most vehicles are susceptible to this problem.
There is a TSB issued for shake/shimmy problems. It seems some vehicles are worse then others, Another member attached it to this post -- It effects up to model year 2008 vehicles. Other common causes of this problem are bad tires, poorly balanced tires, stuck brake callipers and distorted brake rotors. An older vehicle has older parts and may contribute more significantly to the problem, but it seems ALL first gens are susceptible to this problem. I would value the service history over the model year.
I am not aware of a HID option, but the headlights do use projector elements and can be easily retrofitted to HID for under $200. There are a bunch of posts describing this modification.
They all use the old RX based key design, that doesn't change until the 2nd generation model.
Key areas of concern are the 2 well known TSBs (clunk-fix and shimmy/shake) plus the common problems like air suspension sensor issues, cracked dashboards, navigation unit failures, interior leather wear...
The air suspension is actually very reliable, as compared to other air suspension units. Most of these issues occur after 100k miles at which point even a traditional spring and shock suspension would require replacement. KDSS is a beefier suspension option with disconnecting sway bars for additional off road clearance.
I don't think they improved the dash material to prevent cracking until much mater in the model run, so most vehicles are susceptible to this problem.
Last edited by z0lt3c; 01-02-12 at 05:30 PM.
01-02-12, 07:44 AM
#3
Advanced
Thread Starter
Thanks!
So the shimmy thing is a known issue and there are TSBs covering them. How hard is it getting them taken care of if you were to buy one used and is there a mileage limitation?
The air suspensions worry me a bit, I went out of my way to avoid them on my LS. Guess Ill have to think about that one.
What kind of bulbs are the headlights, H3, H4 etc.?
Whats the "clunk fix" you mentioned?
Isnt the navi unit essentially the same as in my LS? Seemed more or less the same to me. Its also a common area of failure? Also, in researching the dash cracks, it seemed to be most common up to 05 or 06 I thought after which the dashes were changed. am I wrong here?
So the shimmy thing is a known issue and there are TSBs covering them. How hard is it getting them taken care of if you were to buy one used and is there a mileage limitation?
The air suspensions worry me a bit, I went out of my way to avoid them on my LS. Guess Ill have to think about that one.
What kind of bulbs are the headlights, H3, H4 etc.?
Whats the "clunk fix" you mentioned?
Isnt the navi unit essentially the same as in my LS? Seemed more or less the same to me. Its also a common area of failure? Also, in researching the dash cracks, it seemed to be most common up to 05 or 06 I thought after which the dashes were changed. am I wrong here?
01-02-12, 08:05 AM
#4
I don't know much about the pre 08's but I bought mine in August, it is a CPO. I trolled through these forums for about 6 months before buying one.
The clunk is a driveshaft that engages when coming to a stop, nothing more than a slight bump or clunk. I just got mine fixed last week. Don't know about out of warranty repairs.
There are a lot of threads here about headlamp upgrades, I'm going to do mine in the near future, seems easy and inexpensive.
I have an 06 RX, and the nav on the 08 is different, don't know what year your LS is but there is a difference.
You can check the repair records on Lexus.com to see what if anything has been done to the GX's you're looking at.
The clunk is a driveshaft that engages when coming to a stop, nothing more than a slight bump or clunk. I just got mine fixed last week. Don't know about out of warranty repairs.
There are a lot of threads here about headlamp upgrades, I'm going to do mine in the near future, seems easy and inexpensive.
I have an 06 RX, and the nav on the 08 is different, don't know what year your LS is but there is a difference.
You can check the repair records on Lexus.com to see what if anything has been done to the GX's you're looking at.
01-02-12, 01:25 PM
#5
Advanced
Thread Starter
Upgraded wheels?
Also, how hard is it to find upgraded wheels for them? I never keep stock wheels on any of my cars. What size are stock wheels on the 05-07 GX? Is it hard to find larger wheels from the next gen GX that would fit this gen? What about in the aftermarket, is there a decent selection of 20 inchers out there that will fit? I can tell you on the LS430 it was VERY hard finding wheels to fit due to the BBKs up front, wondering if the same difficulty exists for the GX470 too.
01-02-12, 02:13 PM
#6
In many cases the shimmy problem is solved by road force balancing tires and/or replacing worn wheels and/or tires. You could ask the selling dealer to perform these steps. If this doesn't improve it, and it bothers you that much, I would look for another one. Lexus does not consider it unsafe given a AWD drivetrain. FYI the 2nd gens shimmy too.
The navi unit is known to fail, based on historic posts here and is only available from lexus at high dollars. Retrofitting an aftermarket nav system in is almost impossible due to car system integration into the factory system. Some prefer the factory no-nav because it's easier to put an aftermarket HU in.
You can search for the posts but owners after 06 have reported dash cracking problems. In many cases Lexus offers to share the cost of replacement if you submit a claim. I wouldn't buy any statement it was fixed after a certain date -- this problem seems to be more widespread @ Toyota/Lexus.
I have an 04 but I believe the stock size is 18. Bear in mind the height of the vehicle is dynamically controlled and changing the dimensions of the wheels is not suggested. I would not put 20's on my GX personally although, I've seen others running them. I know the GX can use any 04+ wheels that fit a FJ cruiser, 4runner or Prado, so that's a pretty wide range selection of factory styles. I think you will find true aftermarket options more limited as compared to the LS.
The navi unit is known to fail, based on historic posts here and is only available from lexus at high dollars. Retrofitting an aftermarket nav system in is almost impossible due to car system integration into the factory system. Some prefer the factory no-nav because it's easier to put an aftermarket HU in.
You can search for the posts but owners after 06 have reported dash cracking problems. In many cases Lexus offers to share the cost of replacement if you submit a claim. I wouldn't buy any statement it was fixed after a certain date -- this problem seems to be more widespread @ Toyota/Lexus.
I have an 04 but I believe the stock size is 18. Bear in mind the height of the vehicle is dynamically controlled and changing the dimensions of the wheels is not suggested. I would not put 20's on my GX personally although, I've seen others running them. I know the GX can use any 04+ wheels that fit a FJ cruiser, 4runner or Prado, so that's a pretty wide range selection of factory styles. I think you will find true aftermarket options more limited as compared to the LS.
Last edited by z0lt3c; 01-02-12 at 05:32 PM.
01-02-12, 02:20 PM
#7
Advanced
Thread Starter
Thanks so much Zolt.
Im so surprised to hear of so many known issues on a higher end Lexus such as this, wondering if I should rethink it. Navi known to fail, that stinks. Shimmy problems, dashes cracking, leaking airbags/sensors, bad driveshafts...sheesh! This is really the truck I like most but I wonder if I need to look at others more.
As for the 20 inch wheels, it isnt as if you change anything size wise. As the wheel size goes up, the tire profile goes down so the overall rolling diameter stays the same overall so as not to effect the ride height, speedometer etc. If I were to do it, Id do it right.
Thanks
Im so surprised to hear of so many known issues on a higher end Lexus such as this, wondering if I should rethink it. Navi known to fail, that stinks. Shimmy problems, dashes cracking, leaking airbags/sensors, bad driveshafts...sheesh! This is really the truck I like most but I wonder if I need to look at others more.
As for the 20 inch wheels, it isnt as if you change anything size wise. As the wheel size goes up, the tire profile goes down so the overall rolling diameter stays the same overall so as not to effect the ride height, speedometer etc. If I were to do it, Id do it right.
Thanks
Trending Topics
01-02-12, 02:38 PM
#8
No disrespect and I acknowledge your thoughtfulness, but I think you're over-analyzing here.
The GX is a highly reliable, proven truck. They made tens of thousands of them and you see tons of them on the road. Just like any other vehicle that's not a beater, get a PPI, check out the history, negotiate a good deal and go use it in life. You're going to get a lot of folks coming here for fix-it advice. Cool. If you're super-concerned about out-of-pocket repairs, spend more and get a newer GX under factory warranty. Manage your risk to your own heart's content.
Along the wheels front, I think anything bigger than 18s looks weird. It's a body-on-frame Toyota truck that shares many major components with the 4Runner. Stick with 18s and put some more aggressive tires on it is my best advice. It looks segment appropriate. If you're into the low profile dubs+, get a Range Rover. There's a much bigger aftermarket ecosystem.
Taking a more macro view of the mid2full-sized SUV market, the GX 1st gen is just complex enough to be considered a luxury truck while being simple enough to better manage obsolescence. You can get your Tahoes which are really basic, but a smidge rough around its rental car edges. You can roll around in a Range Rover with their markedly more complex 4x4 system with higher defect rates. Or you can get the GX right in the middle. Silky smooth. Toyota reliability. Lexus quality. No brainer for me.
The GX is a highly reliable, proven truck. They made tens of thousands of them and you see tons of them on the road. Just like any other vehicle that's not a beater, get a PPI, check out the history, negotiate a good deal and go use it in life. You're going to get a lot of folks coming here for fix-it advice. Cool. If you're super-concerned about out-of-pocket repairs, spend more and get a newer GX under factory warranty. Manage your risk to your own heart's content.
Along the wheels front, I think anything bigger than 18s looks weird. It's a body-on-frame Toyota truck that shares many major components with the 4Runner. Stick with 18s and put some more aggressive tires on it is my best advice. It looks segment appropriate. If you're into the low profile dubs+, get a Range Rover. There's a much bigger aftermarket ecosystem.
Taking a more macro view of the mid2full-sized SUV market, the GX 1st gen is just complex enough to be considered a luxury truck while being simple enough to better manage obsolescence. You can get your Tahoes which are really basic, but a smidge rough around its rental car edges. You can roll around in a Range Rover with their markedly more complex 4x4 system with higher defect rates. Or you can get the GX right in the middle. Silky smooth. Toyota reliability. Lexus quality. No brainer for me.
Last edited by ROK; 01-02-12 at 02:46 PM.
01-02-12, 02:47 PM
#9
Advanced
Thread Starter
Hey, no disrespect felt either, its all good.
Ive owned over 60 vehicles in my 37 years on this earth, so I have some experience with cars, trucks and motorcycles. It never hurts to do your research ahead of time, and as such, all Im saying is Im a little surprised to hear of so many known issues effecting the GX. By comparison, my current 3 vehicles dont have nearly as many known to fail type issues. Does that mean Im likely to encounter all of these problems on any GX I buy? Of course not. Does it mean Im better off for knowing its possible though and for knowing what to look for while shopping? Of course. And thats what Im here for.
As for the 20 inch wheel topic, no offense, but I really didnt ask for your opinion as to how you think they would look or if they are segment appropriate. I know what I like and dont like and wanted to know whats available out there. I could easily buy a Range Rover but dont like them, I only buy Japanese vehicles for the reliability and ease to work on them. For a vehicle the size of the GX, 20s with good, meaty tread dont look inappropriate at all, nor would I be looking for anything blingy, chrome or flashy. But none of that matters. These are matters of opinion and discussing them as if one person is right and the other is wrong is an exercise in futility. All Im asking is how available are options out there for the vehicle.
Thanks again.
Ive owned over 60 vehicles in my 37 years on this earth, so I have some experience with cars, trucks and motorcycles. It never hurts to do your research ahead of time, and as such, all Im saying is Im a little surprised to hear of so many known issues effecting the GX. By comparison, my current 3 vehicles dont have nearly as many known to fail type issues. Does that mean Im likely to encounter all of these problems on any GX I buy? Of course not. Does it mean Im better off for knowing its possible though and for knowing what to look for while shopping? Of course. And thats what Im here for.
As for the 20 inch wheel topic, no offense, but I really didnt ask for your opinion as to how you think they would look or if they are segment appropriate. I know what I like and dont like and wanted to know whats available out there. I could easily buy a Range Rover but dont like them, I only buy Japanese vehicles for the reliability and ease to work on them. For a vehicle the size of the GX, 20s with good, meaty tread dont look inappropriate at all, nor would I be looking for anything blingy, chrome or flashy. But none of that matters. These are matters of opinion and discussing them as if one person is right and the other is wrong is an exercise in futility. All Im asking is how available are options out there for the vehicle.
Thanks again.
01-02-12, 02:57 PM
#10
It's really tough to have meaty tread with 20s buddy especially if you're trying to stick to the stock rolling diameter. Whether you asked or not, we're here to openly/freely share our opinions so I threw mine out.
I haven't owned nearly as many vehicles as you and won't even if we were the same age, but here's my list with every single one modified with top class parts and under factory warranty save for the Jeep and 2 Toyotas which should tell you something:
AP1/AP2 S2000 (they have their issues, too)
2004 E46 M3 (reliable)
2004 911 C4S (reliable)
1999 XJ (rough, rough car, but reliable beater)
2003 4Runner Limited (should've never sold it; no warranty)
2007 GX (no warranty)
2008 911 GT3 (just bought an aftermarket warranty w/ factory warranty still in effect from dealer 7yr/100K miles)
What I'm trying to get across is, each of these cars have their own history of known issues. I didn't experience much if anything where it came anywhere close to emptying my wallet to the point it pissed me off. All were/are great vehicles. If I based my purchasing decisions on TSBs, internet forum hearsay, and just anecdotal evidence spewed all over the general public, I'd prob be taking the bus.
I haven't owned nearly as many vehicles as you and won't even if we were the same age, but here's my list with every single one modified with top class parts and under factory warranty save for the Jeep and 2 Toyotas which should tell you something:
AP1/AP2 S2000 (they have their issues, too)
2004 E46 M3 (reliable)
2004 911 C4S (reliable)
1999 XJ (rough, rough car, but reliable beater)
2003 4Runner Limited (should've never sold it; no warranty)
2007 GX (no warranty)
2008 911 GT3 (just bought an aftermarket warranty w/ factory warranty still in effect from dealer 7yr/100K miles)
What I'm trying to get across is, each of these cars have their own history of known issues. I didn't experience much if anything where it came anywhere close to emptying my wallet to the point it pissed me off. All were/are great vehicles. If I based my purchasing decisions on TSBs, internet forum hearsay, and just anecdotal evidence spewed all over the general public, I'd prob be taking the bus.
Last edited by ROK; 01-02-12 at 03:02 PM.
01-02-12, 03:04 PM
#12
Yea, man, just get the newest, lowest mileage one that you can afford that also checks out A-OK. The GX is as reliable as the next reliable SUV in SUV land. The other fellas covered off well on the sundry options details.
gl
gl
01-02-12, 03:17 PM
#13
Advanced
Thread Starter
Well Im not looking to spend more then $25-27k or so so was looking at 06-07s which puts me in the 60-70k mile range more or less. I installed an aftermarket in dash DVD/CD/Navi in my 4runner which works and looks great, but I want an all in dash OEM for my next vehicle like I have in my LS430 and having driven a few GX now, its pretty much identical to the ML system I have now which I like. I love having everything look nice and clean and all integrated into the vehicle. I just wonder if the mileage Im looking at will doom me to expensive repairs, but then again, none of us have crystal ***** either. The dash cracks alone really scare me and I thought were resolved by a certain year. Man it would suck to have to dish out $1200 for something like that!
01-02-12, 03:25 PM
#14
Don't let a car scare you, man!
The 4R group has the same dash crack issue, but I live in a rainy/cloudy climate so less susceptible.
I bought my 07 with 80K miles with complete peace of mind. As soon as I picked it up, I got a complete fluid swap with new. So far, so good and looking forward to the 90K timing belt change to get it further "protected".
I'm keeping my eyes peeled for the following:
-Wheel bearings
-CV boot
-Air suspension bits and pieces
There's no scientific basis for compiling the above list.
The 4R group has the same dash crack issue, but I live in a rainy/cloudy climate so less susceptible.
I bought my 07 with 80K miles with complete peace of mind. As soon as I picked it up, I got a complete fluid swap with new. So far, so good and looking forward to the 90K timing belt change to get it further "protected".
I'm keeping my eyes peeled for the following:
-Wheel bearings
-CV boot
-Air suspension bits and pieces
There's no scientific basis for compiling the above list.
Last edited by ROK; 01-02-12 at 03:30 PM.
01-02-12, 03:31 PM
#15
Advanced
Thread Starter
The 4R group has the same dash crack issue, but I live in a rainy/cloudy climate so less susceptible.
I bought my 07 with 80K miles with complete peace of mind. As soon as I picked it up, I got a complete fluid swap with new. So far, so good and looking forward to the 90K timing belt change to get it further "protected".
I bought my 07 with 80K miles with complete peace of mind. As soon as I picked it up, I got a complete fluid swap with new. So far, so good and looking forward to the 90K timing belt change to get it further "protected".