Forerunner V8 Limited vs. GS470??
01-05-04, 09:02 PM
#1
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Forerunner V8 Limited vs. GS470??
Just out of curiosity but what are the compelling advantages to buying a GS470 for thousands more than a loaded Forerunner Limited V8 with DVD Navigation to boot?
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Only discernable advantage is the GS470 has air suspension and wood veneer appointments but cost is $5000-$9000 more than a Forerunner Limited V8 with DVD Navi, leather, moonroof, air bags etc. But otherwise have identical measurements, motor, gearbox and other spec's.
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Any tips would be appreciated.
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Only discernable advantage is the GS470 has air suspension and wood veneer appointments but cost is $5000-$9000 more than a Forerunner Limited V8 with DVD Navi, leather, moonroof, air bags etc. But otherwise have identical measurements, motor, gearbox and other spec's.
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Any tips would be appreciated.
01-06-04, 06:33 AM
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You get a Lexus dealer vs. Toyota dealer, a loaner car no questions asked, and a proven customer service record. After all Lexus did buy back alot of 2003 GX with little or no hassle. Would any other make of car do that?
Also if you have a business that you use the GX for because of the higher GVWR you could end up paying at the end a lot less than the 4Runner.
Also if you have a business that you use the GX for because of the higher GVWR you could end up paying at the end a lot less than the 4Runner.
Last edited by degeester; 01-06-04 at 06:35 PM.
01-06-04, 07:19 AM
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GS 470?
Whats a GS470? 
Ok. How about the fact that the dimensions are not the same and you're basically getting a european land cruiser instead of a four runner? Add in Lexus value, fit and finish, extra sound insulation, - a damn good looking truck, noot seeing yourself in every parking lot.... The list goes on. If you want a four runner - buy one. They are not the same car....
Ok. How about the fact that the dimensions are not the same and you're basically getting a european land cruiser instead of a four runner? Add in Lexus value, fit and finish, extra sound insulation, - a damn good looking truck, noot seeing yourself in every parking lot.... The list goes on. If you want a four runner - buy one. They are not the same car....
01-06-04, 08:13 AM
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I asked myself the same question, until I took a test drive in the 4runner. Here are a few of my observations. I found the body of the lexus, while not radically different, definitely has nicer lines than the toyota (frankly, I find the old toyota to be nicer than either the new toyota or lexus). I found both trucks to have more roll than I cared for. I'm more of a sports car person and am buying an suv for my wife because we need the space. I'm hoping the lexus i ordered with kdss resolves some of the roll issues. This system is not available on the toyota. I also think the standard suspension is better in the lexus than the toyota.
Biggest difference, hands down, was the interior. I've never considered buying a lexus in the past and was never overly impressed with their exterior styling. I knew they had a good reputation for service, which is important, and well known class-leading interiors. I now know where that reputation comes from. The leather is beautiful, abundance of wood is done very tastefully. Overall, just a beautiful cabin. Toyota, on the other hand, looks like they've uglied their interior just to create differences between the lines. They use a cheap, silver plastic trim that's supposed to offer a sporty look (salesmans term, not mine) to the car. Frankly, that's what really blew the sale for me.
I figured the difference much closer to the $5k figure, than the $9k figure. I'm not looking to **** away that kind of money either, but for the interior, loaner cars, and reputation for service, the money was worth it to me.
Biggest difference, hands down, was the interior. I've never considered buying a lexus in the past and was never overly impressed with their exterior styling. I knew they had a good reputation for service, which is important, and well known class-leading interiors. I now know where that reputation comes from. The leather is beautiful, abundance of wood is done very tastefully. Overall, just a beautiful cabin. Toyota, on the other hand, looks like they've uglied their interior just to create differences between the lines. They use a cheap, silver plastic trim that's supposed to offer a sporty look (salesmans term, not mine) to the car. Frankly, that's what really blew the sale for me.
I figured the difference much closer to the $5k figure, than the $9k figure. I'm not looking to **** away that kind of money either, but for the interior, loaner cars, and reputation for service, the money was worth it to me.
01-06-04, 10:39 AM
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Good comments. Thank's.
In terms of size the GX is a bit taller than the 4R but the 4R is a little longer. Both have the same wheelbase and construction, and built in the same plant. The price differential is over $8K when you add the DVD NAVI to the GX. But you also get a 3rd seat, rear air and two more speakers. All you get in the 4R is the DVD NAVI, rear camera and 10 speakers.
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Fit & finish of the Lexus seems more "refined" IMHO. And though I don't anticipate leaning on the dealer to be having my vehicle in for repairs too often a loaner car would be nice. And the vanity thing about owning a Lexus cannot be disputed. But aside from Ferrari's and Lamborgini's who really notices any SUV's as being a poser vehicle? Differents strokes for......
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Lexus got their start off the back of Toyotas reliability and dependibility so it didn't reinvent the wheel in this regard. And I got to admit it was nice not seeing a bunch of sleazeballs gathered up outside the Lexus dealership ready to pounce like I see at most toyota dealerships.
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But bottom line as I see it. The V8/5spd. is the top toyota and Lexus platform. I guess anything more than this you can select from a 4R SR5 ($30K) to a Lexus LS (over $50K). Diff strokes....... Interesting, that a base model 4R with the same platform and running train as the GX has a $15K price diff.
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Too many choices out there I guess.
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Whats a european Land Cruiser.??
In terms of size the GX is a bit taller than the 4R but the 4R is a little longer. Both have the same wheelbase and construction, and built in the same plant. The price differential is over $8K when you add the DVD NAVI to the GX. But you also get a 3rd seat, rear air and two more speakers. All you get in the 4R is the DVD NAVI, rear camera and 10 speakers.
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Fit & finish of the Lexus seems more "refined" IMHO. And though I don't anticipate leaning on the dealer to be having my vehicle in for repairs too often a loaner car would be nice. And the vanity thing about owning a Lexus cannot be disputed. But aside from Ferrari's and Lamborgini's who really notices any SUV's as being a poser vehicle? Differents strokes for......
.
Lexus got their start off the back of Toyotas reliability and dependibility so it didn't reinvent the wheel in this regard. And I got to admit it was nice not seeing a bunch of sleazeballs gathered up outside the Lexus dealership ready to pounce like I see at most toyota dealerships.
.
But bottom line as I see it. The V8/5spd. is the top toyota and Lexus platform. I guess anything more than this you can select from a 4R SR5 ($30K) to a Lexus LS (over $50K). Diff strokes....... Interesting, that a base model 4R with the same platform and running train as the GX has a $15K price diff.
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Too many choices out there I guess.
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Whats a european Land Cruiser.??
Last edited by pdonnell; 01-06-04 at 11:37 AM.
01-06-04, 03:20 PM
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Originally posted by pdonnell
The V8/5spd. is the top toyota and Lexus platform. I guess anything more than this you can select from a 4R SR5 ($30K) to a Lexus LS (over $50K). Diff strokes....... Interesting, that a base model 4R with the same platform and running train as the GX has a $15K price diff.
.
Too many choices out there I guess.
.
Whats a european Land Cruiser.??
The V8/5spd. is the top toyota and Lexus platform. I guess anything more than this you can select from a 4R SR5 ($30K) to a Lexus LS (over $50K). Diff strokes....... Interesting, that a base model 4R with the same platform and running train as the GX has a $15K price diff.
.
Too many choices out there I guess.
.
Whats a european Land Cruiser.??
the European Land Cruiser is a Toyota Land Cruise Prado which the GX uses it's body, where the Hilux Surf is what the 4Runner is.Only thing I would perfer on my 4Runner is the Hand Brake
and the 4Runner corners/handles better with X-Reas
Deciding between the 2 is really personal choice, what you perfer over something else, plus the money you have to spend on the Lexus might not be worth it to you, I don't know maybe your kid needs braces then get the "4" Runner
5k can cover the gas, maintenance, and insurance for several years
01-06-04, 03:27 PM
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Re: GS 470?
Originally posted by 177mph
Whats a GS470?
Ok. How about the fact that the dimensions are not the same and you're basically getting a european land cruiser instead of a four runner? Add in Lexus value, fit and finish, extra sound insulation, - a damn good looking truck, noot seeing yourself in every parking lot.... The list goes on. If you want a four runner - buy one. They are not the same car....
Whats a GS470?
Ok. How about the fact that the dimensions are not the same and you're basically getting a european land cruiser instead of a four runner? Add in Lexus value, fit and finish, extra sound insulation, - a damn good looking truck, noot seeing yourself in every parking lot.... The list goes on. If you want a four runner - buy one. They are not the same car....
thats what matters 
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01-06-04, 03:36 PM
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Edge2,
Thank's for the clarifications. I was speaking to a toyota internet sales Mgr. today and he offered $37900 before tax and reg. on a 4R with V8, DVD NAV, Camera, Air Bags, Moonroof etc..... He said its difficult to find such a loaded 4R with Air suspension or X-REAUS as well. A comparably equipped GX is pretty close to $51K MSRP. But you get some different things with it too.
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Since nameplate is pretty much an irrelevant issue with me. I'm leaning for the 4R as cost and value seem to be more compelling. However I find some irony in a Lexus owner putting down a Toyota since both are made side by side in the same plant. And all my BMW and MB friends put down the Lexus as a glorified Toyota. Which, I find hard to rebut.
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How do you like your 4R. My only gripe is the lack of memory seats. Otherwise the V8 LTD is a pretty good rig.
Thank's for the clarifications. I was speaking to a toyota internet sales Mgr. today and he offered $37900 before tax and reg. on a 4R with V8, DVD NAV, Camera, Air Bags, Moonroof etc..... He said its difficult to find such a loaded 4R with Air suspension or X-REAUS as well. A comparably equipped GX is pretty close to $51K MSRP. But you get some different things with it too.
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Since nameplate is pretty much an irrelevant issue with me. I'm leaning for the 4R as cost and value seem to be more compelling. However I find some irony in a Lexus owner putting down a Toyota since both are made side by side in the same plant. And all my BMW and MB friends put down the Lexus as a glorified Toyota. Which, I find hard to rebut.
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How do you like your 4R. My only gripe is the lack of memory seats. Otherwise the V8 LTD is a pretty good rig.
01-06-04, 03:42 PM
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Edge2,
Have to agree with your second comment. However, most people don't see it that way. Or, don't want to see it that way.
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My auto budding says that the RX and Highlander AWD V6 are manufactured in the same plant and per his manuals, body panels can be interchanged without modifying size or spec. He hates 'em both as (he says) both are nothing more than a fully loaded Camry with longer struts.
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But they just can't be the same as the RX is $7K more?
Have to agree with your second comment. However, most people don't see it that way. Or, don't want to see it that way.
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My auto budding says that the RX and Highlander AWD V6 are manufactured in the same plant and per his manuals, body panels can be interchanged without modifying size or spec. He hates 'em both as (he says) both are nothing more than a fully loaded Camry with longer struts.
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But they just can't be the same as the RX is $7K more?
01-06-04, 07:57 PM
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I too wondered the same thing for many months. I have owned Toyota sport utes and BMW cars for the past 10+years. I planned on replacing my '97 4Runner with an '03 4Runner until I saw how homely they were with the plastic cladding. Even after they dropped the plastic, I still couldn't get over the looks. My 4Runner had about 200K and I felt that I needed to do something. I looked at Sequoia (too big, no nav), X5 (great drive, expensive, dated styling, poor nav), MDX (minivan) LX(too big, expensive) Landcruiser (too big, rather plain interior) and GX (Bingo! except for rear swing door and "optional" 3rd seat).
With seats folded, the GX is shorter than my '97 in the back , GX is wider and taller. I'm not sure of this, but it seems that the GX is the existing Toyota Prado body dressed up and the 4Runner may be a new body.
I have had no regrets on the GX. I looked at the 4Runner LTD and felt the interior seemed cheaper than my '97 SR5 with leather. It seemed comparing apples to oranges, the diff was about $6K. I bought the GX in Sept 03, it's a '04, and now have about 10K on it and am happy. We are now a 4 Toy/Lex 4wd family (I kept the 4Runner, 216K now, as it runs great and looks good). I bought the Lexus because it's a Toyota.
Either one would be a good choice, I just liked the GX better.
With seats folded, the GX is shorter than my '97 in the back , GX is wider and taller. I'm not sure of this, but it seems that the GX is the existing Toyota Prado body dressed up and the 4Runner may be a new body.
I have had no regrets on the GX. I looked at the 4Runner LTD and felt the interior seemed cheaper than my '97 SR5 with leather. It seemed comparing apples to oranges, the diff was about $6K. I bought the GX in Sept 03, it's a '04, and now have about 10K on it and am happy. We are now a 4 Toy/Lex 4wd family (I kept the 4Runner, 216K now, as it runs great and looks good). I bought the Lexus because it's a Toyota.
Either one would be a good choice, I just liked the GX better.
01-06-04, 08:28 PM
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pdonnell
no problem, but I would never say anything bad about a GX, I actually think it's a pretty sweet vehicle at an added premium $37900 is an excellent price for a loaded 4Runner, when I got my 03 with Nav, rear air and X-Reas it was the only 1 equipped like this in the area, so at least I know it's unique the GX just did not have enough to make me want it over the 4Runner, I compared the 2 but had no problem leaving the Lexus dealer with my lighter and faster 4Runner
If cost and value is what you want then the 4Runner can do no better the resale value on them is crazy, you can buy 2 Explorers for what a 5 Year old Limited with 80k sells for and the V8/AWD has only gotten great reviews.
I don't get the whole car bashing but I guess that makes people feel better about their purchase, I for 1 like BMW, MB and Lexus and Im not about to go all 'MIT' and start breaking down cars and making comparisons
I mean in the end you just end up feeling stupid cause they really want to win the argument and your left with whats the point then a year later die hard MB owner buys a BMW and bashes everything he liked about MB so like I said whats the point.
The truck is great, I average 13mpg with a lead foot so don't judge fuel economy by my driving style although on the highway I get 20-22 doing about 75, I take full advantage of the power this truck offers and it sounds awesome when driven hard, no problems what so ever I just drive it day to day WOT and the reason I bought it was for the powertrain, I'll like the car a hell of a lot more even if I can't get passed a certain design if the performance is their, performance sell it for me not smoother lines.
I do wish it had memory seats, auto up and down on all the windows and a hand brake but other then that Im good.
Check out http://www.yotatech.com/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=2 lot of nice guys who would help you out and http://www.toyota-4runner.org/ is an awesome board which has a lot of 4th Gen 4Runners guys and oddly their seems to be more then a few guys on their with 4Runners who also own M3's between those 2 boards all your questions should be answered.
Don't really know the main differences between the Highlander and the RX but tell him it's not just a loaded Camry, it also has 4wheel drive and added ground clearance
no problem, but I would never say anything bad about a GX, I actually think it's a pretty sweet vehicle at an added premium $37900 is an excellent price for a loaded 4Runner, when I got my 03 with Nav, rear air and X-Reas it was the only 1 equipped like this in the area, so at least I know it's unique the GX just did not have enough to make me want it over the 4Runner, I compared the 2 but had no problem leaving the Lexus dealer with my lighter and faster 4Runner
If cost and value is what you want then the 4Runner can do no better the resale value on them is crazy, you can buy 2 Explorers
for what a 5 Year old Limited with 80k sells for and the V8/AWD has only gotten great reviews.I don't get the whole car bashing but I guess that makes people feel better about their purchase, I for 1 like BMW, MB and Lexus and Im not about to go all 'MIT' and start breaking down cars and making comparisons
I mean in the end you just end up feeling stupid cause they really want to win the argument and your left with whats the point then a year later die hard MB owner buys a BMW and bashes everything he liked about MB so like I said whats the point.The truck is great, I average 13mpg with a lead foot so don't judge fuel economy by my driving style although on the highway I get 20-22 doing about 75, I take full advantage of the power this truck offers and it sounds awesome when driven hard, no problems what so ever I just drive it day to day WOT
and the reason I bought it was for the powertrain, I'll like the car a hell of a lot more even if I can't get passed a certain design if the performance is their, performance sell it for me not smoother lines.I do wish it had memory seats, auto up and down on all the windows and a hand brake but other then that Im good.
Check out http://www.yotatech.com/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=2 lot of nice guys who would help you out and http://www.toyota-4runner.org/ is an awesome board which has a lot of 4th Gen 4Runners guys and oddly their seems to be more then a few guys on their with 4Runners who also own M3's between those 2 boards all your questions should be answered.
Don't really know the main differences between the Highlander and the RX but tell him it's not just a loaded Camry, it also has 4wheel drive and added ground clearance
01-06-04, 09:57 PM
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Edge2,
Thank's for the feedback and links. I agree about brand bashing. I buy streetbikes every year or two and its the same thing there. Everyones bike is the best. But really, there all pretty good. Diff strokes for.....
yunno.
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The GX is an awsome SUV. I think theres no way of losing here either way.
Thank's for the feedback and links. I agree about brand bashing. I buy streetbikes every year or two and its the same thing there. Everyones bike is the best. But really, there all pretty good. Diff strokes for.....
yunno.
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The GX is an awsome SUV. I think theres no way of losing here either way.
01-07-04, 10:27 AM
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Don't forget that the GX also gives you rain-sensing wipers, which is an extremely handy feature. You also get projector halogen headlights as opposed to reflector halogens in the 4runner. The GX also has a lever to adjust the 4wd system as opposed to the 4runner's dial in the dash. That 4x4 magazine preferred the lever.
Also remember that the Lexus offers the Mark Levinson audio, that, regardless of the amount of speakers, sounds extraordinarily great. It has been called one of the best systems you can buy in any car.
In addition to the air suspension the GX offers, it also has shock damper controls, which allows you to adjust the ride of the car. You can actually feel the difference in the several settings.
The 2004 GX also has a tire pressure monitoring system.
In favor of the 4runner, it has the lift reargate as opposed to the silly side-swinging gate on the GX.
Also remember that the Lexus offers the Mark Levinson audio, that, regardless of the amount of speakers, sounds extraordinarily great. It has been called one of the best systems you can buy in any car.
In addition to the air suspension the GX offers, it also has shock damper controls, which allows you to adjust the ride of the car. You can actually feel the difference in the several settings.
The 2004 GX also has a tire pressure monitoring system.
In favor of the 4runner, it has the lift reargate as opposed to the silly side-swinging gate on the GX.
01-07-04, 04:57 PM
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brent
all very good points but like I said I want performance, rain-sensing wipers are nice but if you get in a car and can't work the wipers get off the road, headlights are headlight long as you can see the road and I've actually read reviews on the ES that the projector headlights have a better field/view and don't have a cut off like the zenons and the 4x4 shift level of course a 4x4 mag is gonna like it, anything with a shift **** and a 4low is a plus in their book but I thought the the shift **** should have been in the 4Runner, anything upscale or considered luxury has a 4x4 dial.
Can't dispute the ML sound system, hell I would buy it cause Im not putting in aftermarket anything, I got the 10 speaker JBL.
In my opinion the GX does not have enough to get me as a buyer, maybe if I was not so hung up on cars it would not matter but if Im gonna spend 50k+ Im getting an LX470 with a TRD SC, or something German, I like options and the words fully loaded but now the GX does nothin for me, maybe in a few years, if Lexus sold GX's with TRD SC then sure why not.
Lexus does not seem to be having a problem selling the GX, at least here the dealer has 15 in stock that are sold a day after coming off the truck I would perfer my Toy dealer to offer better customer service they do offer loaner cars but I don't take my truck in for dealer recommended service I take it to lexus funny seeing a 4Runner among all the Lexus vehicles Lexus actually called me and asked why I would not take it to Toyota and I told them, their cool and charge the same Toyota would
Anyways Lexus and Toyota have a bright future ahead of them putting Ford out of business, I look forward to the next gen GS and an M5 fighter even an M3 fighter
all very good points but like I said I want performance, rain-sensing wipers are nice but if you get in a car and can't work the wipers get off the road, headlights are headlight long as you can see the road and I've actually read reviews on the ES that the projector headlights have a better field/view and don't have a cut off like the zenons and the 4x4 shift level of course a 4x4 mag is gonna like it, anything with a shift **** and a 4low is a plus in their book but I thought the the shift **** should have been in the 4Runner, anything upscale or considered luxury has a 4x4 dial.
Can't dispute the ML sound system, hell I would buy it cause Im not putting in aftermarket anything, I got the 10 speaker JBL.
In my opinion the GX does not have enough to get me as a buyer, maybe if I was not so hung up on cars it would not matter but if Im gonna spend 50k+ Im getting an LX470 with a TRD SC, or something German, I like options and the words fully loaded but now the GX does nothin for me, maybe in a few years, if Lexus sold GX's with TRD SC then sure why not.
Lexus does not seem to be having a problem selling the GX, at least here the dealer has 15 in stock that are sold a day after coming off the truck
I would perfer my Toy dealer to offer better customer service they do offer loaner cars but I don't take my truck in for dealer recommended service I take it to lexus funny seeing a 4Runner among all the Lexus vehicles Lexus actually called me and asked why I would not take it to Toyota and I told them, their cool and charge the same Toyota would Anyways Lexus and Toyota have a bright future ahead of them putting Ford out of business, I look forward to the next gen GS and an M5 fighter even an M3 fighter
01-07-04, 06:27 PM
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Edge2,
Thank's again for the 4R sites. Very exhaustive and detailed sites.
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I ended buying a 4R that I'll be signing for in a half hour. Basically its the LTD V8 4x4. MSRP with the "gold package" was a titch under $43k. I negotiated as if there was no "gold package" as who needs gold lettering.? My final sales price before tax and reg. was $37,950. Basically, about invoice with the gold package thrown in for free.
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I think the dial is more appropriate for the 4W.D. as its more of a luxury appointment than another shift ****. IMHO of course.
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The Levinson system of the GX and air suspension are awesome too. But theres no way I could justify the $8-$9 difference in both trucks when it got down to the nitty gritty. Wife really, really loves the back up camera of the 4R too.
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Anyways. both are great vehicles either way you slice it.
Thank's again for the 4R sites. Very exhaustive and detailed sites.
.
I ended buying a 4R that I'll be signing for in a half hour. Basically its the LTD V8 4x4. MSRP with the "gold package" was a titch under $43k. I negotiated as if there was no "gold package" as who needs gold lettering.? My final sales price before tax and reg. was $37,950. Basically, about invoice with the gold package thrown in for free.
.
I think the dial is more appropriate for the 4W.D. as its more of a luxury appointment than another shift ****. IMHO of course.
.
The Levinson system of the GX and air suspension are awesome too. But theres no way I could justify the $8-$9 difference in both trucks when it got down to the nitty gritty. Wife really, really loves the back up camera of the 4R too.
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Anyways. both are great vehicles either way you slice it.
Last edited by pdonnell; 01-07-04 at 06:27 PM.