bigbwb

I would be willing to take your GX460 off your hands in equal trade for my 2010 4runner. I would feel better knowing you are safe

I6turbo

iTrader: (1)

Not that I think Toyota has crashed by any means, but I've been saying since 2005 or so that it'll be very interesting to see how well Toyota is able to keep their $#!t together as they conquer the automotive world. Very, very few companies have ever been able to maintain what made them great in the face of wild success and growth. I recall seeing something a few years ago where TMC (Toyota Japan) was very concerned about this very thing, and the US guys were more full-speed-ahead with it.

fins0608

The general manager from my dealer told me today that they have sold 60 GX 460s. Of those 60, in the last three days, about 10 have been parked at the dealership for safety concerns and those owners have taken loaner cars. About 3 owners have outright returned the GX for an RX or an LX. The dealer will not refund the purchase price or otherwise rescind the purchase. The only choice is to trade (and in the case of an LX, pay about $20,000 more).

The general manager's "spin" on the issue is that when consumer reports put a "do not buy" rating on the Mitsubishi Montero, demand actually increased. He said that the GX is the last of off-road performers and that's what people want in an SUV, just like the Montero. He said that this issue will make the GX more in demand and that people expect some compromise when they buy a truly off-road vehicle versus one that is meant for highway driving. In his words, "the simple answer is that this car is going to get hotter." Uh huh.

GXHauler

Yeah dealers are really something... but they have to make the most of a bad situation... "Last off road performer" guess he never heard of Range Rover or LR4...

outbid81

I think I've read every post on this thread now and I think one thing here is being missed. This is a private company doing an independent test. I have read over and over again about a "miss-step" or "Toyota's arrogance", etc, but this SUV has passed every FEDERAL standard test there is. I could take any other SUV that passed this CR test and flip it in about 4 minutes. If it was as big a deal as half of the [those] on this site are claiming, who among you is going to be the first to run up the steps to Congress and say "Why didn't you protect us?". Why was Lexus allowed to sell 5000 of these "unsafe" vehicles before this came about? Non-issue. Enjoy your vehicle and feel good knowing you bought it from a company that responded so quickly.

I6turbo

iTrader: (1)

You mean you ain't skeered? I'm afraid to even meet one in oncoming traffic!

SaniDel

Auto Spies, which has typically been indifferent towards Toyota products, published the attached opinion that takes Consumer Reports to task ... not for their report, but for their motivation.

http://www.autospies.com/news/Come-O...s-GX460-53395/


It is interesting to consider how Consumer Reports rode the Toyota bandwagon and routinely recommended and top-rated almost all Toyota products ... until recently. At least eight previously recommended Toyota products are no longer recommended and now a new Toyota product has been "black-listed". Auto Spies' conclusion is it is hard to believe that Toyota went from the top of Consumer Reports' list to the bottom in such a short period of time.
Regards,

SaniDel


P.S. Once again ... in the interest of full disclosure ... I have been a life-long subscriber to Consumer Reports and have owned Lexus vehicles exclusively since 1996: six (6) LX(450 and 470), a SC 400, a LS 430, a RX 400h and now a GX 460 ... our tenth Lexus.

Not only owning Lexus vehicles exclusively, but also owning only one at a time! Much like the joke about ham and eggs ... the chicken is involved, but the pig is committed ... owning only one vehicle at a time since 1996 puts an entirely different perspective on reliability and customer service expectations.

I have no intention of canceling my subscription to Consumer Reports or selling my GX 460.

I6turbo

iTrader: (1)

Joking aside, I have a question for everyone who is worried about driving the GX: How many of you would have expected the vehicle to do more or less what it did in the video? If you drove way too hot into a corner and lifted the throttle at the last minute, would you not expect the big SUV to oversteer and slide, or do something other than defy physics and continue around the curve once you've gone in too hot and don't hit the brakes? If so, why would you be overly worried about driving it?

SaniDel

We received a second telephone call from Lexus of Wilmington ... this time from our Sales Representative ... the first call was from the Service Manager. Our Sales Representative was aware of that call, but called anyway. He wanted to be sure we knew we had the option to 'park' our GX 460 and to take a loaner, but we assured him that we declined the offer. We want to drive our truck, not to park it, but we won't be "doing donuts" ... he laughed!

Our Sales Representative confirmed that Toyota is testing the GX 460 in Arizona and in Japan as Consumer Reports' policy is not to duplicate tests for the benefit of manufacturers. As of his telephone call, he had no information about any resolution. He confirmed the suspension of production until the issue is resolved.

We exchanged recent anecdotes about the opinions of other GX owners and agreed that most owners have confidence in their vehicles and in Lexus. He told us about current GX 470 owners who are extending their leases until production and sales are resumed. We told him about a GX 470 owner who followed our GX 460 into a shopping center to ask about the new model.
Regards,

SaniDel


P.S. You are welcome to cite our experience with Koons Lexus of Wilmington in your discussions with your Lexus dealership. The Service Manager is Greg Ritter and our Sales Representative is Lance Bartel.

http://www.koonslexusofwilmington.com/


Needless to say, we are delighted with our dealership and continue to have confidence in Toyota and Lexus products. We have bought most of our Lexus vehicles at other dealerships in Arizona and Florida, but we are happy to have bought and serviced our GX 460 at Koons Lexus of Wilmington.

encore888

Moderator request: Please refrain from making personal comments. If you don't like certain posts, you can choose to ignore them, but please comment on the topic itself, not our valued members. Let's keep this discussion constructive, and thank you for helping make this a helpful/useful thread.

rlx101

If you make sharp turns at such speed in a TALL SUV = you deserve to roll over. Use common sense people!!! Is CR an automotive god? Am i to trust them over a team of engineers designing some of the most reliable cars on the road for more than 20 years?


Yes, what will happen - Lexus will have to offer big discounts to sell whatever they produced so far and people who ignore mass media propaganda and still have ability to think will go out and buy these cars for cheap. This is what happened so far with Toyota/Lexus line up, the sales are actually UP in 09/10! and not down.

P>S> To Jon Linkov from Consumer Research group: could you post the actual numbers from the test : speed at the turn, turning angle and time when VSC kicks in for ALL SUV's tested? I would like to see how far ahead the rest of the tested cars are.

gyung

iTrader: (1)

This sums up why I will not buy a Consumer Reports or panic because of their little stunt - in the end the manufacturer is there to make a safe vehicle to protect US so that we will continue to buy their cars. If Consumer Reports will not help a manufacturer protect the CONSUMER, who is CR trying to help?

Balooo2

Food for thought...
Based on what I read the CR testers do not share notes while testing o.k., but what if all the scores for the GX460 were high and the only issue was the VSC kicking in late?
CR stated they would re-evaluate the GX460 after Lexus made corrections.
Suppose after the fix CR gave the GX460 a recommended buy?

What a coup that would be for Lexus!

The final outcome I propose would not surprise me I test drove every luxury SUV availible and the GX460 was the best all around, all things considered...I truly believe if this stability thing had not occured that would have been their findings because its true.
Don't be too surprised, a recommended buy after the correction would be a win,win, win.
CR wins,Lexus wins and the owners/consumer wins.

CR's credabilty is beginning to take some heat (justified or not) in all this.

You heard it here first.

jinnjia

funny.....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ADx28mrhZlY

SaniDel

That is a good question ... for which there is no simple answer.

Consumer Reports' long-standing policy is not to test for either manufacturers or the government ... they claim to "show the cards as they fall" and to let the manufacturers, the government and the consumers sort it out in the marketplace. Here's more about how CR tests cars ... including some impressive "drift and burn". The GX 460 is not the only car they have gotten sideways ... watch the sub-video titled "Emergency Handling"!

http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/c...troduction.htm


Not only do they buy all their test cars anonymously from dealerships, but also they test them on their own track under their complete control. They routinely decline all requests to have their testing witnessed, duplicated or re-run for any party ... if that has been their policy and they have been consistent, then they are probably in the clear.

So, we can infer the answer to your question ... Consumer Reports will NOT help any manufacturer, but neither will they help the government. Their reports "speak for themselves" ... they may be more credible than other sources, but they are by no means 'official' nor 'mandatory' ... neither the manufacturers nor the government are required to respond to or even to acknowledge CR's results.

That leads to another interesting possibility ... what if Toyota completely ignored this? No, that doesn't sound right, but they are under no obligation to respond or even to acknowledge CR's reports. As Toyota's products have presumably passed all government standards, to do any more is at their discretion. Toyota made the decision to re-test their products, halt sales, suspend production, etc., but they could just as well have responded with "No Comment" ... and maybe they should. I suspect if this had happened a few months ago ... before sticking gas pedals, failing brakes and runaway cars ruined their reputation ... they would have!
Regards,

SaniDel