2024 GX 550 Discussion
06-17-23, 12:25 PM
#541
I imagine there is a reason, but I don't understand why the launch of the GX is so heavily pushing the impression that the new platform is some major leap in off road capability. I guess maybe it is just the easiest angle to get press? But stepping back and comparing the J150 platform to this GA-F platform from just an off-road perspective it is hard to see how the GA-F is significantly better. Just rolling back to a modern take on the 2010-2013 bumpers would give the GX better approach/departure angles than the GX550 (28 vs 25 and 25 vs 21) - and both the 550 and the '10-'13 460 are worse than the older 470 for both. 'But what about that rear locker?" you ask? The rear locker already exists in the J150 - Toyota just decides not to put it in the 2nd gen GX, but the could - they have them in LC's shipping out to Oceana and the UK. I am not an off-roader but I don't think a wider truck is better in the trails and the new GX550 is much wider than the 460. The gas milage is equally bad. The extra power is unlikely to help off-roading, the extra top end gears are unlikely to really matter, other than the breakover angle (23 vs 21), the GX550 doesn't look like it has many improved core attributes that more capable off-road.
On the flip side, it looks like the new GX is even less equipped on the Lux side of things. I am just confused about what this new GX really is about. Maybe the Overland exists as a halo to make people who by the premium feel like their GX is more legit - I could see that.
Also, I get that most buyers don't take any of these things off road and I am not arguing that Toyota should not innovate and just keep selling the 2nd gen until the end of time. This also doesn't mean that people won't prefer the extra power, or that the 10 speed is smoother (it isn't for better gas milage apparently), and that the wider truck means more interior comfort, and the new tech is more convenient (while I don't care, the lack of carplay in her GX is the single reason my wife might start getting a roving eye for something else), or that way more people will find the new look more appealing (gotta admit the GX460 either preface lift or after isn't really the best looking thing on the road - IMO the GX470 is much more attractive), but to promote this entirely new generation based on its improved offroad chops seem like much ado about (nearly) nothing.
On the flip side, it looks like the new GX is even less equipped on the Lux side of things. I am just confused about what this new GX really is about. Maybe the Overland exists as a halo to make people who by the premium feel like their GX is more legit - I could see that.
Also, I get that most buyers don't take any of these things off road and I am not arguing that Toyota should not innovate and just keep selling the 2nd gen until the end of time. This also doesn't mean that people won't prefer the extra power, or that the 10 speed is smoother (it isn't for better gas milage apparently), and that the wider truck means more interior comfort, and the new tech is more convenient (while I don't care, the lack of carplay in her GX is the single reason my wife might start getting a roving eye for something else), or that way more people will find the new look more appealing (gotta admit the GX460 either preface lift or after isn't really the best looking thing on the road - IMO the GX470 is much more attractive), but to promote this entirely new generation based on its improved offroad chops seem like much ado about (nearly) nothing.
The slightly wider truck isn't a big deal to me as I doubt this will be used by first owners on those extremely tight trails where width matters. I like the stance increase as it will give some stability on slopes.
The power is fairly nice, especially if people are gonna upsize the tires. Extra gears not so relevant unless it helps allow a very low first gear, haven't looked at ratios.
If they really wanted an off-roader the approach/departure would have to be much better. The Defender 110 dumps all over it in that regard (and most others really.) But the Defender will be a depreciation magnet and a maintenance nightmare down the road.
06-17-23, 01:15 PM
#542
I imagine there is a reason, but I don't understand why the launch of the GX is so heavily pushing the impression that the new platform is some major leap in off road capability. I guess maybe it is just the easiest angle to get press? But stepping back and comparing the J150 platform to this GA-F platform from just an off-road perspective it is hard to see how the GA-F is significantly better. Just rolling back to a modern take on the 2010-2013 bumpers would give the GX better approach/departure angles than the GX550 (28 vs 25 and 25 vs 21) - and both the 550 and the '10-'13 460 are worse than the older 470 for both. 'But what about that rear locker?" you ask? The rear locker already exists in the J150 - Toyota just decides not to put it in the 2nd gen GX, but the could - they have them in LC's shipping out to Oceana and the UK. I am not an off-roader but I don't think a wider truck is better in the trails and the new GX550 is much wider than the 460. The gas milage is equally bad. The extra power is unlikely to help off-roading, the extra top end gears are unlikely to really matter, other than the breakover angle (23 vs 21), the GX550 doesn't look like it has many improved core attributes that more capable off-road.
On the flip side, it looks like the new GX is even less equipped on the Lux side of things. I am just confused about what this new GX really is about. Maybe the Overland exists as a halo to make people who by the premium feel like their GX is more legit - I could see that.
Also, I get that most buyers don't take any of these things off road and I am not arguing that Toyota should not innovate and just keep selling the 2nd gen until the end of time. This also doesn't mean that people won't prefer the extra power, or that the 10 speed is smoother (it isn't for better gas milage apparently), and that the wider truck means more interior comfort, and the new tech is more convenient (while I don't care, the lack of carplay in her GX is the single reason my wife might start getting a roving eye for something else), or that way more people will find the new look more appealing (gotta admit the GX460 either preface lift or after isn't really the best looking thing on the road - IMO the GX470 is much more attractive), but to promote this entirely new generation based on its improved offroad chops seem like much ado about (nearly) nothing.
On the flip side, it looks like the new GX is even less equipped on the Lux side of things. I am just confused about what this new GX really is about. Maybe the Overland exists as a halo to make people who by the premium feel like their GX is more legit - I could see that.
Also, I get that most buyers don't take any of these things off road and I am not arguing that Toyota should not innovate and just keep selling the 2nd gen until the end of time. This also doesn't mean that people won't prefer the extra power, or that the 10 speed is smoother (it isn't for better gas milage apparently), and that the wider truck means more interior comfort, and the new tech is more convenient (while I don't care, the lack of carplay in her GX is the single reason my wife might start getting a roving eye for something else), or that way more people will find the new look more appealing (gotta admit the GX460 either preface lift or after isn't really the best looking thing on the road - IMO the GX470 is much more attractive), but to promote this entirely new generation based on its improved offroad chops seem like much ado about (nearly) nothing.
Additionally, if you put 35's on the GX550 it would not need to be regeared. It will have zero issues turning 35's with all that torque. The GX460 is begging for a regear with just 33's and its pretty much required for 35's(if you do all the other work to get em in there.)
Good discussion on the ‘24 announcement. I’ve been eyeing 4x4s for a while and am very drawn to the “value play” of the GX around 60k (as I think it’s a much better built vehicle than a Wrangler and Bronco for the same money).
One key distinction that discourages me from the new model is the apparent lack of KDSS in the base/Premium trim (as I’m not sure that I can justify $80k plus for the Overtrail).
I’m thinking this omission may make a current base model a better fit for my use case.
For those that know, how important is the omission of the KDSS outside of the Overtrail?
I’m looking for a stock 4x4 good for moderate trails in western Colorado. If I get the current model, I don’t mind replacing the tires/wheels and front bumper (and removing the side steps), but don’t want to do much more than that.
One key distinction that discourages me from the new model is the apparent lack of KDSS in the base/Premium trim (as I’m not sure that I can justify $80k plus for the Overtrail).
I’m thinking this omission may make a current base model a better fit for my use case.
For those that know, how important is the omission of the KDSS outside of the Overtrail?
I’m looking for a stock 4x4 good for moderate trails in western Colorado. If I get the current model, I don’t mind replacing the tires/wheels and front bumper (and removing the side steps), but don’t want to do much more than that.
Either that or just pop off one end link before you wheel. This is what I do on my F150 and it takes me like 3 minutes with hand tools. I leave the bar attached to the passenger side end link and just toss the drivers side link into the cab.
Lockers are nice, but with the very limiting approach/departure a lot of the things a locker helps you do will be ruled out.
The slightly wider truck isn't a big deal to me as I doubt this will be used by first owners on those extremely tight trails where width matters. I like the stance increase as it will give some stability on slopes.
The power is fairly nice, especially if people are gonna upsize the tires. Extra gears not so relevant unless it helps allow a very low first gear, haven't looked at ratios.
If they really wanted an off-roader the approach/departure would have to be much better. The Defender 110 dumps all over it in that regard (and most others really.) But the Defender will be a depreciation magnet and a maintenance nightmare down the road.
The slightly wider truck isn't a big deal to me as I doubt this will be used by first owners on those extremely tight trails where width matters. I like the stance increase as it will give some stability on slopes.
The power is fairly nice, especially if people are gonna upsize the tires. Extra gears not so relevant unless it helps allow a very low first gear, haven't looked at ratios.
If they really wanted an off-roader the approach/departure would have to be much better. The Defender 110 dumps all over it in that regard (and most others really.) But the Defender will be a depreciation magnet and a maintenance nightmare down the road.
06-17-23, 02:28 PM
#543
Exactly @Rommelromm . To @skrypj note, it isn't that there aren't some marginal improvements for off roading, but having gearing that might make it easier to roll with 35's is hardly a game changer to base off-roader messaging for a new product launch.
To me it is a more obvious line to go in with is power. "This new GX has the power you need to drive your active lifestyle!' and 'The new, more spacious GX, can take you and your loved ones on wherever life's adventure takes you' or some such claptrap. The clear advantages of the new GX over the 460 are:
1) Power. There is no question that the new GX has way more power.
2) Towing. No question, at least in the non lux trims that the new GX is a better tow vehicle. 8k rating means you can pull 6.5 to 7k no problem. So if you want to tow, this new GX will be a much better option.
3) Space. There is more space to take larger people and stuff comfortably.
4) Tech. The tech is way more up to date, and much more cleanly integrated into the design and layout of the new GX.
But really none of these clear advantages are directly about off roading. It will be interesting to see if TLC or whomever will do off road tests between a stock '10-'13 GX and the new GX550 and see how they both compare on fairly difficult courses to see if there really is much of a practical improvement.
To me it is a more obvious line to go in with is power. "This new GX has the power you need to drive your active lifestyle!' and 'The new, more spacious GX, can take you and your loved ones on wherever life's adventure takes you' or some such claptrap. The clear advantages of the new GX over the 460 are:
1) Power. There is no question that the new GX has way more power.
2) Towing. No question, at least in the non lux trims that the new GX is a better tow vehicle. 8k rating means you can pull 6.5 to 7k no problem. So if you want to tow, this new GX will be a much better option.
3) Space. There is more space to take larger people and stuff comfortably.
4) Tech. The tech is way more up to date, and much more cleanly integrated into the design and layout of the new GX.
But really none of these clear advantages are directly about off roading. It will be interesting to see if TLC or whomever will do off road tests between a stock '10-'13 GX and the new GX550 and see how they both compare on fairly difficult courses to see if there really is much of a practical improvement.
06-17-23, 11:12 PM
#544
Planning to drag the belly isnt much of a plan. I guess the locker could help force the issue but I really dont see too many new GX550 owners doing that. If youre hung up you should back off of it and try another line.
06-18-23, 05:22 AM
#545
Instructor
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Reading the Toyota global GX press release and information it appears the 550 overtrail is the top of line model now (above the luxury) and it also appears to be getting the same off-road suspension seats (Albeit in disguise) as the new Tacoma Trd pro to limit body movement and head wobble in off-road situations .
06-18-23, 07:05 AM
#547
Driver School Candidate
06-18-23, 07:17 AM
#548
Check this thread, https://www.clublexus.com/forums/car...-550-a-39.html, starting at post #575. @TexasFunRunner did an amazing analysis on the dimensions discrepancies between the US and global releases.
Last edited by CCTX; 06-18-23 at 07:30 AM.
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06-18-23, 07:44 AM
#549
Check this thread, https://www.clublexus.com/forums/car...-550-a-39.html, starting at post #575. @TexasFunRunner (https://www.clublexus.com/forums/mem...funrunner.html) did an amazing analysis on the dimensions discrepancies between the US and global releases.
WIDTH:
Overall Width without the mirrors - 77.95"
Overall Width with the mirrors - 83.22"
LENGTH:
Overall Length without the rear bumper trailer hitch cover - 194.88"
Overall Length with the rear bumper trailer hitch cover - 197.04"
06-18-23, 07:52 AM
#550
Driver School Candidate
Originally Posted by TexasFunRunner;[url=tel:11526308
11526308[/url]]@CCTX, thank you, I've wasted way too much time and energy trying to figure out the mess of published Lexus documents. They clearly are using the low bidder publishing house with non-technical and non-car people and then are not having actual Lexus Technical people reviewing the final documents, all in the name of cost cutting. My measurements and information have evolved with input from other forum members, thank you to all of them. Here is a current summary, of course subject to change, depending what Lexus publishes in their final full technical specs.
WIDTH:
Overall Width without the mirrors - 77.95"
Overall Width with the mirrors - 83.22"
LENGTH:
Overall Length without the rear bumper trailer hitch cover - 194.88"
Overall Length with the rear bumper trailer hitch cover - 197.04"
WIDTH:
Overall Width without the mirrors - 77.95"
Overall Width with the mirrors - 83.22"
LENGTH:
Overall Length without the rear bumper trailer hitch cover - 194.88"
Overall Length with the rear bumper trailer hitch cover - 197.04"
Im happy to see the new GX hasnt grown as much as the published specs may have initially indicated.
For my own self interested reasons (as in, garage height issues), Im actually most curious about the total height. Theres a 2 discrepancy between the Toyota press release and Lexus ordering guide.
06-18-23, 07:56 AM
#551
Thank you for all your work on this.
Im happy to see the new GX hasnt grown as much as the published specs may have initially indicated.
For my own self interested reasons (as in, garage height issues), Im actually most curious about the total height. Theres a 2 discrepancy between the Toyota press release and Lexus ordering guide.
Im happy to see the new GX hasnt grown as much as the published specs may have initially indicated.
For my own self interested reasons (as in, garage height issues), Im actually most curious about the total height. Theres a 2 discrepancy between the Toyota press release and Lexus ordering guide.
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06-18-23, 10:42 AM
#552
@CCTX, thank you, I've wasted way too much time and energy trying to figure out the mess of published Lexus documents. They clearly are using the low bidder publishing house with non-technical and non-car people and then are not having actual Lexus Technical people reviewing the final documents, all in the name of cost cutting. My measurements and information have evolved with input from other forum members, thank you to all of them. Here is a current summary, of course subject to change, depending what Lexus publishes in their final full technical specs.
WIDTH:
Overall Width without the mirrors - 77.95"
Overall Width with the mirrors - 83.22"
LENGTH:
Overall Length without the rear bumper trailer hitch cover - 194.88"
Overall Length with the rear bumper trailer hitch cover - 197.04"
WIDTH:
Overall Width without the mirrors - 77.95"
Overall Width with the mirrors - 83.22"
LENGTH:
Overall Length without the rear bumper trailer hitch cover - 194.88"
Overall Length with the rear bumper trailer hitch cover - 197.04"
By the way, any estimates on the ground clearance?
06-18-23, 12:23 PM
#554
No KDSS in any of the models but the Overtrail? If that is true then LOL!
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06-18-23, 05:47 PM
#555
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