MR_F1

^^^Lexus does not need such a car, that is why Toyota and models like the blade, exists

LexFather

cliffud

iTrader: (3)

whoa 278hp in a car the size of a versa? that thing is gonna be a little rocket.

xioix

That is the type of interior in the other market Corolla, if we had that here it would've have been really nice

Nextourer

You're right. The Auris is basically the Corolla Hatchback. The Blade is basically the Auris with the 3.5 litre V6 heh heh heh.

It's the Corolla Hatchback.

ndk83

Lexus exists because Toyota wanted to enter the luxury market but needed to rebrand its cars so brand concious buyers wouldnt think toyota (atleast in the states and europe.) It worked and many manufactorers followed suite. ( Infiniti started it all i beleive??)

Ofcourse they need a car like that. The hotch hatch market is huge and all of its competition offer hatches. BMW, Audi and Benz all have small hatches that make up a large percentage of their sales volume. Its a very good market segment to enter. Lexus gotta compete. Although it fares well in the states, It gets eating alive in Europe.

BTW do you thik anyless of a SL65 Mercedes Benz AMG blackseries because MB also make an A 180 diesel?

Bring on the super hatches

MR_F1

You missed my point. I'm not saying it would make Lexus any lesser of a brand (though you do realize that most of the small cars by MB/BMW etc never reach the US for that reason right?), I'm saying they simple do not need THOSE volume sales because the hot hatch segment already has a good representation from Toyota. MB, BMW do not have sub brands to sell cars to that audience. Lexus, does. Would it make sense to release a Lexus badged blade at the price of an IS? Makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.
Maybe you also missed the fact that Lexus is moving toward using their own platform for their cars and no longer sharing platforms with Toyota? [Only their SUVS will continue to share platforms, the next gen ES will move to it's own platform]

In short, a blade based Lexus hybrid is completely unrealistic.

ndk83

Im still gonna disagree with you on whether it makes sense for the to rebadge a toyota hatch and drop in a hybrid, maybe it makes more sense for the European and Asian markets. The reason i volunteered the blade, is cause it already has a lexus interior feel to it, its fast as bollocks and they dont really need to change much just throw on an L and they are golden. No other car in the toyota line up could qualify(hatches). Also usually first gens Lexuses are toyota platform and second gen they can develop their own platform, once they develop a customer base and sales take off

Here is my reasoning for it introducing one

A. toyota sells the blade in japan only.SO its not like a rebadged blade in the US and europe will be cannabalizing sales. But lets forget the Blade for a second. lets talk about any Toyota hot hatch (emphasis on the word HOT)
B. toyota hatches/eco boxes are usually quite boring to drive (i know im driving a corrola these days). Id be very interested in a high performance hatch from lexus. So would many others. again not necesserilly americans.
C. Hot hatches are HUGE in europe and lexus/toyota really doesnt offer any cars that compete in that segment. Its a big market.
D. The smaller cars are starting to make their way states side esp since gas prices are on the rise. Also MB and BMW's smaller cars are usually quite expensive compared to their japanese counterparts and dont forget if anyone can make americans start to appreciate hot hatches, it would be toyota/lexus. However I do agree it is a very difficult type of car to make a case for selling it in the US


However u raised a valid pt that I was not aware of this. I know the IS and GS are not based on any toyota models so i understand what ur saying, but i wasnt aware that they will be moving away from sharing all platforms. Im actually interested in this,where did u get this info ?do you have any articles? websites? Always interested in reading about these things

ST430

Please show proof of this with actual data.....

Faymester

you are aware gas has been expencive in the EU for a long time already yea?

i agree (with the reasoning you gave further down as well)

this is not to say i think lexus shouldnt have a wagon ... i definitely think lexus needs a wagon (again), in the GS/ES size to go up against the likes of the A6, 5series & E-klasse

IMO, the 'entry level efficient' car need not look like an econo-box, it can look cool & lexus like AND be efficient & 'affordable' (tho if you were really going for afforable you would be at the toyota dealership)

i also have to say, if we start seeing cars that are both a lex and a toy just w. different badges, then lex is regressing back to the arena that acura/honda and infiniti/nissan are in ... im happy that the ES and the Camry are no longer completely interchangible (tho to a certain extent ...)

Koma

iTrader: (3)

Did you guys forget that the Matrix was originally a Corolla Matrix? The Matrix is essentially a hatch/wagon variant of the Corolla.

pbm317

Matrix is still technically named the Toyota Corolla Matrix according to the Window sticker, allows Toyota to lump the sales numbers together.

ndk83

Ok didnt exactly have time to do this properly as im at work but here is some old date. It doesnt show sales volume but does show production, and we can all assume production is correlated with sales

Segments B + C account for 50.8% of all cars produced. Like i said hatch segment is a lucrative segment in Europe.

Toyota wont have a blade or sale in europe, lexus could introduce their version. Both will benefit. Although i dont have figures for hothatches, Having a Regular Hatch and a high performace version of that hatch, Lexus wont be viewed as a poor mans luxury car but a company capable of performance cars that could rape the likes of the R32 and co. This would in turn breath new life into their brands regular hatch sales.

ndk83

Im not adfvocating that both Toyota and LExus sell the Blade in Europe with diff badges, Just that lexus does it. Toyota can sell the Yaris Corrolla and Auris. Lexus can sell the Blade. The volume seller can be the 1.8l hybrid and the top of line image and brand image booster the 3.5l v6 that couldrun circles rount most cars on the roads of europe. Yes this could take potential customers away from the IS, but it seems to me that the IS buyers in europe tend to be middle age proffessionals who want a classy, comfortable and quiet ride and dont care much for speeding and showing off. For the ones that due then there always is the ISF.

Big Andy

The Toyota Auris is bigger inside than the Lexus IS - it's been on sale in Europe for a while now. It's a direct replacement for the Corolla. The Corolla name was dropped due to its reputation as a boring car for elderly drivers. To be honest, the Auris is not a great car compared to the competition from Ford, VW or GM - too many poor quality plastics and trim. Handling, performance and economy are just so-so. They do do a hot hatch version using the 2.2 litre diesel engine called the SR that delivers real world performance with 50mpg economy, but there a re still better diesels for your money.

I can't see it being re-badged as a Lexus - it shares no design clues with L-finesse and just sticking in nicer seats and trim is just going to add fuel to the belief that Lexus are just posh Toyotas.