Heuristix

I use a JuiceBox 40 charger for my 2023 450h+.
I am observing a consistent large discrepancy between how many kWh the JuiceBox is supplying to charge the car (according to the Enel X Way app) vs the kWh the Lexus app is reporting.
For example from empty (i.e., when the car has switched from EV mode to HV mode) to full, the JuiceBox app always reports between 14.7 to 14.9 kWh.
For the same charging session the Lexus app always says 30% to100% - 9.66 kWh.

Can anybody with a similar setup as mine please check?
Thanks

mangust

I use Emporia. According to it's app a full charge is about 13.5 kWh. Though I recall a couple occasions where it went over 14 kWh.
The charger's app should be more accurate as it reports the actual consumption of the electricity used.

Heuristix

Thanks.
Have you checked what the Lexus app is reporting for the same charging session?
I agree that the charger app is accurately stating the amount of kWh consumed, However if the car is only using 65% of the energy being supplied, that is genuinely concerning for me.

mextreme

I have seen similar posts - I see the same results using a ChargePoint EVSE. Usually around 13.6 kWh for full charge and the car reports 30-100 at 9.66 kWh

It's a bug / issue with how the car is measuring / calculating the kWH - in my opinion.

mangust

The rated capacity of the battery is about 18 KWH. However, the battery management system will keep it from fully draining as it drastically reduces battery life.
When 450H reports 0 miles of EV range left and switches to the hybrid mode, the battery is still at about 25-30%. I think someone here calculated that of 18 KWH only about 14 KWH is used.
The rest is preserved to extend the lifetime of the battery. A typical level 2 charger is about 90% efficient; your numbers are in line with that.

chuuck1e

This mean that it will take more kw to charge the battery than you will actually get into the battery for usage, correct?

I read that level 1 charges are even less efficient.

I have been trying to compare the cost (kw/gas) of driving a 450h+ compared to the cost of driving a 350h. It sounds like I would need to include efficiency losses in my calculations.

mangust

Correct. DC charging (not applicable to our PHEV) is most efficient, but no charger is 100%.

Efaraday

Heuristic,

I just saw your post, and I find the same. I have owned the 2024 NX450h+ for about 2 months, and have checked the charge energy several times. I use the supplied charger and an inline watt-hour meter. The Lexus app s WAY OFF. I always charge from about 30% battery level to 100%. The app reads about 10 kWh and the inline watt-hour meter about 15 kWh. Big discrepancy. How do I know my inline watt-hour meter is accurate? I have checked it against my bill from the power company here, which supplies very detailed power delivery, and it agrees with my watt-meter meter. When one uses this accurate electricity usege, it means that here where we live the electricity cost is about that of the gasoline for equal distance traveled.

I don’t know what the kWh reported by the app means, but it certainly is not the energy needed to charge the battery. My guess is that it is an example of auto companies of skewing mileage claims for marketing reasons. But by 50 percent?!

LuxNx

NX 450h + battery is divided into Two portions:
The rechargeable one of 14,9 kWh and the Reserved Hybrid one self charging during drive of 3,2 kWh.
​​​​​​The rechargeable one is giving a Max range of 75 up to 95 km during Summer/Hot season and down to 65 up to 75 km during Winter/Cold season.
Best recharging performance is obtained with longer charging time of around 8,5 hours at 230/240 V when connected to a domestic charging plug with 2,1 A, and max charging setting selected from car infotainment.
Quick charging at 22 kWh station is giving a bit less with 13, 2-13,5 kWh in 2, 5-2-75 hours.
Such numbers were recorded through past Two years of use.
The NX Plugin is giving its Best during Hot Season with Summer tires.

Efaraday

Buongiorno LuxNx,

Thank you for the info on the parts of the battery, I’ve not heard that. These kinds of details are difficult to find, it seems. As to your EV ranges, they seem other-worldly. I would be happy with 40 miles in the summer. That’s about 75 km, if I recall the conversion. The Lexus-supplied 120 volt charger takes about 11.5 hours to charge my car.

Do you have a source for more technical information on the EV drive mode? White papers, Lexus technical bulletins?

I still wonder why the Lexus app is so useless when reporting the kWh used when charging.

LuxNx

I think Yoou can search through Toyota
​​​​​Tech NA web site.
I'm used to Toyota Tech Eu, were I'm subscribed as Owner.
Technical infos and large Map updates are searchable and download is free of charge during Grace period.
Grace period has different coverage related to the car model, infotainment Type,... and may change by Markets/Countries.
As Owner I can download also paid services if needed and I used it a couple of Times using the 1 hour paied option at something equal to 5 bucks.
You have to try and check on Your side, as My VIN is not working as not for US/NA.
Besides, 11.5 hours recharging time is happening when charging at 120V.
You should use a 208V minimum, like the plug for tumblerdriers buying a domestic charging cable for such Voltage. You can check on Amazon online shop.
My values are coming either from public recharging stations that provvide detailed information either via invoice or their App on selfphone.
If You use domotics, You can easily monitor the plug You plug-in when recharging your car at home.

Efaraday

LuxNx,

Thank you, I’ll look into sites for Lexus tech, but might be directed to a Toyota site, since drive train is identical to Toyota's RAV4 Prime.

LuxNx

You can Connect to Lexustech NA too, Web server and Service are always in common with Toyota.
Features are differenti as Lexus is more Premium brand.