VVRX

This I agree with and the possible addition of an 8 speed transmission.

markrivers

^ No car can excel on all fronts. luxury OR not

a 330,000 Ferrari can give you less than 3 seconds of 0-60 BUT not great fuel economy.
You can't have 5 people in it.
You can't haul a lot if stuff either, heck, i doubt if that thing can even tow.
LAst not but not the least, you can't do OFF ROADING.

basically, what I'm trying to say is, something has to give.
and i listed the Range Rover Supercharged, the X5 M5 etc because right now, your NEED is to pull away from the other cars/SUV.

Most buyers of a 450h, whether they admit it or not, likes the fuel economy especially in the city.

Droid13

LOL, seems to me you are. Everyone else with those luxury cars is trying to do the same thing, so you're in an arms race now. You either have to compromise and maintain the peace or go for a nuclear first strike and don't settle for less than 500HP.

I'm fortunate, I can sometimes go weeks without seeing another Lexus or Mercedes as I stay out of the core city most of time, so I can pretend to be King of the roads more often

That said, I think the RXh would be an absolutely awesome vehicle if it had about 330 to 350HP, if they could do that without sacrificing economy. But it will never be king of the hill given it's weight and the fact that, at it's core, it's designed for economy. They could do it with the RX350, but I think mainly for marketing position the RX450h is given a bit more power because it's heavier and more costly it needs to keep it's relative position at least on paper.

Aptosuser

No shortage of luxury cars around here; lots of Lexus(es), hybrid and otherwise, lots of Beamers and Mercedes, plus Audis, Porsche Cayennes, and even more than a few Volts and Teslas. (Full disclosure: We also have Prius(es) seemingly rounding every corner.) But I never feel humbled pulling away from stoplights, where 0-60 time seems less meaningful. After all, who tries to accelerate to 60 mph pulling away from a stoplight in a 25-35 mph zone? And if another driver is really intent on "beating" me off the mark, it's no matter to me, especially seated in the cloistered confines of my RX 450h. (One of the reasons why I love the car.) All I care about is having ample power to merge safely onto freeways and ascend hills, with reasonable fuel economy and lots of creature comfort thrown into the bargain for good measure. Our RX 450h meets all these requirements better than any car I've previously owned. It's not a racehorse and isn't meant to be.

cflutist

Well said. I feel the same way and am happy to even own this car.

ericsan13

I really am not. If I were, it would be easy to do as I would just press down the accelerator and go. 0-60 is just an indicator of acceleration - I am not doing 0-60 at every stoplight.

Anyway, it seems like I am the minority as people here care more about things other than the powertrain:
https://www.clublexus.com/forums/rx-...h-your-rx.html

Still one can hope for a more competitive time. The GS450h has both power and fuel economy...at this rate I may switch to that!

kitlz

ericsan13, it sounds like you'll be happier with the GS450h. I'm with everyone else who feels the power in the RX450h is fine. In fact I feel better not being the one to take off from a light like a rocket. Not to say I haven't done it before. But I'm more into sitting back and enjoying the ride instead of trying to save a few seconds of my life here and there.

ericsan13

But I love my RX...except it feels slow (to me). The power isn't for immaterial time savings, but for the feeling of power. I would sacrifice MPG from the RX450h if it meant going up hills, getting on freeways, and getting up to speed felt more effortless.

I like the ride height, AWD, and cargo room which GS does not have. Guess you can't have it all!

-Eric

Aptosuser

I'd rather use less gas and enjoy a few more seconds in my nice car.

Aptosuser

Well, you could keep the RX 450h for when you want to sit high and carry stuff and get a GS 450h for when you feel the urge to go up against the Porsches, Audis, BMWs, Maseratis and the occasional cop car.

vlad_a

450h will not be getting an 8-speed transmission. In short, Lexus Hybrid Drive is simply different a technology.

ericsan13

Looks like BMW is benefiting more from Toyota's hybrid tech than Lexus is getting from BMW's turbo tech!
http://www.thetorquereport.com/2014/..._prototyp.html

X5 Plug-in Hybrid - 74.3mpg EU cycle, CO2 90 g/km, 0-62 mph in less than 7s
RX450h - 44.8mpg EU cycle, CO2 145 h/km

Really hope the next RX450h can step it up...thoughts?

vlad_a

Toyota is a very conservative company. That's a requirement for reliability they are known for. Take that away, and they have no business. They are reluctant to change what works very well. With RX far surpassing X5 sales, it is highly unlikely for a big change in the foreseeable future.

ericsan13

Thanks vlad, you are probably right, but I will still hope that you are wrong. I thought Toyota and Lexus are supposed to be diverging more and more.

If they allow BMW to beat them in hybrid tech, the RX will lose it's competitive advantage as the MPG leader in the luxury midsize CUV space and they could potentially lose a lot of sales.

vlad_a

Toyota sales are dominating based on reliability. They have proven many times over, they can build whatever boring cars they want, and people will still buy them. Hey, they we still have the proven Ni-Mh batteries while everybody else got Li-Ion. No direct injection either. Both are in the name of proven reliability. And that's why I bought yet another Lexus and passed on a BMW X5.

The X5 would have been a lot more fun to drive, but if I am to spend over $50K on a vehicle, it better last me a while. And with a hectic schedule, last thing I would want is to have any warranty work done.

My point is, Lexus is not likely to loose many sales to a BMW plug-in hybrid, especially considering BMW pricing.