mikesrx350

hi all, had a chance to drive an f sport for half hour today and a hybrid ill give my thoughts below in no random order

F sport
1) nice combo of ride quality vs handling balance, similar ride quality to my wifes 5 series
2)nice power train with 8 speed and motor. nicely calibrated
3) nice job with power steering an improvement over last model year but still to soft
4) beautifully executed interior, seats comfortable, nav nice didn't notice glare in sun others chatting about, did notice with polarized glasses view different
5) handling in corners very nice, great for a fwd car, almost as good as a rwd platform.. this is a big accomplishment
6) mark levinson sound system huge disappointment with , felt like too much forward bias sound, yes i checked the settings..
7) beautiful exterior with wheels, body work i drove it in nebula grey.. beautiful car
8) arm rest on left and right side very nice for driver. not as good as new ls but close
9) f sport seat comfy and sporty at same time, not for me for long drives ill share more with hybrid thoughts
10) ventilated a/c in seats fantastic
11) car was quiet and ride composed, got in my wifes 5 series that i think lexus benchmarked and it was close still the nod to 5 series in ride, but smoothness nod to lexus
Overall rating from 1-10 give the care 8.75 amazing job lexus did on the car.. truly great accomplishment for 50k
12) gauge cluster nice, when i floored it was expecting red layout it was bright orange nice touch
13) the direct shift transmission was very very good, noticed my wifes 5 series ZF transmission still a bit smoother
14) the nav interface with controller is much improved with a little challenge compared to IDrive on Bmw
15) noticed the map screen is much improved with look compared to last gen but still looks years behind all 3 german manufacturers.
16) confused on button to change from regular to sport same as LS seems you have to take hand off steering wheel and elevated makes no ergonomic sense to me.

Hybrid
1) surprise how quiet vs previous gen
2) seats 20 percent more comfortable and more cushioned a huge plus for me i will probably get a 54 k ultra luxury version with the 14 way power seats
3) power is average and will disappoint if your an enthusiast, if expectations right a great power train
4) surprised on how gauges were lit up with sport colors in red in sport setting nice
5) ride more composed than f sport but both ride quality was A-


amazing execution. again the ML sound system disappointed vs expectations.

Mike728

Just curious. What was your source input when listening to the ML? Did you disable surround?

mikesrx350

no the salesmen had it on
and was listening to xm radio on multiple channels
not bad but very disappointed

SuperMido

Thanks for the detailed review! However, I'm just confused on a couple points, would hope if you can elaborate a bit;

11 in f-sport, you said you give the ride to the 5 series and smoothness to ES. What do you mean by that? I thought a better ride was a smoother ride! At-least thats how I think of it.

And 5 on the hybrid review; In what way was the ride more composed in the hybrid?

Also, which one seemed to eat up the bumps and imperfections better? Thanks!

mikesrx350

11 in f-sport, you said you give the ride to the 5 series and smoothness to ES. What do you mean by that? I thought a better ride was a smoother ride! At-least thats how I think of it. Answer: When i got back in the 5 series it seemed like i was more elevated an floating compared to the f Sport. The F sport was amazingly controlled with a sportier edge than the base 528 bmw with 17 inch rims. And its hard to beat a ride of rwd vs fwd no matter how advanced the suspension is.

And 5 on the hybrid review; In what way was the ride more composed in the hybrid? The Hybrid seemed more relaxed and tuned for ride quality vs f sport which struck a balance between the handling / ride... i really enjoyed both, the deal breaker for me is the f sport seats are good but not for me to live in 6 hours a day.

Also, which one seemed to eat up the bumps and imperfections better? Thanks! the hybrid ride quality i gave a 9 the f sport 8.5 very surprised on the f sport .

SuperMido

Awesome! Thanks again for all the details.

Mike728

You can't use XM with ML, or any other higher end sound system. XM is highly compressed. It's comparable to <64mbps MP3's. ML is very good at bringing out the detail in music. So, sh#t in equals sh#t out. I've had XM in all my vehicles since it came out. My ML equipped ES is the first one I didn't renew after the trial.

chromedome

I guess it would be better to skip ML if you listen mainly to XM or low bitrate MP3s. The stock audio system is already very good, I would just replace the sub if you're into bass-heavy music.

mikesrx350

Had some time think about yesterdays drives in the hybrid and f sport and after reflecting it was interesting what came to mind

I think Lexus over the last 7 years has deviated from their winning formula of simple perfect execution externally and internally

the 19 Es restores what the brand is about in a lot of ways.. great value, great execution and nice technology

The job lexus did with the ride characteristics of the cars is truly remarkable for front wheel drive

The technology focus and layout is nicely done but it is apparent they still are behind the germans in look and execution

Im not sold on the v6 base model with 8 speed and 24mpg being the future of the car, the sport if driven hard will get about 21 mpg combined seems to me there is fuel cell or electric in the pipeline i can't see this as a way to compete with offerings with Audi, Mercedes and BMW in the next three years

The story continues but buyer beware of non hybrid purchases this is not the future of powertrains or economy, they still are lagging competitors

SuperMido

Money and reliability both play a HUGE factor as to why Lexus seems to be "behind" the competition. We're talking about a car, FULLY loaded coming at the starting MSRP of those German competitors. Now, if Lexus had an extra $12-$15K budget to play with for the ES, I bet it would easily compete with the Technology of the Germans.

Now, you also have to factor in reliability, Lexus built its name on a bunch of factors; one of the biggest was how RELIABLE those cars are. Germans are simply not reliable because they're racing time with Technology and advancements. Lexus chooses to take the safe reliable route.

I'm honestly impressed with the reviews from real users like yourself about this new ES. And all I'm looking for is a nice, comfortable, soft, quite, luxurious ride. I could care less about fuel economy.

mikesrx350

then you will be jumping head over heels for the hybrid

quiet
capable
value
and superb driving dynamics to relax and listen to non xm radio on the levinson

forgot to mention when $$ get brought up shame on lexus for adding 1500 for triple led headlights on all the cars i saw
they are playing games with options to monetize

biglexfan

May I know what is the wheel size of the two test drive cars? I wonder if the issue of 17" vs 18" is still relevant in this new ES.

mikesrx350

hi they both had 18 inch rims, i noticed on the hybrid they had the 500 option hollow wheels 18 inch

i believe the hybrid had michelins the f sport had bridgstones

i didn't do a great a job of explaining the ride quality the other day.

both cars track well, are very composed. I think what really struck me is the solidity of the suspension and the feeling that anyone that has owned German cars always felt. I don't know what the structural ridgitiy is in HZ, the germans were always way past the japanese manufacturers over the years, but it seems from the reading i have done that lexus has buttoned this up with the glues and laser welds that have been reported.

What i also enjoyed was the lateral movements have been minimized. meaning in past es 350 loaners they were really good with ride quality and also with deviations in the road quality smoothing out the movements left to right you feel in the car
it seems this has improved by a nice margin. as example its one of the things that attracted me to my wifes 5 series years ago and now with 100k on the clock i noticed the movements left to right have increased dramatically. My comments the other day were commenting on this with the smoothness thoughts.

The way Lexus set up the suspensions they really have a car in the ES for everyone that is not an all out enthusiast. if thats the case look elsewhere.
The steering is improved with the movement of the electric power steering system from the old gen, but if you compare the steering feel of the new g20 coming out in 6 weeks bmw 3 series, you will see that the artificial feeling in the new ES can't compete with the steering feel of the new generation BMW's coming out.

SuperMido

Another very nice detailed post. Thanks!

But I'm pretty sure the F-Sport rides on Standard 19" wheels.

mikesrx350

not sure just remember the f sport had rims not totally chrome had paint on inside
and the hybrid had 18 inch 500 option with noise reduction