Christobol

I'm glad that you did such a through job of looking at cars. I looked at the A4, 2001 and 2002. I decided that the reliability of an Audi was just too low for me to spend more money on the car. I would LOVE to have the quatro though, but I also need a car that is going to last 5 years or more. My girlfriend's car is only 3 weeks old and already she is having electrical problems with her rear lights (one light goes out when she has her normal beams on, but when the highs were on the lights were fine). I love the quality of my lexus and the way that I'm treated at the dealership. I know her dealership's service isn't close to what I get from Lexus. I'm sure part of it has to do with the dealerships she has been to (3 so far, and she bought her car from the nicest dealership). We'll see in the long run though.

Sentinel

the 5spd is more stiffly sprung. Awd DOES not make a car handle better, it make a car easier to drive fast. If you cant drive (not saying u cant) or are a unskilled driver u will think the awd car handles better when all its doing is covering up your mistakes. Ive never driven one but i have raced and beat them at autoX.

orbital517

Reliability was also a concern for me, but still chose the A4 for the fun factor. I had a smile on my face every time I took those turns. I couldn't really go wrong with either the IS, 330, or the A4.

orbital517

LOL!!!

Could you PLEASE explain stiffly sprung? From my knowledge, the suspension on a 5sp manual and a automatic is EXACTLY the same. And as for AWD, what do you mean it only makes the car easier to drive fast? And it "DOES not" make a car handle better, just makes me laugh at how much you know about cars. I understand you are going to "justify your purchase" by saying your car is the best. Trust me, i'm not ******* on the IS, I just made a decision based on my opinions on the ENTIRE car, that worked best for ME. There's no need to get mad.

Sentinel

I agree depends what u want.
audi are very tuneable ive just heard alot of build quality issues(but they look good). 330 is very nice, some build issues and not very much tuneabiltiy(and costly to mod), is300 is very nice as well but a but portly I think people underate it handling prowess. People i think beat on the is300, every one i know whos driven mine have loved it, including bmw owners and a lot or race instructer/autoxer.

well see i have to run S mod (against chipped a4s, turbo civics, etc) at auto x and I WONT LOOSE

but all cars being the same price BMW wins, but there not so i think the is300 is the best value.

Sentinel

im not getting mad. stiffly sprung? different spring rates. if you ride in a five speed it will feel stiffer then the auto but handle better.

as for easier to drive fast. its simple for example lets say you apprach a corner too fast in a RWD car you spin off it (tail first) in a front wheel drive car youll plow forward, in a AWD car u do a combination depending on how much gas / brake you give which will let u get through it faster. But no faster then if you have approached the corner at the right speed in the first place.

Christobol

Now from what I understand, and what physics I've thought out about a AWD system is that when you go into a corner you have both inside wheels giving power to pull the car through the turn. In a front of rear wheel drive system you are relying upon only one wheel to pull the car through the turn (Hence LSD). Now I'm sure that what you said Sentinel is correct. I think it's a combination of the two. AWD definately will help coverup a drivers errors. That is a great thing for people who are just learning how to drive. I wish that I had it on my car as I know that someday I'll screw up and hopefully I'll just go into a spin and stop without hitting anything.


I'm also very sure that the suspension on a stick is the same as on an auto. You can go check out the part numbers used on both cars and they are going to be the same. There are only a few differences in the stick and auto, and those are mostly in placement of engine parts so accomidate the different tannies.

Sentinel

Then ud be very wrong, there not the same its not even debatable. got to lexus web site.

Christobol

Alright I went to the site. The differences are that the 5-Speed doesn't list the exact configuration of the suspension.

5 Speed
Top track speed: 143.7 mph1
Five-speed manual transmission
Sport-tuned suspension
Fuel consumption: 18/25 mpg city/highway2
17 x 7.0-in alloy wheels with 215/45ZR17 tires (16 x 6.5-in alloy wheels with 205/55VR16 all-season steel-belted radials as a no-cost option. 17 x 7.0-in graphite polished-alloy wheels with 215/45ZR17 tires optional)3
Full-size spare with alloy wheel


Automatic
Top track speed: 143.7 mph1
Five-speed, automatic Electronically Controlled Transmission with intelligence (ECT-i)
E-Shift, with controls on steering wheel
Overdrive fifth gear, engine/transmission networking, flex-lockup torque converter
Front suspension: Independent, double-wishbone with A-shaped upper arm, coil springs, gas-pressurized shock absorbers, stabilizer bar
Rear suspension: Independent, double-wishbone with L-shaped aluminum upper arm and toe-control arm, coil springs, gas-pressurized shock absorbers, stabilizer bar
Fuel consumption: 18/25 mpg city/highway2
17 x 7.0-in alloy wheels with 215/45ZR17 tires (16 x 6.5-in alloy wheels with 205/55VR16 all-season steel-belted radials as a no-cost option. 17 x 7.0-in graphite polished-alloy wheels with 215/45ZR17 tires optional)3
Full-size spare with alloy wheel


Now tell me where the difference is. The only thing I see is that they didn't explain what the suspension on the 5-Speed included. Now maybe is says somewhere else on the site, but I haven't seen it. If you say it's on the website post a link to the exact pages where they show an ACTUAL difference, rather than a vague reference to the suspension (like above).

CmputerWiz

5-speed: you can pick your RPM's based on gear, you can control the sway of the car, and you can control DRIFT!

Auto: if you're shifting in "manual" mode you can kind of get some characteristics of the manual, but its not the same response. In auto mode? Forget it. First time the car shifts and you're in a hard turn, you're flying off the track.

You have total control over the drivetrain with a 5-speed, and the drivetrain is connected to....the suspension. So you want more front end dive? Let off the gas a little...do that in the auto, you're shifting and sliding out. Try to shift really fast between two s-turns? Not in the auto.

I drove an A4 that was chipped and had quattro, nice car. It was also new. Drive it 10 years down the road, it's gonna be rattling like a yugo...just like the AUDI's from 10 years ago. Now drive a 10 year old Lexus. No rattles. Doors are still tight. And you're over 250k without issues.

(not saying I don't like Audi, but you pose that question on a lexus board, and 99% of the answers are going to say the lex wins)

SR

Christobol

I totally agree. The suspension is the same though, you just have a vast amount of control with a stick shift, where as the auto at best gives a small margin of control. I still want to see what Sentinel has to say.

CmputerWiz

Its the same suspension, but I do think they've tuned it different...i.e. slightly different rate springs, or shocks....something like that. I'm calling the dealer now to see if any of them know *exactly* what it is.


SR

Christobol

Let us know what you find out at the dealership. This may be something where you have to call the corporate office, as this could easily be over the heads of most salesmen.

EmoDragRacer

HAHA screw the I35.. what about the real threat --G35!!!!!

Christobol

I agree with you sick. I think the A4 has more luxury. It's not comparable to other Lexus cars, or a 7 Series, or most Benz. I felt that the luxury part of the A4, is just kinda thrown on the car, and doesn't quite belong. I'm not sure exactly but it simply doesn't feel right. It's as if the car is lost between trying to be a sports sedan, and a luxury sedan.