First Drive: IS250 AWD & IS350
08-18-05, 12:08 AM
#77
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Originally Posted by spwolf
got a chime in a bit more - peak who? IS350's engine torque curve is steady from well below 2,000rpm. We are not talking about 4cly engines here, right off my mind I dont know any high peak HP V6 that was slow down below, maybe Honda's V6's and thats only when compared to V8's in the same class...
And nobody really thought about PEAK hp, until you mentioned it, it is somewhat of oximoron unless we are talking about 4cly. And I also own an car with very peaky 4cly 2zz engine, which is an blast to drive and was considerably faster than my MRS (before it got turbo), even though papers suggested otherwise (weight especially was on the side of MRS, but 2zz was much better performer than 1zz in MRS even though looking at figures you would never figure it out).
Its a bit off topic but not really. I have a feeling that a lot people are simply wanting to put down IS350 numbers (not suggesting you but others) just because and if you actually check IS350's torque curve (lexus.co.jp) you will see how wrong is to put peaky in the same sentence with IS350. Everyone wanted high hp and now when we got it, people are putting it down as not that important. It sure is - dont get me wrong, many things are important in performance vehicle, but hp/tq is the major one (unless you are BMW owner, they maybe subscription to major mag is the most important thing to carry around :-))))).
I am sure that flip will confirm that IS250 is an pretty nice vehicle for people not thinking that HP is that important :-).
And nobody really thought about PEAK hp, until you mentioned it, it is somewhat of oximoron unless we are talking about 4cly. And I also own an car with very peaky 4cly 2zz engine, which is an blast to drive and was considerably faster than my MRS (before it got turbo), even though papers suggested otherwise (weight especially was on the side of MRS, but 2zz was much better performer than 1zz in MRS even though looking at figures you would never figure it out).
Its a bit off topic but not really. I have a feeling that a lot people are simply wanting to put down IS350 numbers (not suggesting you but others) just because and if you actually check IS350's torque curve (lexus.co.jp) you will see how wrong is to put peaky in the same sentence with IS350. Everyone wanted high hp and now when we got it, people are putting it down as not that important. It sure is - dont get me wrong, many things are important in performance vehicle, but hp/tq is the major one (unless you are BMW owner, they maybe subscription to major mag is the most important thing to carry around :-))))).
I am sure that flip will confirm that IS250 is an pretty nice vehicle for people not thinking that HP is that important :-).
Listen, you said "HP/TQ ratings are the most important infos about car performance." And I disagree. If you said "hp curve" or "torque curve" then I might tend to agree more. Hell, if you said "average hp" I might agree more. But saying a car makes 306 peak hp is NOT the most important piece of information you could tell me about a car's performance. I would argue that a car's weight (and weight balance) is an equally, if not more, important piece of information. Telling me something like "the car can lap the nurburgring in 8 minutes and 15 seconds" tells me a WHOLE LOT more about a car's performance than "306hp".
The peak hp numbers that you like to use to compare cars - the numbers printed in all the brochures and magazines - is a piece of information arbitrarily picked by a car maker's marketing dept to try and sum up a car in a way that would help sell it. If you know anything about computers, you can think of it this way: When Intel designed the Pentium 4, they designed it to be able to achieve higher GHz numbers - even though it does less work per Hz. Why would they do that? Because people who don't know any better will see the higher speed rating and think its better. Well guess what? Pentium 4's are running into heat/power problems and now they are moving on to the next generation Pentium M chips. And those chips are based off of the Pentium 3! Anyway, sorry to go off on such a long tangent, but my point is 1 number can not tell the whole story. Especially numbers from people trying to sell you something.
And I'm not trying to bash the IS350. In fact, I really like what I've seen and heard so far and I will be considering purchasing one in the near future. (all planned future mods on my current car have been cancelled, lol). Well, either the IS or a Cayman (which btw, only has 295hp
) Anyway, thats all i have to say on this. Sorry for taking up so much space in this thread.
Last edited by IS JOE; 08-18-05 at 12:23 AM.
08-18-05, 12:10 AM
#78
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Originally Posted by flipside909
To my dismay, this new Verizon DSL sucks for upload speeds. Uploads in progress as we speak. 
hey Flip, i dont know if you are still uploading, but you sure do have a real slow connection! LOL. verizon is the one to blame for. But I am still waiting for your review.
08-18-05, 12:13 AM
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Originally Posted by DC52E55
hey Flip, i dont know if you are still uploading, but you sure do have a real slow connection! LOL. verizon is the one to blame for. But I am still waiting for your review.
Unless he passed out onto his keyboard while waiting for the upload to finish...
08-18-05, 12:27 AM
#81
lol, comparing cars to Pentium IV's... I agree with you that one number does not tell the whole story, but thats not what I was talking about. I said HP is the most important number, not the only one. As to the torque curve - I said it before, I will say it again - shown me an modern V6 or V8 engine with bad torque curve but high hp?
I drive an 2250lbs midship-rwd car, I quite understand the concept of weight and its importance. In fact, due to having 2 similar yet completly opposite cars - Corolla with 2zz and MRS with 1zz, I am more experienced than most on the matter of weight and power distribution (if you know a bit about 1zz and 2zz you would get my drift).
You mentioned Nurburgring - good example. C350 which has more "peak" torque and hp than awesome, fast, best feeling car ever - 330i, is also faster at Nurburgring. 330i gets better slalom speeds, gets higher g's in corners but thats not good enough to actually outlap C350 which has some 15% more torque.
What you are saying is good old party line - HP isnt everything. Which I agree with, but at the same time HP is ... well.. awesome start. Simply put, nobody would be that excited about IS300 with 245hp, to you it might be shallow but all other things are equal and "peak" hp means 20% more over the whole curve, not just at the end.
anyway.. flip, flip, flip.....!!!
I drive an 2250lbs midship-rwd car, I quite understand the concept of weight and its importance. In fact, due to having 2 similar yet completly opposite cars - Corolla with 2zz and MRS with 1zz, I am more experienced than most on the matter of weight and power distribution (if you know a bit about 1zz and 2zz you would get my drift).
You mentioned Nurburgring - good example. C350 which has more "peak" torque and hp than awesome, fast, best feeling car ever - 330i, is also faster at Nurburgring. 330i gets better slalom speeds, gets higher g's in corners but thats not good enough to actually outlap C350 which has some 15% more torque.
What you are saying is good old party line - HP isnt everything. Which I agree with, but at the same time HP is ... well.. awesome start. Simply put, nobody would be that excited about IS300 with 245hp, to you it might be shallow but all other things are equal and "peak" hp means 20% more over the whole curve, not just at the end.
anyway.. flip, flip, flip.....!!!
08-18-05, 05:18 AM
#86
WOW the traffic is sooooo strong I can't even get to the gallery page. argh!! I'l try tonight.
Flip, can't wait for the video!!!
Flip, can't wait for the video!!!
08-18-05, 07:22 AM
#88
Lexus Test Driver
Side by side, I still like the look of the 1st Gen IS. Looks more manly. 
The 2nd Gen is good looking, but if I had my pick, It'd be an IS300 5 speed.
The 2nd Gen is good looking, but if I had my pick, It'd be an IS300 5 speed.
