kensteele

Obviously you've been misinformed. Who told you this? Is this your best guess? Did you read it some place on the Internet and come here to repeat it?

I think you are missing the point. It doesn't matter if it is dangerous or not or whether it may or may not cause an accident. Lexus has determined that they will do whatever they can to limit their liability. The way you make it sound, they should have just blacked out the screen entirely when the car starts moving and just give you voice instructions.

They are limiting their liability drawing the line at where they think it should be where they feel comfortable. Nothing more, end of story. Has nothing to do with safety or direct bearing on distractions or anything else.

kensteele

Only the part about warning you the driver is correct. The hack practice is perfectly safe. What isn't safe is missing lug nuts on a fast moving tire, or a cracked windshield that obscures the driver's vision, or a car with no headlights at night.

If there is a law against it, I'm all for it. No talk on cellphone, must wear seatbelts... There's no law against performing the hack.

Evitzee

Ken ..... chill, please. And don't put words in my mouth. I never said I thought Lexus should blank out the screen. I think we are closer than you think on Lexus' position. I agree with what you said in that 'Lexus has determined that they will do whatever they can to limit their liability. They are limiting their liability drawing the line at where they think it should be where they feel comfortable'. I've got no argument with that and agree. All companies make decisions everyday to limit their liability, that's no crime, and there is nothing sinister about it, although conspiracy theorists see something evil in any company preventing them from using any product in any way they see fit. Unfortunately that is the way the world is in this litigous society.

But ask yourself, why did Lexus seemingly close the easy hack on the 2007 models, which this whole thread is based on? It would seem that Lexus still just don't feel comfortable with customers accessing the system while driving. (The old comfort level thing). But your last statement saying it 'Has nothing to do with safety or direct bearing on distractions or anything else' goes against your own argument where you say Lexus does it to limit their liability and to fit their comfort level. If their comfort level is not based on safety or distractions what is it based on?

Personally go ahead and hack away as long as it's legal. But stop beating everyone over the head when different arguments are put forward. We can all agree to disagree and still be civil about it.

DaveGS4

iTrader: (2)

LBR, I've got a similar Eclipse in my GS with the latest version. The Fujitsu-Ten folks make both that and some of the Lexus nav systems, but it's equivalent to the Gen 4 Nav, not Gen 5. Plus the Eclipse doesn't have hooks in for car computer, voice activation, AC controls, etc that come on the OEM nav. It still has the 'accept' prompt and it still blocks entry while moving. Easier override by grounding out negative wire that is connected to parking break though.

kensteele

i'm being civil, no harm intended....maybe i just forgot to use the smilies.

kensteele

There's nothing conclusive about any of this, it's all still based on supposition and plain guessing.

I'm not trying to put down anyone's opinions and discussion ideas, it's just frustrating when anyone states their opinion and then runs with it as though it were fact.

No one has any idea if Lexus closed the hack on anything, maybe the outsource everything entirely to a Nav vendor, who knows?

kensteele

I think everyone is way way overestimating the day to day legal involvment in these cars and their features and functionality.

I think the designers and the engineers and the project managers come up with all the ideas and they get legal sign-off and in the rare case, legal might advise them to make a change here or there.

But the Lexus legal department doesn't run the company.

Technique

Agreed... Sheesh...

RocketGuy3

iTrader: (1)

Even if it did work, if I'm understanding this right, you would still have to do it everytime you started the car and wanted to be able to do a Nav override... Right?

As opposed to that other DIY thread with instructions on actually changing some wiring connections, which is a permanent hack...?

istundra

iTrader: (2)

Actually, I have posted an advanced version of the hack. You can fully control it via one main switch.

lobuxracer

iTrader: (2)

Yes, it's better than just splicing, but it's not the fix I'd like to see. I'd rather sort this out with the software and deliver precisely what I'd like. Including the Eclipse version of the folder view. I think it's about 1000 times better than what Lexus gave us for sorting through MP3 folders.

Bichon

If the engineers and project managers intended for the features to be crippled while the vehicle is in motion, they would work that way in Europe, Japan and the rest of the world. The fact that they only cripple the features for the US market strongly suggests that they are fearful of the litigious climate over here.

kensteele

^^^no it strongly suggest that lexus cannot agree to delivery of equipment in the US with a certain configuration according to the way they interpret US law. maybe they have determined that US laws has loopholes that could be used in a claim against lexus. So they establish a practice, and the project managers write their specs accordingly.

that's a little bit different they saying they are scared of the people or that america is litigious so they need to watch out. that's a little bit different than saying the lexus legal department orders changes. maybe this was written up by legal in 1999 and lexus legal hasn't bothered to renew or review it lately. i dunno, have lexus navs always worked this way? maybe they had to pay a claim in 2002 and they changed their specs based on the findings. or a lawsuit was dismissed in 2003 and lexus implemented emergency changes (block it) until they could redesign the nav or until the nav designed could come up with something better for later.

a whole bunch of guessing.

SolaraToIS

Kensteele, you must keep a hefty soap box near your computer

.

Kepeli

There are some towns that have made using a Navigation system while driving illegal.

There is a U.S. law that forbids equipping a car with a video screen visible to the driver. Technically every car manufacture that offers Nav is breaking that law.