IS350 vs. modded E46 M3
10-02-07, 04:45 PM
#31
And yes, your almighty e46m3 would totally whip up on an is350 around a track. however, both of these examples are in a straight line.
BTW how hard is it to paddle shift? The dude knew how to drive. It was just a good race and I don't think his m3 is as fast as my IS was/is. I think they are damn close to the same. Who knows maybe he had mulch or sod or something in his trunk. He didn't look fat or anything.
10-02-07, 05:45 PM
#32
What most everyone here is failing to realize is that it doesn't necessarily matter what the peak power/torque etc is on a car, nor do 0-60 or 1/4 mile times, WHEN YOU ARE DOING A PULL FROM 70 MPH.
Just look in car magazines and look at 30-50 mph, 50-70 mph, etc. times. The "faster, more powerful" car doesn't always take the win in these categories, as gearing, power curves, drag, weight, and other parameters have more of an effect.
The IS350 is ULTRA fast from a pull at 70 mph. I've never driven an M3 to know what that is like, but punching the IS at that speed feels like a rocket got lit under your tail. Also, keep in mind that the IS is an AUTO (and a very good one at that), vs. the manual or SMG M3.
My comparison: I've got a mustang GT, and honestly think that the IS350 is a little faster than that vehicle in 0-60. When it comes to a pull from ~ 65 mph, the "holy cow I'm going that fast already" method makes me think that the 350 is MUCH faster than the mustang in a dig. AND, those two vehicles have pretty similar stats.
So, moral of story: unless you've actually driven both cars, I'd leave the "it's impossible" statements out.
Just look in car magazines and look at 30-50 mph, 50-70 mph, etc. times. The "faster, more powerful" car doesn't always take the win in these categories, as gearing, power curves, drag, weight, and other parameters have more of an effect.
The IS350 is ULTRA fast from a pull at 70 mph. I've never driven an M3 to know what that is like, but punching the IS at that speed feels like a rocket got lit under your tail. Also, keep in mind that the IS is an AUTO (and a very good one at that), vs. the manual or SMG M3.
My comparison: I've got a mustang GT, and honestly think that the IS350 is a little faster than that vehicle in 0-60. When it comes to a pull from ~ 65 mph, the "holy cow I'm going that fast already" method makes me think that the 350 is MUCH faster than the mustang in a dig. AND, those two vehicles have pretty similar stats.
So, moral of story: unless you've actually driven both cars, I'd leave the "it's impossible" statements out.
10-02-07, 07:02 PM
#33
Lexus Test Driver
On the streets anything is possible since most of the average M3 owners must be scared to rev the car all the way up to 8000 rpm while rowing through gears.
An M3 and IS350 owner pretty much summed it up a few posts ago. Isn't that person's opinion better than anyone else?
Having said that, M3 dynos consistently at 280 - 285 WHP on average and no lower than 275 WHP and no higher than 290 WHP. The IS350 dynos consistently between 248 - 253 WHP stock. That is average 30 WHP difference. Added to that, M3 is 150+ pounds lighter than the IS350.
I have driven an IS350 Sport and an M3 SMG and the M3 SMG top end pull from 6000 - 8000 rpm was ferocious and almost scary.
Having said that, Lexus IS350 has mostly been tested between 5.1 - 5.6 and 13.7 - 14.0 seconds and one test where it ran a 4.9 seconds. while M3 has consistently ALWAYS run 4.8 secs in every single test and a freak test in which it ran 4.5 seconds and 13.1 seconds in 1/4 mile (Car and driver, 2001).
http://www.caranddriver.com/longroad...-m3-page4.html
Some of the lowest numbers on M3 are 13.6 seconds while the lowest numbers on IS350 were 14.1 seconds.
Suffice to say, M3 will consistently run 4.7 - 4.8 seconds and low-13 seconds at the drag strip with equal drivers far more consistently than a Lexus IS350 will.
I watched this episode of Best Motoring where Tsuchiya san consistently ran a 13.2 second 1/4 mile with the the E46 M3 on acceleration tests while he could not get anything better than 13.8 secs from the Audi V8 S4. He barely got the JDM STI Spec-C to run 0.1 faster than the M3. Similar story with the "Top Gear" test of these two cars.
Don't forget there are a few people on the E46forums who had best stock run timeslips of 12.9 from the E46 M3 that would be termed freak M3 since on average it will run 13.2 - 13.4.
Like this video in which 6-7 M3s running the dragstrip side by side with most having N/A mods running 12.2 - 12.4 (only grey beating the supercharged Saleen is S/Céd).
http://www.m3registry.com/siriusm3fo...Drag%20Day.wmv
So all in all, on 10 runs, on the same dragstrip, with equal drivers, M3 will run a 13.4 seconds 8/10 while the IS350 will run a 13.4 a lot less often.
An M3 and IS350 owner pretty much summed it up a few posts ago. Isn't that person's opinion better than anyone else?
Having said that, M3 dynos consistently at 280 - 285 WHP on average and no lower than 275 WHP and no higher than 290 WHP. The IS350 dynos consistently between 248 - 253 WHP stock. That is average 30 WHP difference. Added to that, M3 is 150+ pounds lighter than the IS350.
I have driven an IS350 Sport and an M3 SMG and the M3 SMG top end pull from 6000 - 8000 rpm was ferocious and almost scary.
Having said that, Lexus IS350 has mostly been tested between 5.1 - 5.6 and 13.7 - 14.0 seconds and one test where it ran a 4.9 seconds. while M3 has consistently ALWAYS run 4.8 secs in every single test and a freak test in which it ran 4.5 seconds and 13.1 seconds in 1/4 mile (Car and driver, 2001).
http://www.caranddriver.com/longroad...-m3-page4.html
Some of the lowest numbers on M3 are 13.6 seconds while the lowest numbers on IS350 were 14.1 seconds.
Suffice to say, M3 will consistently run 4.7 - 4.8 seconds and low-13 seconds at the drag strip with equal drivers far more consistently than a Lexus IS350 will.
I watched this episode of Best Motoring where Tsuchiya san consistently ran a 13.2 second 1/4 mile with the the E46 M3 on acceleration tests while he could not get anything better than 13.8 secs from the Audi V8 S4. He barely got the JDM STI Spec-C to run 0.1 faster than the M3. Similar story with the "Top Gear" test of these two cars.
Don't forget there are a few people on the E46forums who had best stock run timeslips of 12.9 from the E46 M3 that would be termed freak M3 since on average it will run 13.2 - 13.4.
Like this video in which 6-7 M3s running the dragstrip side by side with most having N/A mods running 12.2 - 12.4 (only grey beating the supercharged Saleen is S/Céd).
http://www.m3registry.com/siriusm3fo...Drag%20Day.wmv
So all in all, on 10 runs, on the same dragstrip, with equal drivers, M3 will run a 13.4 seconds 8/10 while the IS350 will run a 13.4 a lot less often.
Last edited by 05RollaXRS; 10-02-07 at 09:17 PM.
10-03-07, 04:29 AM
#38
then you missed the most important part of the post.
All you people talk about 0-60 and 1/4 mile times, WHICH MEAN NOTHING FOR PULLS AT HIGHWAY SPEEDS!!!!!!!!!
I won't deny that the M3 may be faster than the IS350 from a stand-still, nor do I really care. All I'm saying is that don't look at one set of numbers and try to bench race with a whole different set of race conditions.
All you people talk about 0-60 and 1/4 mile times, WHICH MEAN NOTHING FOR PULLS AT HIGHWAY SPEEDS!!!!!!!!!
I won't deny that the M3 may be faster than the IS350 from a stand-still, nor do I really care. All I'm saying is that don't look at one set of numbers and try to bench race with a whole different set of race conditions.
10-03-07, 04:38 AM
#40
then you missed the most important part of the post.
All you people talk about 0-60 and 1/4 mile times, WHICH MEAN NOTHING FOR PULLS AT HIGHWAY SPEEDS!!!!!!!!!
I won't deny that the M3 may be faster than the IS350 from a stand-still, nor do I really care. All I'm saying is that don't look at one set of numbers and try to bench race with a whole different set of race conditions.
All you people talk about 0-60 and 1/4 mile times, WHICH MEAN NOTHING FOR PULLS AT HIGHWAY SPEEDS!!!!!!!!!
I won't deny that the M3 may be faster than the IS350 from a stand-still, nor do I really care. All I'm saying is that don't look at one set of numbers and try to bench race with a whole different set of race conditions.
10-03-07, 05:15 AM
#41
That was me racing the M3 and you'll never see me bench race. Here is my timeslip from that run. The M3 won the race because he had a quicker reaction time and a better 60', but I had him at the 330', 1/8th, 1000', the 1/4 mile and was about to run him down at the end. 
I've also raced non vert E46 M3's at Crofton Raceway in Md and was also able to consistently beat them in ET, but the trap speed was usually in the M3's favor.
BTW in my opinion the E46 M3 will take our cars on highway pulls, but from a dig the IS350 can usually make the win.
Full post with other runs that day at MIR World Cup Finals last year.
I've also raced non vert E46 M3's at Crofton Raceway in Md and was also able to consistently beat them in ET, but the trap speed was usually in the M3's favor. BTW in my opinion the E46 M3 will take our cars on highway pulls, but from a dig the IS350 can usually make the win.
Full post with other runs that day at MIR World Cup Finals last year.
Last edited by caymandive; 10-03-07 at 05:21 AM.
10-03-07, 05:26 AM
#42
That was me racing the M3 and you'll never see me bench race. Here is my timeslip from that run. The M3 won the race because he had a quicker reaction time and a better 60', but I had him at the 330', 1/8th, 1000', the 1/4 mile and was about to run him down at the end. I've also raced non vert E46 M3's at Crofton Raceway in Md and was also able to consistently beat them in ET, but the trap speed was usually in the M3's favor.
BTW in my opinion the E46 M3 will take our cars on highway pulls, but from a dig the IS350 can usually make the win.
I've also raced non vert E46 M3's at Crofton Raceway in Md and was also able to consistently beat them in ET, but the trap speed was usually in the M3's favor. BTW in my opinion the E46 M3 will take our cars on highway pulls, but from a dig the IS350 can usually make the win.
10-03-07, 05:33 AM
#43
Last edited by caymandive; 10-03-07 at 05:51 AM.
10-03-07, 06:05 AM
#44
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lol....all I wanted to do was share an interesting story with fellow IS owners! Oh well, back to the Audi forum!.....Seriously though, the point isn't that my IS is always faster then the M. My S can usually outrun my IS, but in very hot weather, the IS takes the flag. Everything depends on the driving/racing conditions and the drivers....and in this case, those variables were in my favor. Tomorrow he might beat me.....but isn't that the fun of it??
10-03-07, 07:29 AM
#45
Lexus Test Driver
That was me racing the M3 and you'll never see me bench race. Here is my timeslip from that run. The M3 won the race because he had a quicker reaction time and a better 60', but I had him at the 330', 1/8th, 1000', the 1/4 mile and was about to run him down at the end. I've also raced non vert E46 M3's at Crofton Raceway in Md and was also able to consistently beat them in ET, but the trap speed was usually in the M3's favor.
BTW in my opinion the E46 M3 will take our cars on highway pulls, but from a dig the IS350 can usually make the win.
I've also raced non vert E46 M3's at Crofton Raceway in Md and was also able to consistently beat them in ET, but the trap speed was usually in the M3's favor. BTW in my opinion the E46 M3 will take our cars on highway pulls, but from a dig the IS350 can usually make the win.
That was a convertible that is 250 - 300 pounds heavier than the E46 M3 coupe and you ran a better ET by 0.2 seconds. The coupe is 0.4 - 0.5 better in ET average than the convertible due to the reduced weight.
I find it hard to believe you "usually beat" random M3 coupes at the dragstrip when it dynos much higher and is substantially lighter than the IS350. Then again, it is possible since M3s are very hard to launch because of how hard their wheelspin is off the line since they get 90% of their torque at only 1800 rpm. IS350 hooks up better. (hence the 2- 3 mph high trap speed).
Look at the video I posted of E46fanatics.com drag runs and you will see bolt-on/software M3s running 12s.
If you want to avoid bench racing and want to prove you can better those M3 on the dragstrip, rather than basing on some random M3 encounter, the best way to do it is by calling someone out at e46fanatics.com in your region and challenge him to race on the race track. I am sure many must be happy to help you settle this. That will prove your point.
Last edited by 05RollaXRS; 10-03-07 at 08:08 AM.