I don't understand some 2IS buyers?
10-04-07, 11:18 AM
#76
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The IS has accounted for 2% of all TMC's sales this year so far (41,706 of 2,001,646 vehicles total). That's pretty small I think. Since Lexus only makes 8 models total (3 SUVs and 5 sedans?), saying it's in 3rd place is a bit misleading especially in light of the fact that Lexus overall only accounts for slightly less than an eighth of all vehicle sales. Camries and Corrollas account for 56% of TMC's passenger car sales, and if you throw in the ES which is basically a rebadged Camry, that number jumps to 71% of all cars. The IS is dwarfed many times over in unit sales by Camries (9 times) and Corrollas (7 times). If you rank all TMC models, the IS is #18 in total sales with a YOY change of about 40 units (about +0.1%) which shows little growth. That's hardly a homerun, but certainly is a heck of a lot better than the IS300 was selling I'll give you that. I think it's safe to call the Camry the bread and butter of TMC and the IS a minority model.
10-04-07, 12:23 PM
#79
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10-04-07, 12:30 PM
#80
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units sold....because profits can be lower on each unit and still make $$$ because of the huge volume. Its better for the Toyota brand name to sell 1 million camrys making $500 each rather than 20000 and $2500 on each.
Last edited by bagwell; 10-04-07 at 01:20 PM.
10-04-07, 12:35 PM
#81
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10-04-07, 12:47 PM
#82
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I concur with the OP. Enough BMW this and that. There is SO MUCH that comes with the IS that the 3 series BMW can keep it's VERY SLIGHT performance edge. BTW: IMO, my 08 IS350 sport handles just has good and feels just as "communicative to the road" as the 335i. I was surprised as to how well the IS handles. Perhaps the "recalibrated steering" for 08 and the sport package has something to do with it. I see that many who complain about the IS supposed inferior handling are non-sport package and IS250 owners.
Now, the M series is a different story when it comes to handling. The E46 M (I had one) was not vastly superior in handling to the 08 IS350 sport, but it was more performance oriented. Of course, that was when I could actually drive it when it was not in the shop.
To clarify something gentlemen and ladies...> the 3 series is NOT a "sports car", even in M form. Examples of "sport cars" on the market today would include the likes of Elise, S2000, 350Z, Boxter, Cayman.... The Corvette is sometimes classified as a GT rather than a sports car. Of course the exotics (Ferrari, Lambo and a few others) are considered "sports car".
Now, the M series is a different story when it comes to handling. The E46 M (I had one) was not vastly superior in handling to the 08 IS350 sport, but it was more performance oriented. Of course, that was when I could actually drive it when it was not in the shop.
To clarify something gentlemen and ladies...> the 3 series is NOT a "sports car", even in M form. Examples of "sport cars" on the market today would include the likes of Elise, S2000, 350Z, Boxter, Cayman.... The Corvette is sometimes classified as a GT rather than a sports car. Of course the exotics (Ferrari, Lambo and a few others) are considered "sports car".
10-04-07, 01:15 PM
#83
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Anyway, the Lexus or BMW badge is important because it represents the company's success. Lexus has done well with IS but it's not going to be as successful as the 3 series; however, Lexus can definitely build on this, and I think when the 3rd generation IS comes out, it will be a much improved product for its sports sedan goal. After all, it's not like Toyota doesn't know how to build a nice sporting machine (Supra comes to mind).
IS needs to do a couple of things:
- Have a manual available for the performance version (luxury sedans is about options)
- Have a better base model in terms of power
- Increase the size for rear passengers (closer to G35 or TSX size)
- Allow people to order as they configure and deliver in a more timely manner
10-04-07, 01:17 PM
#84
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They get to that number on a Camry by selling lots of them, and they get to that number on an LX 570 by making them expensive.
10-04-07, 01:22 PM
#85
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the math isn't quite right here, hence the obviously choice of camry...
Anyway, the Lexus or BMW badge is important because it represents the company's success. Lexus has done well with IS but it's not going to be as successful as the 3 series; however, Lexus can definitely build on this, and I think when the 3rd generation IS comes out, it will be a much improved product for its sports sedan goal. After all, it's not like Toyota doesn't know how to build a nice sporting machine (Supra comes to mind).
IS needs to do a couple of things:
- Have a manual available for the performance version (luxury sedans is about options)
- Have a better base model in terms of power
- Increase the size for rear passengers (closer to G35 or TSX size)
- Allow people to order as they configure and deliver in a more timely manner
Anyway, the Lexus or BMW badge is important because it represents the company's success. Lexus has done well with IS but it's not going to be as successful as the 3 series; however, Lexus can definitely build on this, and I think when the 3rd generation IS comes out, it will be a much improved product for its sports sedan goal. After all, it's not like Toyota doesn't know how to build a nice sporting machine (Supra comes to mind).
IS needs to do a couple of things:
- Have a manual available for the performance version (luxury sedans is about options)
- Have a better base model in terms of power
- Increase the size for rear passengers (closer to G35 or TSX size)
- Allow people to order as they configure and deliver in a more timely manner
Its better for the Toyota brand name to sell 1 million camrys making $500 each rather than 20000 and $2500 on each
I was too tired to do the math....but....
10-04-07, 02:44 PM
#87
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Hold on partner, this is not a discussion about the Camry. Sure the Camry is the bread & butter of TMC, but to say that Lexus is tied to Camry sales is a bit absurd. 18 years ago Lexus didn't even exist, today they are a significant profit center for TMC. Notice I said profit center, not volume contributor. Lexus on a per car basis is adding more to the bottom line than any Toyota model (period). So what do you think is more important to the brass at TMC, units sold or $ profit per unit sold ???
Speaking of quality, which also for some reason seems to be up for debate in this forum, my boss has a five year old M5, and that car is in the shop at least three times per year, and had to go in for service that cost well over $2,000 just days after the warranty expired. There seems to be a lot more BMWs in the shop than Lexuses which to me speaks to the quality of the car. Ever since my first Toyota I've been hooked on them after dealing with American cars for so many years. I'm trying to be fair to BMW but it's tough when you see firsthand the quality issues, the cheap interiors that are straight out of the 80s, the crappy iDrive system, etc. I always have to ask, besides the badge on the back and the status that comes with driving one, what's so great about them?
10-04-07, 03:07 PM
#88
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Former E36 owner here. I obviously chose the IS350 over the 330i when I was window shopping. IF the 335i was out at that time and IF Bmw had a comparable Nav/Audio/backup cam system and IF I could *buy* this mythical bimmer for an acceptable premium (say 5-8%) I prolly would've bought it. But at the end of the day, when you weigh all the pros & cons, the IS was the clear choice. . .
10-04-07, 03:27 PM
#89
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Like I said before, I hope TMC builds and sells a buttload of Camrys, Corollas, RXs & ESs, just as long as they also build the kind of car I want to buy (ISF, GSF, LFA etc)
10-04-07, 03:59 PM
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Former E36 owner here. I obviously chose the IS350 over the 330i when I was window shopping. IF the 335i was out at that time and IF Bmw had a comparable Nav/Audio/backup cam system and IF I could *buy* this mythical bimmer for an acceptable premium (say 5-8%) I prolly would've bought it. But at the end of the day, when you weigh all the pros & cons, the IS was the clear choice. . .
