My 2IS is in the shop ... got an '03 ES as a loaner
04-25-09, 11:28 PM
#16
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comfortable? I'm not disputing that... it's a very cushy ride for someone who doesn't care about handling, responsiveness, or being "connected" with the road. But to be honest I sometimes feel downright stressed trying to control this car because it doesn't behave the way I want it to. I'm not trying to say I'm Lewis Hamilton or anything, but yeah, it's kind of like being used to driving a Formula One car every day and then being given a lawn tractor mower to drive.
04-25-09, 11:57 PM
#17
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Honestly the IS350 isn't all that much of a responsive handling machine either ya know. It's much better than an ES300 but it's still not that good. If you think getting an ES is bad as a loaner for your recalls I got a stinkin gold Camry 4 cyl! =(*
04-26-09, 12:53 AM
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LOL if you read above, I did get a Camry as a loaner the last time. In all honesty I think the throttle response on the 4-cyl Camry is better than the ES330. I was driving the ES today and it felt like the first 50% of the throttle is all the same... the car barely moves until you step past 50% and then you get some life out of it. In both the Camry and the IS, 25% means one thing and 50% means something else. I kept looking for an ECT PWR button somewhere but no luck. 
My wife's tC is also a mere 4-cyl but the throttle mapping on that car is fantastic, it makes the car much zippier to drive. I guess it's just a matter of preference, but it really seems like the ES was designed for 60 year olds who have no desire to move smartly from a stop.
My wife's tC is also a mere 4-cyl but the throttle mapping on that car is fantastic, it makes the car much zippier to drive. I guess it's just a matter of preference, but it really seems like the ES was designed for 60 year olds who have no desire to move smartly from a stop.
04-26-09, 08:32 AM
#19
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I understand your comments about the ES300 loaner. I had an '04 Avalon, a close cousin of the ES300. As long as the road was flat, straight and you were in no hurry it was OK. Otherwise it handled like a boat. I have an ES350 now and while certainly no sports sedan, it is more buttoned down on the road vs. ES300/Avalon. The 3.5 V6 is night and day better than the 3.0. Gets better gas mileage too.
04-26-09, 09:36 AM
#20
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haha yeah the Avalon or a really large older Cadillac is what I would compare the ES330 to. I remember my brother owned an Avalon for a while (this was while he was in his 20's) and I was totally appalled by the driving experience.
OK, enough bagging on the poor ES. Now, for some real entertainment, if you had one for the weekend what kind of silly stuff would you do?
- attempt burnouts? reverse donuts?
- track day?
- glamorous photoshoot as if it was the hawtness?
- ghost ride the whip?
- keep it in the garage and take the other car?
OK, enough bagging on the poor ES. Now, for some real entertainment, if you had one for the weekend what kind of silly stuff would you do?
- attempt burnouts? reverse donuts?
- track day?
- glamorous photoshoot as if it was the hawtness?
- ghost ride the whip?
- keep it in the garage and take the other car?
04-26-09, 11:59 AM
#21
Has anyone ever told you how immature you are?
04-26-09, 10:15 PM
#22
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04-27-09, 04:27 AM
#23
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I dropped off my IS350 at the local Lexus dealership on Friday morning for some warranty repairs and the 3 service campaigns. They said it would take several days so they sent me on my way with a loaner car ... they gave me a 2003 ES330, wait it gets better, it came in white with chrome wheels and gold badging. Talk about NOT my style... I feel like an old man driving in it, this car seems to be perfect for someone 60 or 70 years old. Which is to say my dad would probably love it. Not me. It's like driving a boat, instead of reacting to my inputs like a well-tuned road-carving instrument, it kind of takes them as suggestions and grudgingly moves in the general direction you want. The power steering is super boosted and has no feedback at all. The brake pedal mushes like you're stepping on tofu. The power coming out of corners is... almost nonexistent. It can barely move out of its own way. Is this what most consumers find comforting or normal?
There are a few interesting perks in this car though. It's kind of fun switching the shock absorbers back and forth between Sport and Comfort while driving over a bridge... I doubt it helps the handling much but you can definitely feel a difference in the ride. The other thing is, I now kind of understand why others drive so badly in this car. With such sensory deprivation from the realities of the road, how can you avoid it? It forces me to do the same things they do ... drive slowly (to avoid upcoming hazards, as the time-to-react to everything becomes painfully higher with the weak responsiveness), constantly tap the brakes (because the pedal gives you no resistance or reassurance whatsoever), and I even have to back up and readjust the steering angle when turning into a parking spot (because it has the turning radius of a 747). I didn't even feel bad when I had to cut off someone to change lanes, the person behind me probably said, whatever, this guy can't help it, he's probably 70 years old and has the mental acuity of a chimpanzee. I've heard people say, it's not the car, it's the driver. Well I'm telling you right now, the car makes a helluva difference.
I can't wait to get my IS350 back.
There are a few interesting perks in this car though. It's kind of fun switching the shock absorbers back and forth between Sport and Comfort while driving over a bridge... I doubt it helps the handling much but you can definitely feel a difference in the ride. The other thing is, I now kind of understand why others drive so badly in this car. With such sensory deprivation from the realities of the road, how can you avoid it? It forces me to do the same things they do ... drive slowly (to avoid upcoming hazards, as the time-to-react to everything becomes painfully higher with the weak responsiveness), constantly tap the brakes (because the pedal gives you no resistance or reassurance whatsoever), and I even have to back up and readjust the steering angle when turning into a parking spot (because it has the turning radius of a 747). I didn't even feel bad when I had to cut off someone to change lanes, the person behind me probably said, whatever, this guy can't help it, he's probably 70 years old and has the mental acuity of a chimpanzee. I've heard people say, it's not the car, it's the driver. Well I'm telling you right now, the car makes a helluva difference.
I can't wait to get my IS350 back.
04-27-09, 07:45 AM
#25
Lexucanafer
Has anyone ever told you how immature you are?
It might serve this community well to consider that many CL members, some of whom are ES enthusiasts, read all the forums and might be offended by your comments.
04-27-09, 10:17 AM
#26
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I'm not trying to backtrack... I stand by everything I said in my first post. The ES is just not the car for me. Sorry if I offend people with my opinion, I guess nobody should read Jeremy Clarkson's car reviews either lest they get offended by his rants and tantrums. Freedom of speech and all that. I assumed (perhaps wrongly) that kingofire's comment was directed toward my more recent post, the one suggesting various silly things I could do with the car. That one was intended to be sarcastic, facetious, etc.
Am I snobbish? Maybe, if liking the handling of a performance sedan over a luxury sedan is being snobbish. I'd also consider myself a RWD snob, since I much prefer the handling of RWD over FWD. And a HDTV snob, since I can barely stand to watch standard def TV now that I have HD. Is it wrong to like the finer things in life? I hope not, because otherwise ClubLexus should have been called ClubToyotaMotorCorporation and we should all be driving Corollas and Camrys.
Am I snobbish? Maybe, if liking the handling of a performance sedan over a luxury sedan is being snobbish. I'd also consider myself a RWD snob, since I much prefer the handling of RWD over FWD. And a HDTV snob, since I can barely stand to watch standard def TV now that I have HD. Is it wrong to like the finer things in life? I hope not, because otherwise ClubLexus should have been called ClubToyotaMotorCorporation and we should all be driving Corollas and Camrys.
04-27-09, 12:57 PM
#27
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LOL if you read above, I did get a Camry as a loaner the last time. In all honesty I think the throttle response on the 4-cyl Camry is better than the ES330. I was driving the ES today and it felt like the first 50% of the throttle is all the same... the car barely moves until you step past 50% and then you get some life out of it. In both the Camry and the IS, 25% means one thing and 50% means something else. I kept looking for an ECT PWR button somewhere but no luck.
My wife's tC is also a mere 4-cyl but the throttle mapping on that car is fantastic, it makes the car much zippier to drive. I guess it's just a matter of preference, but it really seems like the ES was designed for 60 year olds who have no desire to move smartly from a stop.
My wife's tC is also a mere 4-cyl but the throttle mapping on that car is fantastic, it makes the car much zippier to drive. I guess it's just a matter of preference, but it really seems like the ES was designed for 60 year olds who have no desire to move smartly from a stop.
Am I snobbish? Maybe, if liking the handling of a performance sedan over a luxury sedan is being snobbish. I'd also consider myself a RWD snob, since I much prefer the handling of RWD over FWD. And a HDTV snob, since I can barely stand to watch standard def TV now that I have HD. Is it wrong to like the finer things in life? I hope not, because otherwise ClubLexus should have been called ClubToyotaMotorCorporation and we should all be driving Corollas and Camrys.
04-27-09, 01:40 PM
#28
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Don't get me wrong, I have owned and still own a Toyota, and a Scion. The reason I went for Lexus was because it was made by Toyota. They're reliable cars, keep their value, etc. But the point I was trying to make is that Lexus is a premium brand over Toyota. It's marketed as a more upscale, more luxurious car and you pay more for that. Everyone on here that's a Lexus owner apparently bought into that marketing to some degree, because otherwise we'd all have bought a Corolla, Camry, or a Avalon. There's nothing wrong with those cars as transportation, but we chose to buy something "better". So is it wrong to like things that are better made, or handle better, or look better (and these things aren't always correlated to price, but often are)? I say no. You're welcome to disagree.
04-27-09, 08:58 PM
#29
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Curb weight for 4 cylinder Camry is ~3300 but thats no big deal. The 2azfe engine had same throttle mapping. There is a slight difference with transmission but negligible.
I do know what you are trying to say about buying premium and the marketing. I use to own a Mercedes, status symbol? Yes. But I outgrew it.
Can you send the carne asada taco? Now that you mentioned it I got a craving.
I do know what you are trying to say about buying premium and the marketing. I use to own a Mercedes, status symbol? Yes. But I outgrew it.
Can you send the carne asada taco? Now that you mentioned it I got a craving.
04-27-09, 11:21 PM
#30
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you know what, I went down to the local tacqueria and ordered 4 tacos. One of them was yours but you never showed so I ate that one too.
thankfully the dealer finished work on my car today and I brought the ES back and took my IS home... I left a nice burned CD of hiphop in the stereo for the next lucky ES pilot to enjoy. Having been used to stomping indiscriminately on the throttle all weekend to get the ES to move, the same input nearly caused an inadvertent burnout on the way out of the parking lot in my IS.
It was kind of like bringing home a new car again. 
thankfully the dealer finished work on my car today and I brought the ES back and took my IS home... I left a nice burned CD of hiphop in the stereo for the next lucky ES pilot to enjoy. Having been used to stomping indiscriminately on the throttle all weekend to get the ES to move, the same input nearly caused an inadvertent burnout on the way out of the parking lot in my IS.
It was kind of like bringing home a new car again.