3rd Generation IS350 NEEDS to be Forced Induction
02-04-12, 04:42 PM
#31
This seems more feasible than FI, Lexus is not trying to become a company know for tuning. It's a luxury car company, not a sports car company. I rarely compare Lexus to BMW, I find it easier to compare to Mercedes in the sense that 90+% of both companies markets are to people who aren't buying the car to tune or mod. Most Lexus owners fall into an older age group, and buy the car for the luxury and reliability. It's hard to grasp the concept that these are luxury cars not tunable sports cars because most of us on this site are passionate about our cars to a point where we mod to personalize. If you want a FI engine with tuning capabilities your looking at buying a Subaru or Mitsubishi not a Lexus.
02-23-12, 10:09 AM
#32
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Like "My morning Jacket" Says :"We are the innovators, they are the immitators."
Lexus was already well into the production of the is350 BEFORe the 335i was even thought up.
Here's the story.
BMW heard that lexus was producing a 300+ hp entry level sedan for 2006. At that point BMW had the 330i. that produced a measly 225 hp at the crank. That's a full 75 hp under the proposed 300 estimated hp that the new lexus model would produce. BMW cant afford to allow a Japanese brand to surpass them in quality, reliability, luxury (Things lexus has schooled them in for years at this point) AND performance, not when they call themselves "The ultimate driving machine, so they needed a boost in power.
But, the time it would take to develop a whole new, N/A engine that produced a reliable 300+ hp Lexus would have out sold BMW be leagues so a drastic solution was in order.
Enter the 335i
Design a solidly built N/A engine with a low F/A and a durability level able to handle F/I and put it into the 330i chassis (With minor alterations to accomodate power and support requirements) and bada-bing bada-boom you've got a is350 killer.
Up until this point Bmw owners were dealing with modest, if sufficient power. When the 335i hit the market the wet dreams of so many BMW owners were realised in a flash. Then when it was found out that the engine had been tuned DOWN, the tuners went crazy with it and now we have things like the proceed-3 and the JB-3 tune which give you an additional 100hp from the 335i with a simple ecu flash.
So while I agree the is350 should have more power. It's not lexus's fault, not by a long shot. Instread think of it this way. Lexus designed the is350 SO well that it redefigned the market for the entry level sport/luxury sedan. But like any innovator, they were surpassed by competitors who wanted to one-up.
It's a pity the is350 was leaked so early before it's debut. Had lexus had even a year where the is350 could stand alone I imagine the increased revenue stream would have opened them up more to the idea of hp=profit and we'd probably see a 350 hp is350 by now and a 500 hp is-F. (which would trump ford and give Benz something to worry about.)
As for the future. Lexus is not a performance oriented brand by nature. This was their FIRST real venture in the "sporty" aspect of car design. and though they didn't topple the competition and come out on top (per say) They did DAMN well for their first try. I've driven and ridden in Audi;s, BMW,s MErcedes, Lexus, and Inifiniti and I can solidly say the Lexus has better quality, better reliability, better luxury and much more poise and class than the puffed up models of its competitors. For an ALL-AROUND package, there's nothing better than an is350.
Just some food for thought.
Lexus was already well into the production of the is350 BEFORe the 335i was even thought up.
Here's the story.
BMW heard that lexus was producing a 300+ hp entry level sedan for 2006. At that point BMW had the 330i. that produced a measly 225 hp at the crank. That's a full 75 hp under the proposed 300 estimated hp that the new lexus model would produce. BMW cant afford to allow a Japanese brand to surpass them in quality, reliability, luxury (Things lexus has schooled them in for years at this point) AND performance, not when they call themselves "The ultimate driving machine, so they needed a boost in power.
But, the time it would take to develop a whole new, N/A engine that produced a reliable 300+ hp Lexus would have out sold BMW be leagues so a drastic solution was in order.
Enter the 335i
Design a solidly built N/A engine with a low F/A and a durability level able to handle F/I and put it into the 330i chassis (With minor alterations to accomodate power and support requirements) and bada-bing bada-boom you've got a is350 killer.
Up until this point Bmw owners were dealing with modest, if sufficient power. When the 335i hit the market the wet dreams of so many BMW owners were realised in a flash. Then when it was found out that the engine had been tuned DOWN, the tuners went crazy with it and now we have things like the proceed-3 and the JB-3 tune which give you an additional 100hp from the 335i with a simple ecu flash.
So while I agree the is350 should have more power. It's not lexus's fault, not by a long shot. Instread think of it this way. Lexus designed the is350 SO well that it redefigned the market for the entry level sport/luxury sedan. But like any innovator, they were surpassed by competitors who wanted to one-up.
It's a pity the is350 was leaked so early before it's debut. Had lexus had even a year where the is350 could stand alone I imagine the increased revenue stream would have opened them up more to the idea of hp=profit and we'd probably see a 350 hp is350 by now and a 500 hp is-F. (which would trump ford and give Benz something to worry about.)
As for the future. Lexus is not a performance oriented brand by nature. This was their FIRST real venture in the "sporty" aspect of car design. and though they didn't topple the competition and come out on top (per say) They did DAMN well for their first try. I've driven and ridden in Audi;s, BMW,s MErcedes, Lexus, and Inifiniti and I can solidly say the Lexus has better quality, better reliability, better luxury and much more poise and class than the puffed up models of its competitors. For an ALL-AROUND package, there's nothing better than an is350.
Just some food for thought.
(maybe 225-250HP is250 and 325-350HP is350... )
02-23-12, 10:24 AM
#34
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This seems more feasible than FI, Lexus is not trying to become a company know for tuning. It's a luxury car company, not a sports car company. I rarely compare Lexus to BMW, I find it easier to compare to Mercedes in the sense that 90+% of both companies markets are to people who aren't buying the car to tune or mod. Most Lexus owners fall into an older age group, and buy the car for the luxury and reliability. It's hard to grasp the concept that these are luxury cars not tunable sports cars because most of us on this site are passionate about our cars to a point where we mod to personalize. If you want a FI engine with tuning capabilities your looking at buying a Subaru or Mitsubishi not a Lexus.
Infiniti is a luxury brand that opens itself to tuners. As for the actual Luxury aspect of the models, yes Lexus surpasses infiniti...but not by that much and ultimately Infiniti outsells Lexus every year. Thats partly because of the number of different models they produce vastly outnumbers lexus but also because their platforms offer very nice (if not lexus level) luxury and the opportunity to tune far beyond anything Lexus offers ($7500 for a 500hp S/C turn key solution for the g37/g35, )
Furthermore, Mercedes offer's 500hp cars. They don't need to provide much in the way of tuning. Even at 416 hp the isf is well below the cieling when it comes to how much power SHOULD be offered to customers .
And, to be precise AMG is to Mercedes benz like TRD is to Toyota. It IS a tuning wing where as the F marquee is actually is the name on a single car (LFA not withstanding) and F-sport is simply a package option not a performance wing.
02-23-12, 12:29 PM
#39
I dont think you read my whole post. The IS250 will stay but as our IS300 instead. The 300 monikor has more history and made an impact, and its still slow, reliable and very much lexus. so that target marker wont change The is250 is laughable (no offense is250 owners, you know waht i mean). Altohugh just as slow atleast the IS300 has the name. (image is everything)
02-23-12, 01:01 PM
#40
A caveat to this.
Infiniti is a luxury brand that opens itself to tuners. As for the actual Luxury aspect of the models, yes Lexus surpasses infiniti...but not by that much and ultimately Infiniti outsells Lexus every year. Thats partly because of the number of different models they produce vastly outnumbers lexus but also because their platforms offer very nice (if not lexus level) luxury and the opportunity to tune far beyond anything Lexus offers ($7500 for a 500hp S/C turn key solution for the g37/g35, )
.
Infiniti is a luxury brand that opens itself to tuners. As for the actual Luxury aspect of the models, yes Lexus surpasses infiniti...but not by that much and ultimately Infiniti outsells Lexus every year. Thats partly because of the number of different models they produce vastly outnumbers lexus but also because their platforms offer very nice (if not lexus level) luxury and the opportunity to tune far beyond anything Lexus offers ($7500 for a 500hp S/C turn key solution for the g37/g35, )
.
lexus sells like 3 or 4 vehicles for every 1 Infiniti does.
In the US specifically Lexus was the #1 selling Luxury brand period (ahead of BMW, Mercedes, Infiniti, Acura, etc) for pretty much the entire 2000-2010 period....
In 2009 for example Lexus sold about 215,000 US vehicles. Infiniti sold just over 80,000. It's not even close.
Your "number of models" thing is off as well... it's again exactly the opposite of what you claim.
Infiniti offers the EX, FX, G (sedan, coupe, and convertible), the JX, the M, and the QX... 6 models total...or 8 if you count the different Gs are models.
Lexus offers the CT, ES, GS, GX, HS, IS (sedan, F, and convertible), LF-A, LS, LX, and RX... 10 models... or 12 if you count the ISes as different models.
Lexus sells more of one model (the RX) in a year than Infiniti sells total of all their models in a year combined.
Oh, and Lexus sells a 500 hp car too (552 in fact).... it's just a bit pricey
Last edited by Kurtz; 02-23-12 at 01:15 PM.
02-23-12, 03:18 PM
#42
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On another note, the 350 engine is a gem and still very current. Very few cars are even able to match the torque number on the IS350 despite their larger displacement. So 4.0L V6 is unnecessary just as it is unlikely
Lexus IS350....................3.5L V6.....306hp.....277lbft
Lexus GS350....................3.5L V6.....303hp.....274lbft (2012 model)
MBZ C-Class.....................3.5L V6.....302hp.....273lbft
Acura TL..........................3.5L V6.....280hp.....254lbft
Acura TL SH-AWD.................3.7L V6.....305hp.....273lbft
Upcoming Acura V6.............3.5L V6.....310hp......265lbft
Camaro V6........................3.6L V6.....312hp.....278lbft
Ford Mustang V6................3.7L V6.....305hp.....280lbft
Infiniti G35 (2008 Sedan)....3.5L V6.....306hp.....268lbft
Nissan Maxima..................3.5L V6.....290hp.....261lbft
Nissan 370Z.......................3.7L V6.....332hp.....270lbft
Nissan 370Z Nismo...............3.7L V6.....350hp.....276lbft
Infiniti G37 Sedan................3.7L V6.....328hp.....269lbft
G37 Coupe........................................330hp.....270lbft
G37 Convertible..................................325hp.....267lbft
G37 IPL.............................................348hp.....276lbft
Hyundai Genesis Coupe...........3.8L V6.....306hp.....266lbft (2012 model)
Hyundai Genesis Coupe...........3.8L V6.....348hp.....295lbft (2013 model)
Last edited by Hoovey689; 02-23-12 at 03:34 PM.
02-23-12, 03:38 PM
#43
I've yet to see anyone confirm if the TMG engine was NA or not
I've seen quite a few folks suggest it's actually a forced induction version of the IS-F motor... and in this pic of it it sure looks like there could be an intercooler hiding down there-
http://www.blogcdn.com/www.autoblog....xus-ls-tmg.jpg
02-23-12, 03:50 PM
#44
DO we actually know that?
I've yet to see anyone confirm if the TMG engine was NA or not
I've seen quite a few folks suggest it's actually a forced induction version of the IS-F motor... and in this pic of it it sure looks like there could be an intercooler hiding down there-
http://www.blogcdn.com/www.autoblog....xus-ls-tmg.jpg
I've yet to see anyone confirm if the TMG engine was NA or not
I've seen quite a few folks suggest it's actually a forced induction version of the IS-F motor... and in this pic of it it sure looks like there could be an intercooler hiding down there-
http://www.blogcdn.com/www.autoblog....xus-ls-tmg.jpg
https://www.clublexus.com/articles/l...topiccnews.php
If it is FI then i'd expect supercharged. Regardless of what current 5.0L numbers suggest, there's far more power to be had out of that V8, and its a good guess we'll see an uprooted version of it in the GSF. Plenty of room in the engine bay
02-23-12, 07:21 PM
#45
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I'd say yes, something's wrong with your tach. Red-line is 6500. You'll hit the rev limiter if you try to go over that. I'm not sure how it works with the 250 manuals but in the auto there's no way to go over the red-line. If your needle is hitting 7000, something's wrong with the calibration.