View Poll Results: Would you buy an IS 350 in AWD if it was offered by Lexus ?
Yes, regardless of the climate I lived in.
13
23.21%
No, regardless of the climate I lived in.
16
28.57%
Yes, since I live where there are snowy winters.
16
28.57%
No, since I live where there is never any snow where I live.
11
19.64%
Voters: 56. You may not vote on this poll
WHY no AWD for the IS 350 ???
08-30-09, 07:21 PM
#16
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like Kurtz mentioned, the is350 is a sport performance car, it doesnt really need the awd to slow it down, and also like Kurtz said ppl are driving in the snow fine with rwd
08-30-09, 07:42 PM
#17
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08-30-09, 08:02 PM
#19
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The following won't be popular with AWD owners, but it's true-
AWD is a crutch for people who either don't own snow tires or don't know how to drive a car correctly.
People got along fine with RWD cars in the worst snows around for most of the last century. And without even the benefit for modern tires or modern traction control.
The 350 is a performance car, there's no reason to saddle it with a bunch of extra weight and a power-robbing drivetrain.
There's 350 owners in Canada (and Chicago) by the way who have no problem getting around.
I lived in Canada (and a couple northern areas of the US) with RWD V8 American cars with no traction control and got around just fine, I've no doubt I'd have even less trouble with my 350.
AWD is a crutch for people who either don't own snow tires or don't know how to drive a car correctly.
People got along fine with RWD cars in the worst snows around for most of the last century. And without even the benefit for modern tires or modern traction control.
The 350 is a performance car, there's no reason to saddle it with a bunch of extra weight and a power-robbing drivetrain.
There's 350 owners in Canada (and Chicago) by the way who have no problem getting around.
I lived in Canada (and a couple northern areas of the US) with RWD V8 American cars with no traction control and got around just fine, I've no doubt I'd have even less trouble with my 350.
08-31-09, 07:56 AM
#20
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The following won't be popular with AWD owners, but it's true-
AWD is a crutch for people who either don't own snow tires or don't know how to drive a car correctly.
People got along fine with RWD cars in the worst snows around for most of the last century. And without even the benefit for modern tires or modern traction control.
The 350 is a performance car, there's no reason to saddle it with a bunch of extra weight and a power-robbing drivetrain.
There's 350 owners in Canada (and Chicago) by the way who have no problem getting around.
I lived in Canada (and a couple northern areas of the US) with RWD V8 American cars with no traction control and got around just fine, I've no doubt I'd have even less trouble with my 350.
AWD is a crutch for people who either don't own snow tires or don't know how to drive a car correctly.
People got along fine with RWD cars in the worst snows around for most of the last century. And without even the benefit for modern tires or modern traction control.
The 350 is a performance car, there's no reason to saddle it with a bunch of extra weight and a power-robbing drivetrain.
There's 350 owners in Canada (and Chicago) by the way who have no problem getting around.
I lived in Canada (and a couple northern areas of the US) with RWD V8 American cars with no traction control and got around just fine, I've no doubt I'd have even less trouble with my 350.
AC was not available for many years in cars yet you have AC. Would you buy a car w/o it?
Many people survived w/o seatbelts. Would you buy a car w/o it?
Many people survived Polio yet they developed a vaccine. Did you get that vaccine?
You can still get a phone modem to access the internet. Do you have dial up or a faster connection?
Regardless of what works for you, many of us prefer the advancement of technology. AWD being one of those advances. Yes we could all get around w/o AWD as you have pointed out so many times I have lost count. Why do you care? There are those of us who prefer the safety and improved traction AWD provides in areas of the countries that experience snow and ice covered roads. That's why we bought AWD. As you have pointed out so many times the cost of an AWD is smiliar to an IS350 yet we have decided to purchase AWD instead. Why? Because AWD is superior to RWD in inclement weather.
BTW I absolutely know how to drive a car. I'm offended that you would claim it is my crutch when in fact it is just a good decision to protect my self, my wife, and my children with the superior traction over RWD in inclement weather. You don't know me or many others on this board. Stop acting as though you hold all the answers to all the truths in life. You don't. You don't know what's best for me or many others on this board.
08-31-09, 09:13 AM
#21
Sure.
And once the car is moving it doesn't make a lot of difference.
Putting chains on is even BETTER traction, do that a lot do ya?
If your goal was purely performance to the exclusion of all else you might... but modern AC systems don't cost much performance anymore... AWD systems cost a LOT of performance. And the 350 is a performance oriented vehicle. Hence AWD kinda sucks for that application.
Again, a silly comparison. There's virtually no "cost" to seatbelts. There's a huge cost (both money and performance and mileage) to AWD in comparison.
AWD doesn't really provide much "safety" for driving on snow/ice... you bought into a marketing trick really... you can thank Subaru in large part, but others have joined in on it.
Here's a nice article on the false myth of the "safety" of AWD-
http://www.4x4abc.com/jeep101/safe.html
Because AWDs marketing has been really good. Plus in many markets nearly -all- the 2IS sitting on dealer lots are AWD and many consumers don't really know they could order a RWD, or why they might want to. But the nice man at the dealership assured them AWD was "safer" and don't they want to spend a few grand more? THINK OF THE CHILDREN!!!
In fact I have a friend in Minnesota who specifically did NOT buy a Lexus because the dealership there didn't want to sell anything but AWD cars, and he wanted a RWD 350. He went across town to the Infiniti guy who was happy to sell him a RWD G35 (despite them offering it in AWD, he understood the performance hit versus the minor traction gain)
In the meantime we do have a few 350 owners in Canada, Chicago, NY, and elsewhere who know how to drive properly, have good SNOW tires, and get around just fine without problems in the winter.
Then you probably ought to know how little difference AWD helps in most driving situations once the car is moving.
Having a heavier AWD car makes handling worse though, so for the majority of the year when you're NOT trying to start moving on snow/ice you'll be a touch slower to avoid accidents than the RWD car will be... (in addition to being slower to speed up out of the way of stuff, and burning more gas while doing so).
And once the car is moving it doesn't make a lot of difference.
Putting chains on is even BETTER traction, do that a lot do ya?
Again, a silly comparison. There's virtually no "cost" to seatbelts. There's a huge cost (both money and performance and mileage) to AWD in comparison.
Regardless of what works for you, many of us prefer the advancement of technology. AWD being one of those advances. Yes we could all get around w/o AWD as you have pointed out so many times I have lost count. Why do you care? There are those of us who prefer the safety and improved traction AWD provides in areas of the countries that experience snow and ice covered roads. That's why we bought AWD.
Here's a nice article on the false myth of the "safety" of AWD-
http://www.4x4abc.com/jeep101/safe.html
Because AWDs marketing has been really good. Plus in many markets nearly -all- the 2IS sitting on dealer lots are AWD and many consumers don't really know they could order a RWD, or why they might want to. But the nice man at the dealership assured them AWD was "safer" and don't they want to spend a few grand more? THINK OF THE CHILDREN!!!
In fact I have a friend in Minnesota who specifically did NOT buy a Lexus because the dealership there didn't want to sell anything but AWD cars, and he wanted a RWD 350. He went across town to the Infiniti guy who was happy to sell him a RWD G35 (despite them offering it in AWD, he understood the performance hit versus the minor traction gain)
In the meantime we do have a few 350 owners in Canada, Chicago, NY, and elsewhere who know how to drive properly, have good SNOW tires, and get around just fine without problems in the winter.
Then you probably ought to know how little difference AWD helps in most driving situations once the car is moving.
Having a heavier AWD car makes handling worse though, so for the majority of the year when you're NOT trying to start moving on snow/ice you'll be a touch slower to avoid accidents than the RWD car will be... (in addition to being slower to speed up out of the way of stuff, and burning more gas while doing so).
08-31-09, 10:23 AM
#22
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hmm.. not saying i'm a huge fan of awd.. but why was the audi a4 quattro so successful in the 90s btcc, even with a huge race-spec-required weight disadvantage. they switched to fwd in the latter years and did not dominate anymore. true, awd won't help u stop any faster, but snow tires and/or chains on awd sure beats snow tires and/or chains on rwd/fwd when trying to get traction. ppl just have to be smart driving in snow/ice. can't defy laws of physics no matter what the system is.
08-31-09, 10:51 AM
#23
hmm.. not saying i'm a huge fan of awd.. but why was the audi a4 quattro so successful in the 90s btcc, even with a huge race-spec-required weight disadvantage. they switched to fwd in the latter years and did not dominate anymore. true, awd won't help u stop any faster, but snow tires and/or chains on awd sure beats snow tires and/or chains on rwd/fwd when trying to get traction. ppl just have to be smart driving in snow/ice. can't defy laws of physics no matter what the system is.
Audi first competed in btcc in 1996... where indeed it won that year. In 1997 the Renault Laguna won not only more rounds, but took both 1st and 3rd place. In 1998 the Audi won not a single round and came in 7th overall, behind Volvos, Nissans, Renaults, even a Honda Accord...
By 1999 Audis team left the series.
08-31-09, 03:27 PM
#24
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iirc, 1996 won with quattro despite a weight penalty of 275 lbs. and in 1997, they lost because of inconsistency at the beginning of the year. biela still managed to finish 2nd overall. in 1998, they switched to fwd and was completely uncompetitive.
anyway, ot
anyway, ot
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