is250cpo

iTrader: (1)

Got the Fedex in the mail.

Lexus's conclusion is that they are not in the wrong and suggest I pursue this through NCSD if i want to continue to dispute this.

ddhleigh

Crummy decision by Lexus. What are you plans now? NCSD and lawyer?

is250cpo

iTrader: (1)

well faxing will take 2 mins, i might as well,

Whatever NCSD decides is binding on their part, but not for me and I have all the documentation they need already gathered.

Anyone still think this is worth pursuing through a lawyer given that one has already said that this would be a 50/50 case?

calvin2376

iTrader: (2)

I thought they said it was 50/50 BEFORE Lexus admitted the car shouldn't have been CPO'd? What were the circumstances under which you heard that - did Lexus formally tell you that it shouldn't have been CPO'd or was it just an offhand comment from a service tech? If Lexus said it shouldn't have been CPO'd, then you have a very strong case.

I would set up a meeting with a lemon law lawyer and explain the situation. The way I see it, if the car should not have been CPO'd, then you have a pretty bulletproof case. You can do the requisite research on your own. Take the car to a reputable body shop, ask them to take off the front bumper and check for evidence of serious damage, specifically frame damage. If there is frame damage, then that car should not have been CPO'd (it says so right on Lexus' website about what can and can't be CPO'd). I think the case for fraud is very strong if they sold you a car that has frame damage while signing off on it as CPO, which NECESSARILY requires it NOT to have frame damage.

I think you should pursue every option available, but definitely speak with a lawyer and get his thoughts; obviously he'll know better than you or I what your chances are. I'd also send a letter to Lexus, specifically the people you've been working with, stating your disappointment with the decision, laying out the facts, and explaining you'll be pursuing every course of action including retaining legal counsel.

I'm sorry you have to put up with this nonsense. This isn't how a company should treat its customers.

One thing to keep in mind though is that worst case scenario, you're still left with a car that's CPO. Now that Lexus has admitted no wrong, that necessarily implies that what they're saying is the car is fine as it is and has not been misrepresented. That means the CPO warranty must stand, which means you should be able to take it to any Lexus dealer (including Dealer B, who turned you away before) and get and CPO-covered work done you want. If they say no, then you can call Lexus corporate and tell them to make it right. At this point, the only loss you'll take, unfortunate as it is, is the potential loss of value when you resell the car.

is250cpo

iTrader: (1)

It was an offhand comment from the service adviser when I went to pick up the car. I will ask to see the report but i doubt Lexus will let me see what the actual inspection of the car uncovered.

Yeah worst case, like you said is I will take a ding when i resell my car. at least they fixed that bumper gap between the headlight for free.

Ill have to find some time to take it to a body shop to check for frame damage, if there is then i know for a fact that they need to take it back.

is250cpo

iTrader: (1)

i think i may also email the local consumer watch reporters in the NOVA area and copy don nickles and people from lexus corporate in that email.
Calvin, i forgot the names of the reports in the area that does these types of reports. In NY we have help me howard, im having some difficulty finding the names online. So far i found Liz Crenshaw. Do you or any other people on this forum from Maryland, Northern VA or Washington DC recall the names of these consumer watch reporters from ABC, CBS, WB, FOX news network?

Keppie

What a bazaar twist. I wouldn't mess with a body shop at this point. Lexus will say the car was inspected by a dealer, corporate and found nothing that would disqualify the car from being CPO'ed. If the frame was inspected and found to be perfect what would you want to do?

I would ask for a copy of the report. What do you have to lose by asking? I would get the name of the person who said the car would not be qualify as a CPO.

Come trade in time you will probably lose a bit but is hiring an attorney going to offset the loss?

See if you can get the report then decide. Any chance it is on their website?

is250cpo

iTrader: (1)

I will definitely ask for the report to see what is wrong.
what website are u referring to keppie? The owners website? If so, the service record doesn't indicate anymore then "INSPECTED BY FTS LEXUS"

Jmags

iTrader: (1)

So you have CPO lexus that a dealer near you wont work on for free?

If that was the case I'd contact a lawyer.

If they NOW will work on it for free, I would hit them up for EVERY recall and TSIB I could find, hoping they damage it while fixing it and making them fix it over and over.

is250cpo

iTrader: (1)

i have a bit of patience but not that much lol. so far, knock on wood, the car is doing fine. I rather not have them touch anything unless its really necessary at this point.

I just emailed local consumer watch news reporters, copied mark templin and don nickles... lets see if this ignites anything.

is250cpo

iTrader: (1)

Spoke with the NE person that handled the case.
Unfortunately under the Lemon law, this doesn’t qualify since this was not a defect, just that it was in a car accident and a case of a bad dealer.

Under Toyota rules, they cannot fax me the findings, but told me that the left fender and bumper was replaced but there was no frame damage. Under any warranty CPO or new car warranty, lexus /Toyota would not repair any non lexus/Toyota parts so that was the situation with my case. If I had any future issues for anything not related to the accident, then it will be covered.

Corporate cannot force a specific dealer to do anything, they can urge them to do something but it is still up to the dealer to decide if they want to rectify anything.

calvin2376

iTrader: (2)

I wouldn't have thought you'd get anything under lemon law, this is more an example of fraud or misrepresentation by a dealer. I still think you should at least take a free consultation with a lawyer (not a lemon law lawyer) to ask their thoughts.

I think unless you pursue legal action and that action is successful (obviously not a guarantee), you may be stuck here. However, at this point I would call the dealer and Lexus corporate and tell them if that's their finding, then they need to verify exactly which parts are non-Lexus and then replace those parts with Lexus parts, because you were sold a car with a CPO warranty that stated these explicit terms:

This is what is COVERED by the CPO warranty:

This warranty covers any repair or replacement of components that fail under normal use due to a defect in materials or workmanship except as set forth under "Exclusions."

This is what is EXCLUDED from coverage by the CPO warranty:

Standard Upkeep Items:
accessory drive belts, batteries, filters, fluids, heating and vacuum hoses, lines and tubes, tires, spark plugs, windshield wiper blades (rubber component).

Wear and Tear:
Examples include brake pads, rotors, shoes and drums and manual clutches.

Body and Interior:
bumpers, carpet, chrome, dash cover and pad, door trim, handles, fabric, glass (including windshield), headliner, hinges, interior and exterior trim and moldings, cupholders, ashtrays, covers and vents, lightbulbs, nuts, bolts, clips, retainers and fasteners, paint, rust and corrosion damage, seat covers, shiny metals, weather stripping.

Accessories:
any non-Lexus accessories or modified components, including but not limited to wheels, radar detectors and cellular phones.

Other:
any component which has not failed, but that a repair facility recommends or requires to be replaced, repaired or adjusted.

The italicized portion is what matters. In purchasing the car, I believe you sign a contract agreeing to the terms of the CPO warranty. That's a bilateral contract; you're agreeing to those terms but in addition, the dealer (and Lexus) who are the other parties to the contract are also agreeing to those terms. In being presented that warranty contract, you rightfully believed that "this warranty covers any repair or replacement of components that fail under normal use due to a defect in materials or workmanship except as set forth under "Exclusions." Nowhere in the contract nor during the purchase process were you informed that in fact, NOT everything on YOUR PARTICULAR CAR was covered according to these contract terms because your car had been involved in an undisclosed accident and had parts replaced with non-Lexus parts.

Basically you need to request that you be made whole. Tell them you're satisfied that you have a CPO car, but you were told and signed a contract that implied that the CPO warranty covered your car in full, not in part. You need to have a full CPO warranty for the terms of the sale to be valid and not fraudulent.

That's my thoughts on this. Again, I'm sorry you're in this position, this is poor customer service on Lexus corporate's part but MUCH worse on Lexus of Rockville's part.

Keppie

"What website are u referring to keppie?"

A few weeks ago you mentioned looking on the Lexus website and seeing that the car had some work done, parts replaced or something. I remember you said it was a clue. Do you remember that post?

is250cpo

iTrader: (1)

ah yeah, thats the owners website. they do not show this information. its just a list service records that the dealer has entered into the system.

is250cpo

iTrader: (1)

Good point, let me contact them again.