Paddle shifter?
01-17-12, 09:13 PM
#16
Lexus Test Driver
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I'm not sure if I get you guys saying it is not a real paddle shifter. If I put mine in S mode and paddle down to 1 it will not shift till I paddle to 2 then paddle to 3, ect then when I no longer want to speed up I paddle down all the way to 1st when stopping. It won't up shift until I paddle up and it will down shift when I paddle down. If you let it do it on its own you are not paddle shifting but letting it work as an auto in S mode. I guess that because in s mode it allows you to set an upper limit and then letting it shift for you you are correct in saying it is not a paddle shifter but that is your choice and could be considered a third use for the auto trans. Full auto (D) upper limit auto (S) with no input from you and full paddle (S) with your full control this means you have to paddle down as well as up to achieve a full paddle shift.
Just my thoughts, and paddle shifting is a pain in the butt.
Just my thoughts, and paddle shifting is a pain in the butt.
01-18-12, 06:01 AM
#19
Re-posting the content here in case anyone doesn't feel like finding the other thread-
The gears don't actually downshift when paddling down either. Again the system tricks you into thinking so, but drive an IS-F and you'll tell the difference.
In an IS-F if you are going 30 mph and you put it in M-4 you are in EXACTLY 4th gear, and will stay there until you shift one way or another.... paddle down to M-3 and you are, in about 0.1 seconds, in EXACTLY 3rd, and will stay there.
in an ISx50 if you are going 30 mph and put it in S-4 you MIGHT be in any gear between 1-4, since the computer is allowed to use anything at or below the limit you set.
If you happen to be in 3rd (because the specific conditions, speed, pedal input, transmission learning, pitch of the car, etc say 3rd is best for those conditions, and the computer decides that) then even if you "shift" down to S-3 the car won't shift at all it will remain in the same 3rd gear it was in before in S-4. It just won't then be allowed to shift "up" to 4 automatically if conditions change to where it thinks that's a good idea.
In short- in an F if you put it in M-4, it's in 4th period. In an ISx50 if you put it in S-4 it might be in any gear from 1st through 4th depending which one it thinks is best for the current situation.
So again, you can't, ever, directly shift an ISx50 like you can an F. The only thing you can ever do is lock out a specific upper range of gears. Sometimes, depending on conditions, this will trick you into thinking you "shifted" the car, but you didn't. The automatic transmission is always automatic, controlled by the computer, within the gear range you allow.
That's not to say S mode is never useful... it's great for saving your brakes when coming down off a mountainside for example... and can have some limited use for "fun" driving on twisty roads if you want to, say, lock out the top 2 (overdrive) gears.... but the paddles aren't shifters... ever. They'll never work like the paddles in an IS-F (or other true direct-shift transmissions, including manuals)...and they'll always be a lot slower to cause a change in gears than those types of cars or just letting the computer do it in D will be.
The gears don't actually downshift when paddling down either. Again the system tricks you into thinking so, but drive an IS-F and you'll tell the difference.
In an IS-F if you are going 30 mph and you put it in M-4 you are in EXACTLY 4th gear, and will stay there until you shift one way or another.... paddle down to M-3 and you are, in about 0.1 seconds, in EXACTLY 3rd, and will stay there.
in an ISx50 if you are going 30 mph and put it in S-4 you MIGHT be in any gear between 1-4, since the computer is allowed to use anything at or below the limit you set.
If you happen to be in 3rd (because the specific conditions, speed, pedal input, transmission learning, pitch of the car, etc say 3rd is best for those conditions, and the computer decides that) then even if you "shift" down to S-3 the car won't shift at all it will remain in the same 3rd gear it was in before in S-4. It just won't then be allowed to shift "up" to 4 automatically if conditions change to where it thinks that's a good idea.
In short- in an F if you put it in M-4, it's in 4th period. In an ISx50 if you put it in S-4 it might be in any gear from 1st through 4th depending which one it thinks is best for the current situation.
So again, you can't, ever, directly shift an ISx50 like you can an F. The only thing you can ever do is lock out a specific upper range of gears. Sometimes, depending on conditions, this will trick you into thinking you "shifted" the car, but you didn't. The automatic transmission is always automatic, controlled by the computer, within the gear range you allow.
That's not to say S mode is never useful... it's great for saving your brakes when coming down off a mountainside for example... and can have some limited use for "fun" driving on twisty roads if you want to, say, lock out the top 2 (overdrive) gears.... but the paddles aren't shifters... ever. They'll never work like the paddles in an IS-F (or other true direct-shift transmissions, including manuals)...and they'll always be a lot slower to cause a change in gears than those types of cars or just letting the computer do it in D will be.
01-18-12, 06:10 AM
#20
Pole Position
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I have a 2011 IS350 and hate this about my paddle shifters: I cruise home on a freeway at 70mph with cruise control on, but due to the little hills the engine downshifts to stay at current speed. I put the car in manual mode and select 6th gear, but the car downshifts anyway on the hills. I want it to just give more gas in 6th gear instead of downshifting, but this is not possible. Because of this I never use the paddles (the car is fast enough in the lower gears for me).
01-18-12, 08:30 AM
#21
it's impossible to paddle down to a lower gear if you are going to fast for that gear, so you can't suddenly break anything that way.
That said, you don't really want to use them to replace your brakes on a regular basis. Brakes are a lot cheaper to replace than engines or transmissions.
It's fine to use em to avoid fade coming down out of the mountains or something, but day to day normal street driving, use the brake pedal, that's what it's there for, and puts a lot less stress on the drivetrain than constant engine braking does.
That said, the paddles are utterly useless for something like a drag race. Leave it in D and ECT-Normal and you'll beat a guy trying to use the paddles every time. The computer is way, way way faster than you are and as noted, the paddles don't directly shift the car anyway... so all you're doing with the paddles is delaying the chance for the FULLY AUTOMATIC transmission to shift at the appropriate time and risking a time-killing bounce off the rev limiter.
That said, you don't really want to use them to replace your brakes on a regular basis. Brakes are a lot cheaper to replace than engines or transmissions.
It's fine to use em to avoid fade coming down out of the mountains or something, but day to day normal street driving, use the brake pedal, that's what it's there for, and puts a lot less stress on the drivetrain than constant engine braking does.
That said, the paddles are utterly useless for something like a drag race. Leave it in D and ECT-Normal and you'll beat a guy trying to use the paddles every time. The computer is way, way way faster than you are and as noted, the paddles don't directly shift the car anyway... so all you're doing with the paddles is delaying the chance for the FULLY AUTOMATIC transmission to shift at the appropriate time and risking a time-killing bounce off the rev limiter.
! Very informative 
Could you further explain the bolded parts? I'm assuming it has something to do with manual transmission, which I have no idea how to use
Does the ECT-power and ECT-normal really make a difference? I couldn't find the thread, can you paste the link here? Thanks
Re-posting the content here in case anyone doesn't feel like finding the other thread-
The gears don't actually downshift when paddling down either. Again the system tricks you into thinking so, but drive an IS-F and you'll tell the difference.
In an IS-F if you are going 30 mph and you put it in M-4 you are in EXACTLY 4th gear, and will stay there until you shift one way or another.... paddle down to M-3 and you are, in about 0.1 seconds, in EXACTLY 3rd, and will stay there.
in an ISx50 if you are going 30 mph and put it in S-4 you MIGHT be in any gear between 1-4, since the computer is allowed to use anything at or below the limit you set.
If you happen to be in 3rd (because the specific conditions, speed, pedal input, transmission learning, pitch of the car, etc say 3rd is best for those conditions, and the computer decides that) then even if you "shift" down to S-3 the car won't shift at all it will remain in the same 3rd gear it was in before in S-4. It just won't then be allowed to shift "up" to 4 automatically if conditions change to where it thinks that's a good idea.
In short- in an F if you put it in M-4, it's in 4th period. In an ISx50 if you put it in S-4 it might be in any gear from 1st through 4th depending which one it thinks is best for the current situation.
So again, you can't, ever, directly shift an ISx50 like you can an F. The only thing you can ever do is lock out a specific upper range of gears. Sometimes, depending on conditions, this will trick you into thinking you "shifted" the car, but you didn't. The automatic transmission is always automatic, controlled by the computer, within the gear range you allow.
That's not to say S mode is never useful... it's great for saving your brakes when coming down off a mountainside for example... and can have some limited use for "fun" driving on twisty roads if you want to, say, lock out the top 2 (overdrive) gears.... but the paddles aren't shifters... ever. They'll never work like the paddles in an IS-F (or other true direct-shift transmissions, including manuals)...and they'll always be a lot slower to cause a change in gears than those types of cars or just letting the computer do it in D will be.
The gears don't actually downshift when paddling down either. Again the system tricks you into thinking so, but drive an IS-F and you'll tell the difference.
In an IS-F if you are going 30 mph and you put it in M-4 you are in EXACTLY 4th gear, and will stay there until you shift one way or another.... paddle down to M-3 and you are, in about 0.1 seconds, in EXACTLY 3rd, and will stay there.
in an ISx50 if you are going 30 mph and put it in S-4 you MIGHT be in any gear between 1-4, since the computer is allowed to use anything at or below the limit you set.
If you happen to be in 3rd (because the specific conditions, speed, pedal input, transmission learning, pitch of the car, etc say 3rd is best for those conditions, and the computer decides that) then even if you "shift" down to S-3 the car won't shift at all it will remain in the same 3rd gear it was in before in S-4. It just won't then be allowed to shift "up" to 4 automatically if conditions change to where it thinks that's a good idea.
In short- in an F if you put it in M-4, it's in 4th period. In an ISx50 if you put it in S-4 it might be in any gear from 1st through 4th depending which one it thinks is best for the current situation.
So again, you can't, ever, directly shift an ISx50 like you can an F. The only thing you can ever do is lock out a specific upper range of gears. Sometimes, depending on conditions, this will trick you into thinking you "shifted" the car, but you didn't. The automatic transmission is always automatic, controlled by the computer, within the gear range you allow.
That's not to say S mode is never useful... it's great for saving your brakes when coming down off a mountainside for example... and can have some limited use for "fun" driving on twisty roads if you want to, say, lock out the top 2 (overdrive) gears.... but the paddles aren't shifters... ever. They'll never work like the paddles in an IS-F (or other true direct-shift transmissions, including manuals)...and they'll always be a lot slower to cause a change in gears than those types of cars or just letting the computer do it in D will be.
Thanks so much guys !
01-18-12, 10:08 AM
#22
The manual mode could be used to keep the engine in the power curve (RPM range) when going to pass or going through/out of a curve. You can also use the manual mode to shed some speed. The manual mode on the IS does not make the trans a manual, it only allows you to select (hold) a lower gear when needed. I found the manual mode to be very effective when I am passing/playing with another car. I can sit in a low gear, with revs up, waiting for my break. As soon as I get my break, I paddle up to 5th so I can concentrate on driving and let the trans take care of the up shifting (The top speed limiter kicks in on 5th gear so 6th gear is not needed, at all, when playing). I also prefer the center console selector instead of the paddles.
Koz
Koz
01-18-12, 10:32 AM
#23
The manual mode could be used to keep the engine in the power curve (RPM range) when going to pass or going through/out of a curve. You can also use the manual mode to shed some speed. The manual mode on the IS does not make the trans a manual, it only allows you to select (hold) a lower gear when needed. I found the manual mode to be very effective when I am passing/playing with another car. I can sit in a low gear, with revs up, waiting for my break. As soon as I get my break, I paddle up to 5th so I can concentrate on driving and let the trans take care of the up shifting (The top speed limiter kicks in on 5th gear so 6th gear is not needed, at all, when playing). I also prefer the center console selector instead of the paddles.
Koz
Koz
One clarification- S mode does not ever let you "hold a gear" except arguably 1st gear.
S-3 for example the car can still freely, automatically, shift between 1, 2, and 3 as conditions call for.
M mode on an IS-F can genuinely hold a gear... no mode on the ISx50 will.
But yeah, mostly you'd lock out higher gears, apart from the coming-off-a-mountain scenario, in situations where you want the car to be operating higher in the rev range for some reason, usually passing.
I find in the passing situation though it's quicker/easier to just move the shifter back to D rather than "paddle up" to 5 or 6.
If you do so after hitting the gas it should work at least as well and take less time/distraction operating the paddles and/or shifter.
As to the other questions-
There's a whole big thread on engine braking (and why you shoudn't use it to replace your brakes) that should answer any questions you have on it...
As to ECT power, another thread discusses the fact that ECT-Normal actually holds gears slightly longer in a drag race situation, with logs from Gernby posted to prove it... but here's exactly what POWER mode does
https://www.clublexus.com/forums/5807368-post24.html
01-18-12, 11:34 AM
#24
One clarification- S mode does not ever let you "hold a gear" except arguably 1st gear.
S-3 for example the car can still freely, automatically, shift between 1, 2, and 3 as conditions call for.
M mode on an IS-F can genuinely hold a gear... no mode on the ISx50 will.
But yeah, mostly you'd lock out higher gears, apart from the coming-off-a-mountain scenario, in situations where you want the car to be operating higher in the rev range for some reason, usually passing.
I find in the passing situation though it's quicker/easier to just move the shifter back to D rather than "paddle up" to 5 or 6.
If you do so after hitting the gas it should work at least as well and take less time/distraction operating the paddles and/or shifter.
As to the other questions-
There's a whole big thread on engine braking (and why you shoudn't use it to replace your brakes) that should answer any questions you have on it...
As to ECT power, another thread discusses the fact that ECT-Normal actually holds gears slightly longer in a drag race situation, with logs from Gernby posted to prove it... but here's exactly what POWER mode does
https://www.clublexus.com/forums/5807368-post24.html
S-3 for example the car can still freely, automatically, shift between 1, 2, and 3 as conditions call for.
M mode on an IS-F can genuinely hold a gear... no mode on the ISx50 will.
But yeah, mostly you'd lock out higher gears, apart from the coming-off-a-mountain scenario, in situations where you want the car to be operating higher in the rev range for some reason, usually passing.
I find in the passing situation though it's quicker/easier to just move the shifter back to D rather than "paddle up" to 5 or 6.
If you do so after hitting the gas it should work at least as well and take less time/distraction operating the paddles and/or shifter.
As to the other questions-
There's a whole big thread on engine braking (and why you shoudn't use it to replace your brakes) that should answer any questions you have on it...
As to ECT power, another thread discusses the fact that ECT-Normal actually holds gears slightly longer in a drag race situation, with logs from Gernby posted to prove it... but here's exactly what POWER mode does
https://www.clublexus.com/forums/5807368-post24.html
Koz
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