Cranks but does not start???
01-14-18, 06:14 PM
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Cranks but does not start???
New to club Lexus. Thanks in advance for the help. Sorry for the lengthy post but I want to make sure I'm covering everything.
I'm having issues with my 2006 Lexus IS250. It has approximately 147000 miles on it.
History:
I had the alternator and battery replaced about a year ago
I live in North Carolina and its has been a little cooler, dropping into the low teens
A while back, about 8mo to a year ago, there were several instances where the car ran rough. 3-4 different times at stop lights the rpms would bounce around for 5-10 secs before clearing up and running normal. Also, one morning the car started fine and idled but when I put it into gear and the rpms dropped as they should, it started running rough and the vsc light came on. Turned off and then started it again. No vac or check engine light that time. Let it run in park for 5 minutes and then put it into reverse, no issues. Looked like people were having problems with carbon buildup and were using sea foam but I regrettably hadn't gotten around to doing that. It’s been running great since that last episode.
Heres the issue I'm having now:
Cranks but does not start. When it does crank it intermittently makes a chugging sound like its about to start but doesn't actually turn on. I started it in the morning and it started fine, no issues. Just had to move it back on the driveway so ran for less then a minute. Tried to turn it on later in the day and it would not start. Battery voltage is good and interior electrical systems appear to be working (radio, windows etc). No check engine light or codes. Since it cranks, I'm assuming the starter is working. Thinking it might be a fuel issue, I tried several things: After pressing the 'push to start' I can hear what sounds to be the fuel pump priming. I added starter fluid directly into the intake while cranking with no major improvement, chugged a little more but still did not turn on. Ran diagnostics on it and the fuel pump pressure and rail pressure were about 44 (not while cranking but with "key turned" with push-to-start). Turned off and pressure held. No fuel leaking underneath the car that I can tell.
Maybe ignition problem? Spark plugs haven't been changed recently. The 1-3-5 cylinders were easy to reach so I switched those out with new plugs since I'm still trying to diagnose the issue. With 3 new plugs I would think it would turn on but just not necessarily run smoothly if the spark plugs were the culprit?? In the process, I cranked it with a coil and plug combo close to a 'ground' and it sparked appropriately so I don't think its the crank sensor. After reassembling the 1, 3, and 5 cylinders, I tried to start it again and its no different. Cranks but doesn't start.
Maybe mass airflow sensor but wouldn't it still start and just run rough?
At this point, I'm running out of options. I'm going to take off the intake manifold and change the other spark plugs but I need to get the gaskets and the auto store is now closed. I'm going to proceed with that tomorrow but figured I'd try to get some opinions from others. Any help or thoughts appreciated!!!
I'm having issues with my 2006 Lexus IS250. It has approximately 147000 miles on it.
History:
I had the alternator and battery replaced about a year ago
I live in North Carolina and its has been a little cooler, dropping into the low teens
A while back, about 8mo to a year ago, there were several instances where the car ran rough. 3-4 different times at stop lights the rpms would bounce around for 5-10 secs before clearing up and running normal. Also, one morning the car started fine and idled but when I put it into gear and the rpms dropped as they should, it started running rough and the vsc light came on. Turned off and then started it again. No vac or check engine light that time. Let it run in park for 5 minutes and then put it into reverse, no issues. Looked like people were having problems with carbon buildup and were using sea foam but I regrettably hadn't gotten around to doing that. It’s been running great since that last episode.
Heres the issue I'm having now:
Cranks but does not start. When it does crank it intermittently makes a chugging sound like its about to start but doesn't actually turn on. I started it in the morning and it started fine, no issues. Just had to move it back on the driveway so ran for less then a minute. Tried to turn it on later in the day and it would not start. Battery voltage is good and interior electrical systems appear to be working (radio, windows etc). No check engine light or codes. Since it cranks, I'm assuming the starter is working. Thinking it might be a fuel issue, I tried several things: After pressing the 'push to start' I can hear what sounds to be the fuel pump priming. I added starter fluid directly into the intake while cranking with no major improvement, chugged a little more but still did not turn on. Ran diagnostics on it and the fuel pump pressure and rail pressure were about 44 (not while cranking but with "key turned" with push-to-start). Turned off and pressure held. No fuel leaking underneath the car that I can tell.
Maybe ignition problem? Spark plugs haven't been changed recently. The 1-3-5 cylinders were easy to reach so I switched those out with new plugs since I'm still trying to diagnose the issue. With 3 new plugs I would think it would turn on but just not necessarily run smoothly if the spark plugs were the culprit?? In the process, I cranked it with a coil and plug combo close to a 'ground' and it sparked appropriately so I don't think its the crank sensor. After reassembling the 1, 3, and 5 cylinders, I tried to start it again and its no different. Cranks but doesn't start.
Maybe mass airflow sensor but wouldn't it still start and just run rough?
At this point, I'm running out of options. I'm going to take off the intake manifold and change the other spark plugs but I need to get the gaskets and the auto store is now closed. I'm going to proceed with that tomorrow but figured I'd try to get some opinions from others. Any help or thoughts appreciated!!!
01-15-18, 01:36 PM
#2
Perhaps the starter isn't being fully engaged and not able to turn the flywheel as needed? Can you have someone attempt to start it while looking to see if the starter and flywheel are turning? IDK if this can be done, I've never personally had to check.
01-15-18, 07:13 PM
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Thanks for the reply. When I try to start the car, the rpms do jump up some. Around 250-500 rpms. Would this indicate that the starter is fully engaged?
01-16-18, 12:25 PM
#5
Before this happened, had the car been under the knife for any sort of repairs?
01-17-18, 07:52 AM
#6
How exactly did you spray starting fluid to it?
Please try this. Loosen the flex hose at the air cleaner side, spray a burst of starting fluid into the hose and quickly reattach hose to air cleaner. Don't worry about the hose clamp....
Promptly get to the drivers seat and while cranking, depress the throttle about 1/4th.... Does it start?
There is a cold start fuel injector in the intake manifold. It may be suspect if the above method gets it running.
I can't imagine carbon plugging the injector over night but you might find a 12v LED and place it across the connectors comtacts. When cold and cranking the led should come on momentarily.
A high end hand held meter with min/max/average function could also be used to see if the injector is getting power.
You will also want to measure the injector resistance and confirm it has some. Like (guessing) 5 to 15 ohms? Also, you could remove the snorkel hose at the throttle body side, gently open the throttle plate by hand and apply 12vdc to the injector for a 1/2second. You should hear the injector click and smell fuel if that rail is holding pressure.
Perhaps try with ignition on....
Please try this. Loosen the flex hose at the air cleaner side, spray a burst of starting fluid into the hose and quickly reattach hose to air cleaner. Don't worry about the hose clamp....
Promptly get to the drivers seat and while cranking, depress the throttle about 1/4th.... Does it start?
There is a cold start fuel injector in the intake manifold. It may be suspect if the above method gets it running.
I can't imagine carbon plugging the injector over night but you might find a 12v LED and place it across the connectors comtacts. When cold and cranking the led should come on momentarily.
A high end hand held meter with min/max/average function could also be used to see if the injector is getting power.
You will also want to measure the injector resistance and confirm it has some. Like (guessing) 5 to 15 ohms? Also, you could remove the snorkel hose at the throttle body side, gently open the throttle plate by hand and apply 12vdc to the injector for a 1/2second. You should hear the injector click and smell fuel if that rail is holding pressure.
Perhaps try with ignition on....
01-18-18, 06:53 PM
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Appreciate the input from you all.
I pulled it out and cleaned the MAF. No noticeable change, unfortunately.
Coils for cylinders 1 and 2 are functioning but going to get to the others tomorrow to test those as well. Also going to replace the sparks at the same time since I have to take the manifold off to get to them.
As far as recent work, I've had new front tires put on and rear brakes but that has been at least 6 months ago. Can't imagine that would be related?? Nothing new since then.
Assuming that the tach is working correctly, yes...the starter is spinning the motor over. Start looking at the MAF, the fuel pump, and perhaps check to make sure that ALL of the coil packs are getting signal/power and firing correctly.
Before this happened, had the car been under the knife for any sort of repairs?
Before this happened, had the car been under the knife for any sort of repairs?
As far as recent work, I've had new front tires put on and rear brakes but that has been at least 6 months ago. Can't imagine that would be related?? Nothing new since then.
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01-18-18, 07:09 PM
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How exactly did you spray starting fluid to it?
Please try this. Loosen the flex hose at the air cleaner side, spray a burst of starting fluid into the hose and quickly reattach hose to air cleaner. Don't worry about the hose clamp....
Promptly get to the drivers seat and while cranking, depress the throttle about 1/4th.... Does it start?
There is a cold start fuel injector in the intake manifold. It may be suspect if the above method gets it running.
I can't imagine carbon plugging the injector over night but you might find a 12v LED and place it across the connectors comtacts. When cold and cranking the led should come on momentarily.
A high end hand held meter with min/max/average function could also be used to see if the injector is getting power.
You will also want to measure the injector resistance and confirm it has some. Like (guessing) 5 to 15 ohms? Also, you could remove the snorkel hose at the throttle body side, gently open the throttle plate by hand and apply 12vdc to the injector for a 1/2second. You should hear the injector click and smell fuel if that rail is holding pressure.
Perhaps try with ignition on....
Please try this. Loosen the flex hose at the air cleaner side, spray a burst of starting fluid into the hose and quickly reattach hose to air cleaner. Don't worry about the hose clamp....
Promptly get to the drivers seat and while cranking, depress the throttle about 1/4th.... Does it start?
There is a cold start fuel injector in the intake manifold. It may be suspect if the above method gets it running.
I can't imagine carbon plugging the injector over night but you might find a 12v LED and place it across the connectors comtacts. When cold and cranking the led should come on momentarily.
A high end hand held meter with min/max/average function could also be used to see if the injector is getting power.
You will also want to measure the injector resistance and confirm it has some. Like (guessing) 5 to 15 ohms? Also, you could remove the snorkel hose at the throttle body side, gently open the throttle plate by hand and apply 12vdc to the injector for a 1/2second. You should hear the injector click and smell fuel if that rail is holding pressure.
Perhaps try with ignition on....
Regarding the injectors, I changed out the spark plugs on cylinder 5 and 2 right after trying to crank it and they were damp and smelled like fuel (its been a little while since I used the starter fluid so I wouldn't think it would be residual from this?). Just because of the order I was doing things (testing the coils), cylinders 1 and 3 were dry but I had not tried to start it the car prior to removing them. Since some were wet with fuel, could I assume that the injectors are functioning, at least in cylinders 2 and 5?? I'm going to get to the coils tomorrow to test them individually but will also see if all the spark plugs are damp.
01-19-18, 08:52 AM
#9
What does that mean, air throttle? Did you remove the hose between the air filter and the throttle body?
If it was off during cranking the ECU would be confused by not seeing any air flow while cranking and likely generate a CEL.
As for the damp plugs. Thats not a good sign. You can bake plugs dry if they are wet. With the plug out, Use a propane torch to the plugs base (threaded area) and slowly heat it to 250°F and the fuel will burn off the porcelain inside. Allow to air cool.
You check the gap of the "new plugs"?
If it was off during cranking the ECU would be confused by not seeing any air flow while cranking and likely generate a CEL.
As for the damp plugs. Thats not a good sign. You can bake plugs dry if they are wet. With the plug out, Use a propane torch to the plugs base (threaded area) and slowly heat it to 250°F and the fuel will burn off the porcelain inside. Allow to air cool.
You check the gap of the "new plugs"?
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