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Considering a performance exhaust, muffler/resonator delete? Read this
I am writing about this because this is a topic that I am very familiar with, being part of the Honda Civic Si community for more than a year (I don't think there is any other car community that mods more than this one!). Many of us love to do what I call "chase that sound". We are looking for that perfect exhaust note, and many times the stock exhaust is just too quiet or unexciting. So before I begin, let me talk about what I call the 3 stages of performance exhaust madness:
1. Install performance exhaust or straight pipe to make the car louder & throw away stock exhaust 2. Install mufflers/resonators to make the car quiet again 3. Regret throwing away the stock exhaust
Previous to buying my IS 350, I owned a 2018 10th Gen Honda Civic Si 6 speed manual. I pretty much kept it stock except a tune (Two Stage Performance Stage 1 tune), a performance Intercooler, and, a performance exhaust (aFe Takeda Stainless Steel 3" performance exhaust). I felt the stock exhaust was too quiet, and it has an HDMI tip that I didn't hate, but also was not extremely fond of. After installing the performance exhaust, I really loved the deep tone, the crackles between shifts, and the little bit of extra power it gave the car. To recoup some of the money I spent on the new exhaust, I did what a lot of people do...I sold the factory exhaust.
I really loved this exhaust, how it looked, how it sounded, how it performed. Yes it was a bit loud, but it sounded cool. Then I got on the freeway, and I heard the drone. OK, it's not so bad I thought. But as time went on, and I took a couple of trips between Northern Cal and Southern Cal (360 miles each way), the drone at 80 mph for 6 to 8 hours was getting really old, really fast. Also passengers in my car would make comments like "it sounds like a sports car", which is code for it's really loud. That and my wife complaining (wife's can be very good reality checkers) about the sound and how it gave her a headache.
So now I began looking for ways to quiet it down and lessen the drone. I tried a baffled glasspack, that quieted it a little, but didn't address the drone. I did tons of research on resonators, and ended up installing a Vibrant Ultra Quiet resonator, which addressed about 50 percent of the drone.
So basically I spent $800 on the performance exhaust. I then spent another $140 on installing a baffled glasspack, when that didn't work ended up spending another $70 on a resonator and $100 on the install, just to quiet it down.
99 percent of you are like me. We chase that sound, and realize that we should have stuck with the factory setup. If you don't believe me, just check out youtube, or all the blogs on resonators/silencers.So for those of you that considering installing an aftermarket performance exhaust, doing a muffler/resonator delete, just think about it. Can you live with a loud exhaust, droning at highway speeds? How about your passengers? IMHO, the IS 250/300/350 were designed to be quiet on the highway, and sweet sounding when you WOT. But that's just my opinion. Anyway, I thought I would share my experiences with you guys
That's the reason I got rid of my Tanabe last year, the drone at 70-80 for 6+ hours drove me nuts. Not sure if it was an issue with my flange gasket since others report no drone since it's one of the quieter exhausts for the IS, but I couldn't take it. On the plus side, I kept my stock exhaust.
...Although, I've been sorta on-off again searching for a 2nd gen F-Sport exhaust.
That's the reason I got rid of my Tanabe last year, the drone at 70-80 for 6+ hours drove me nuts. Not sure if it was an issue with my flange gasket since others report no drone since it's one of the quieter exhausts for the IS, but I couldn't take it. On the plus side, I kept my stock exhaust.
I learned the hard way that the stock factory setup is king!
I am using the Xforce exhaust with variable valve mufflers on my ISF to have the best of both worlds.
Valves closed it sounds as quiet as stock, valves open sounds like open chambered mufflers, or you can
have the valves partially opened for a less aggressive sound.
...Although, I've been sorta on-off again searching for a 2nd gen F-Sport exhaust.
This is precisely why I was willing to spend the higher upfront cost of the Lexus OEM F-Sport exhaust (which is nearly twice the price of other aftermarket exhausts). It can get loud when you ask it to (at WOT) while remaining fairly tame at light throttle around town. Though the 2nd Gen F-Sport exhaust still has a small window for drone (80-85mph on the freeway), I find the resonant frequency to be very tolerable compared to other exhaust setups. When I installed the PPE headers, I made sure to combine it with the Megan Racing midpipes as it has three individual resonators to keep unwanted drone in check.
There definitely needs to be a lot of thought put into changing the exhaust and to weigh the pros and cons for each installed component since owners will have to live with the changes on a daily basis.
Mine is all stock and too quiet but pulls 238/240 MAF #'s... that said i don't think its hurting me to badly performance wise.
Can anyone explain why the old school V8 exhaust from the 70 & 80's never had this problem? It was simple; headers, cross over, mufflers, to reduced size tail pipes with a simple tip and everyone commented how good it sounded!
If I take a swing at this it will be like that ^^ with the addition of highflow cats. NO mufflers past the axle!!!!
Something I always did was size down the tailpipes to increase velocity as heat is lost in the mufflers and bends over the axle. I think this was always a critical step to reduce drone. Well coupled with the early crossover pipe. Mind you the downsize is just a 1/4" (6.3mm). Can we fit two good mufflers where the current resonator is?
Can anyone explain why the old school V8 exhaust from the 70 & 80's never had this problem? It was simple; headers, cross over, mufflers, to reduced size tail pipes with a simple tip and everyone commented how good it sounded!
If I take a swing at this it will be like that ^^ with the addition of highflow cats. NO mufflers past the axle!!!!
This is a great observation and one I never considered, as a previous owner of multiple V8 cars with after market exhausts and mufflers pre axle
they did not suffer drone, so it would be interesting to see if this is indeed the cause.
This is a great observation and one I never considered, as a previous owner of multiple V8 cars with after market exhausts and mufflers pre axle they did not suffer drone, so it would be interesting to see if this is indeed the cause.
The question is; why did the auto manufacturers go this route? If you think about it, the x-pip early on into muffler (modern day resonator) and it eliminates the volume of parallel pipes with different soundwaves that makes the drone possible.
Surely having to add a resonator is no cost savings so we have cosmetics, weight bias, and biggest penalty -> heat loss dropping volumetric efficiency all shuffled to the rear. For me this doesn't make sense either as they are passed the CATs, so why are they worried about keeping the heat in there?
Anyone ever notice the rod journals on the crank are all offset like 1 & 2, 3 & 4 and 5 & 6 do not share a journal? It could the drone is a product of the cranks layout? I doubt it is the whole cause but....
Dare we talk about the firing order and how equal length headers really don't help this engine? If 1 fed into 2 and 3 into 4 and so on, great but they don't. At least not headers we can put in our chassis. Just saying that paying for equal length primaries is of little benefit here. Smooth turns will get you good results once dumped into a long collector.
The question is; why did the auto manufacturers go this route? If you think about it, the x-pip early on into muffler (modern day resonator) and it eliminates the volume of parallel pipes with different soundwaves that makes the drone possible.
Surely having to add a resonator is no cost savings so we have cosmetics, weight bias, and biggest penalty -> heat loss dropping volumetric efficiency all shuffled to the rear. For me this doesn't make sense either as they are passed the CATs, so why are they worried about keeping the heat in there?
Anyone ever notice the rod journals on the crank are all offset like 1 & 2, 3 & 4 and 5 & 6 do not share a journal? It could the drone is a product of the cranks layout? I doubt it is the whole cause but....
Dare we talk about the firing order and how equal length headers really don't help this engine? If 1 fed into 2 and 3 into 4 and so on, great but they don't. At least not headers we can put in our chassis. Just saying that paying for equal length primaries is of little benefit here. Smooth turns will get you good results once dumped into a long collector.
I would probably guess that it is all emissions related as well as moving to more efficiency. In the 70's they didn't give a crap about emissions until the near the end of the 70's when the oil crisis hit. I'm no expert on this, but all the newest modern downsized turbocharged GDI engines drone like crazy once you remove the stock exhaust/resonators and put in either straight pipes or performance exhausts. My Civic Si was pretty quiet until I changed out the stock exhaust, and then no matter what I did, I could not completely eliminate the drone.
I would probably guess that it is all emissions related as well as moving to more efficiency. In the 70's they didn't give a crap about emissions until the near the end of the 70's when the oil crisis hit. I'm no expert on this, but all the newest modern downsized turbocharged GDI engines drone like crazy once you remove the stock exhaust/resonators and put in either straight pipes or performance exhausts. My Civic Si was pretty quiet until I changed out the stock exhaust, and then no matter what I did, I could not completely eliminate the drone.
Once again, the muffler was at the tail end of the vehicle, yes?
I think we can have our cake and eat it too just by rearranging the hardware a little. We add an x-pipe, ditch the resonator in favor of mufflers and run old school tail pipes with cute tips! lol
Maybe the whole thing has more to do with removing bumps in the floor and making room for our fuel cell?
Once again, the muffler was at the tail end of the vehicle, yes?
I think we can have our cake and eat it too just by rearranging the hardware a little. We add an x-pipe, ditch the resonator in favor of mufflers and run old school tail pipes with cute tips! lol
Maybe the whole thing has more to do with removing bumps in the floor and making room for our fuel cell?
....Or ditching weight. Again it probably all boils down to trying to get vehicles more fuel efficient. Less mufflers, less piping, less weight
I can relate to this. Got the Tanabe exhaust and was really happy until I wanted a bit more. Did a resonator delete, it was awesome for a day or two, but the drone was really bad so I bought myself a vibrant ultra quiet resonator as well. Recently I had the itch to get a bit more sound so I got a custom midpipe to get rid of the secondary cats and I think I've found my perfect setup. So far nobody has complained about my car's sound, not my mom, my friends, etc.
10-11-19, 10:05 AM
Considering a performance exhaust, muffler/resonator delete? Read this
