peteharvey

Ooh, that's one of those things easy to think of and understand, but very difficult to put into words.

I presently still have my 2001 Benz C240 2.6 90 degree V6.
I also have the 2006 IS250 2.5 60 degree V6.

The Benz is superb in "feedback".
The Lexus is superb in isolation.

The old Benz steering, you can feel the difference between dry tarmac, and an oil slick.
The IS is more isolated, and you can't feel the difference in resistance, from dry tarmac to an oil slick as much.
Less feedback if you'd like to say.
It's a sensation that is easy to feel, but difficult to describe.

The steering feel should not be confused with steering turn-in/response/agility/speed.
The old C Class does not turn in as quickly or sharply, for slower changes in direction.
The old IS250 has very quick and sharp turn in, for very quick changes in direction.
The old IS is firmer, flatter, quicker, and more isolated overall, but the old C Class is softer, more roll, longer suspension travel, and slower to turn-in and less terminal grip, but has more steering feel/feedback.

My 2009 3GS 1st generation electric steering has a very anesthetized feel. It lacks even more feel [feedback] than my IS250, and it really really lacks the quick turn-in/agility of my IS250 as well.
The old 3GS also has 8-stage automatically variable dampers, which gives it an artificial sort of feel, because often it would go hard all of a sudden due to a bump or rapid steering/braking input etc, and it could not be totally switched off.

The new 4GS has much better steering feel [feedback] than the 3GS, and is much quicker than the 3GS in changes in direction as well...

cino

iTrader: (1)

2011+ MY has different steering feel, I have 2006, and I drove 2011 for a week.

maz

Guy in the video said engines put out about 250kw.
250 kilowatts = 335 horsepower

So if it is the same engine as before, its tuned up a bit.

cino

iTrader: (1)

In Jay Leno video, he said the engine was 306hp.

dmvp29

He said 230 KW....

Not sure how you misinterpreted that as "250"

230 KW = 308 HP, but he said "about 230 KW" so clearly he was just rounding to a nice, whole number.

The 3.5L still puts out 306 HP.

spwolf

and 3IS head engineer already said they improved on 4GS setup...

joshthorsc

I definitely like the the interior. Just wished the motors get a few hp bump.

Syan48306

While that is true, the car that he drove was a hybrid model. If you notice, it's got the charge, eco, power setting when he flashed through the cluster gauge.

LexFather

I've driven that year C-class and it has no feedback nor is it sporty and reviews were not glowing with praise. I agree with 3GS feedback, only at some rare times does the feedback come back right. The IS is better but there is a loss of feel before it seems the steering realizes you want to feel something. The IS 300 had great steering but that is a much older car with older tech.

Everything is electronic, even Porsche/BMW etc.... and they all offer less feel. The FRS though, now that is one great steering car.

spwolf

that looks really nice... i cant wait to see it in action...

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

i think when you referred to feedback in that last sentence, i got what you're talking about. old-school hybraulic manual or power steering gives feedback in the sense of resistance to turning and resistance due to the surface texture/bumps/slopes/changes. an electric setup has to simulate that i guess.

Individual

iTrader: (7)

Plus the 647 miles range , that's like twice the range of mine.

spwolf

it is still connected to the road just differently.... they use some special parts so you can feel that connection, whole new art in it. But there is quite difference in system from FRS, which lets you feel the road and G2 Prius which was made so you feel... nothing.

peteharvey

The 1999-2005 1IS200 in Europe, and the 2000-2005 1IS300 in the US was one of the finest hydraulically assisted steering around - with a tiny steering wheel, so lightweight, so direct and fast in gearing, and there was so little self centering on exit out of the corner.
I thought the first IS was the sedan equivalent of a Mazda MX-5 Miata - almost like a toy, but the first IS was too small and firmly suspended for ordinary drivers.
The first generation IS was great for a Sunday drive.

I guess the first generation electrically assisted steering in the 2005-12 3GS and the 2006-13 2IS is a bit like a "video arcade" game steering wheel, with almost constant weighting, but that has no actual bearing on the agility or terminal grip on the skid pan.
For example, although the old 3GS was often criticized for numb steering, its low height and short suspension travel kept it flat so that it pulled something like 0.85g on the skidpan, which was better than the equivalent Benz E Class of 2002-2009!

However the 2nd generation electrically-assisted steering in the 2012 4GS has certainly improved, and no doubt the 2013 3IS could be even better, just like the 1 year improvement in the 2012 4GS's 3.5 with 6 speed auto, to the 2013 3IS's 3.5 with an 8 speed auto gearbox, and the new 2012 4GS 2.5 overseas definitely feels as though it has much more bottom end torque than my 2006 IS250, however I'm not sure I like the new engine roar under acceleration, although when cruising along the highway, the new 4GS is actually quieter than my old 3GS...

Bean

iTrader: (1)

Agreed. Toyota needs to swap over to turbocharging like the rest of the industry is doing.