Originally Posted by salvadorik

compare apples to apples:

bmw 328i Mercedes C 250 and Audi A4 (cheapest Audi)
bmw 535i Mercedes E350 and Audi A6 3.0T (cheapest Audi)
bmw 750i Mercedes S550 and A8 4.0T (cheapest Audi again)

do the research and you will see.

now if you ask me about the Lexus then yes Lexus is the cheapest among all four

Originally Posted by BOBFSPORT

NOT TO LEASE!! For the most part german luxury cars are leased and with their awful reliability rightly so. It is pointless to compare luxury cars prices based on msrp. Audis have the worst residual values as well as lease incentives/rebates thus making them the highest priced vehicles in the segment. Not only does the Audi A4 2.0T not hold a candle to the similarly priced IS350 but in my opinion its the most boring "sports" car in the class. The S4 is an entirely different story. I am sorry you are making payments on a vehicle you dislike so much.

Originally Posted by salvadorik

Your statement above is not entire accurate I have to say at least. Look at the KBB, A5 has the highest resale value for several years now, which shares exactly the same powertrain as an A4. Yes, I agree with the fact that Audis historically have had awful reliability but I want to be fair. Also, if you compare A4 with 3IS 250 dynamically (not saying reliability), I am assuming most people choose A4 over 3IS 250. Yes, Audi is nose heavy and yes it understeers a lot but 3IS 250 engine is just not doing well at all.

Hey, don't get me wrong. I like Lexus and I think my brain tells me that I made a right choice. But my heart is just not quite sure about it yet. Lexus does not give that wow factor as most German do. It just my two cents. Nothing personal

Originally Posted by BOBFSPORT

Point taken i was not comparing it to the IS250. Reliability doesn't matter to me from an owners standpoint as i lease all of my vehicles but it is the greatest deciding factor effecting residual value and thus a similarly priced Audi or Bmw will always cost much more (to lease) than a Lexus. My 27 month lease is based on 73% residual. Audi or Bmw can't come close to touching this number. So based on cost to own (lease) the Audi A4 2.0T is more fairly compared to the IS350. I don't take anything you say personally at all i truly feel bad that you are driving (and paying for) a car that you don't love.

Originally Posted by salvadorik

OP, I am current/former Audi owner and I can share with you about my experience and how I rank them.

Lately Audi has improved dramatically in terms of reliability. Read the latest consumerreports and you will see that yourself. That engine in Audi A4 is believed to be 2.0T turbo charged four cylinder engine. All I can say it is an awesome engine (it has been selected several years on Wards 10 best engines) paired to ZF's 8 speed tiptronic transmission. The powertrain in Audi A4 is by far better powertrain than that what Lexus offers in it current IS lineup. The fit and finish in Audi is the best in class and MMI system is the most intuitive as well. They have Google Earth overlay and it is awesome! The problem with all Audis and all German cars for that matter is the electronic components of the car. Unfortunately german car electric part suppliers (such as Siemens, Bosch etc) don't supply the reliable parts and they often fail. But powertrain is bullet proof in Audi vehicles. Their Quattro all wheel system is the best system that you can get in this current market.

I personally lemoned my 2012 A6 with 3.0T engine precisely because of the electrical nightmare that I had with it. I chose 3IS because it is cheaper and the most reliable. But I am already getting bored with it. It just did not wowed me as Audi did. It is all up to you but I would wait a bit as I know there is A3 and S3 coming this spring, which will bring revamped Audi Connect with 3D graphics and LTE connection. Just saying.

And I believe Audi is ranked second after BMW in sales numbers. Mercedes is behind Audi. Pls correct me if I am wrong.

Originally Posted by Tim1988

Don't mean to sound rude but that's very wrong.

We are talking about USA Luxury brands and Audi is not only behind Lexus/BMW/Mercedes...........it's not even competitive.

I'm only linking 2011's sales numbers, but 2012 and 2013 is actually even worst for Audi and better for Lexus.

http://www.edmunds.com/industry-cent...nners-are.html


Among the Luxury Brands in America.. Audi is in the Acura/Infiniti Tier.

Now we all know Audi is a superior brand to Acura/Infiniti.. There is no debate there.
But sales does not reflect this.

Something is clearly wrong with Audi in America because we are talking about a TIER 1 Luxury Brand who have TIER 2 Numbers. It's quite strange, but it is what it is.

Originally Posted by Tim1988

Also upon going to several Lexus Dealers.. I realized that they don't even consider Audi as a legitimate competitor.

When I was shopping the BMW Market, all the sales will say that their 'rivals' are Mercedes/Lexus..
They rarely if ever mention Audi.

Once again.. I realize Audi have the cars to match BMW.. but in the American Luxury circle, Audi is viewed as an inferior product.

Audi A4 is most often linked to Acura TL and Infiniti G37 among the rankings and comparisons sites.
If it wasn't for Acura's retardation with the 4G...... Audi sales won't have come close to Acura either.

It's just a interesting case study, because Audi is the only Luxury Brand who's sales does not reflect their product.

Infiniti/Acura sales are in the 2nd tier...their Brand is clearly a tier below BMW/Lexus. It make sense.
Audi should realistically be posting Lexus like numbers but is not.

Originally Posted by Tim1988

Don't mean to sound rude but that's very wrong.

We are talking about USA Luxury brands and Audi is not only behind Lexus/BMW/Mercedes...........it's not even competitive.

I'm only linking 2011's sales numbers, but 2012 and 2013 is actually even worst for Audi and better for Lexus.

http://www.edmunds.com/industry-cent...nners-are.html


Among the Luxury Brands in America.. Audi is in the Acura/Infiniti Tier.

Now we all know Audi is a superior brand to Acura/Infiniti.. There is no debate there.
But sales does not reflect this.

Something is clearly wrong with Audi in America because we are talking about a TIER 1 Luxury Brand who have TIER 2 Numbers. It's quite strange, but it is what it is.

Originally Posted by Tim1988

I am currently shopping for a new Lexus IS or Audi A4.
I went to the Audi Dealership and told them some of my concerns regarding Audi Reliability issues in the past.

They told me that 'well don't worry just lease, don't buy' 'In a lease..everything is warranty, so Audi is the best' 'Just lease for 3 years, nothing will go wrong within 36k Miles.. I promise'.



What the hell kind of Audi logic is this? What about someone who DON'T want to lease? Maybe I want to buy and own a car to fix it up?