3IS Simple/"Dumb" Questions Thread - Ask away and get answers!
04-20-21, 06:16 PM
#886
Lexus Test Driver
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Also I'm on Android 11, which I believe they are not rolling out to S9/S9+.
Let me see if I can locate a cable.
Any reason you prefer the USB audio over the BT Audio? To me it sounds the same, but I'm no audiophile, so I think the base sound system sounds ok too.
04-20-21, 07:12 PM
#887
Driver School Candidate
Thanks for the continued help.
Honestly, I can't say (at the moment) that USB Audio is better than BT Audio. I've been poking around the LC500 group, and some of those folks suggest it's better. This whole exercise is more of a "let me try and see if I can tell a difference and make my own conclusion".
RE: Audiophiles. What I'll say is a bit controversial and only reflects MY PERSONAL OPINION and I'm not here to start a audiophile war. It's relatively easy to convince yourself if you spend $$$ dollars, you'll convince yourself something is "better". Especially applicable in the high-fidelity audio world. To be a bit more objective, there have been many blind A/B tests with minimal variances, where one source is "high end" and the other is "normal end", and amongst multiple trials, the ability to accurately discriminate the "high end" version vs the "normal end" version is no more than a coin flip. Now, there are people that have higher sensitivities and are trained, that may be able to do better than 50/50, but for a "regular Joe", I'd be willing to wager it'd be pretty difficult to repeatably pick out the "better one". All of this is with the assumption that we're minimizing variables as much as possible. In another words, we're not comparing a source that is sampled at 44.1kHz at 16bit resolution vs a very lossy .mp3 format where you don't need "high end gear" to tell a difference. That's not really a fair fight. What it comes down to (assuming we're attempting to compare as close to apples to apples as possible) is the comparison of running a digital USB stream through the head unit's DAC (which could be totally crap as well) and hopefully designed with good low noise amplifiers before it gets to the power amplifiers all in a hard line connection when it hits your ears vs your phone or head unit's CODEC that is used to decode the BT stream via a wireless link. Could be fine, could be great, could be crap. Don't know. Hence, an interest to give it a try and see if I can tell and if it's worth it (for me.) Finally, I do believe that some gear is "better than others". Certainly can be repeatably proven through objective means such as measurement. Better noise performance, minimal coloration of the harmonics,etc. I could go on and on. But, at the end of the day, I'm not a precision measuring instrument that can discern the levels that an instrument can discriminate between 0.001% vs 0.0005% THD as an example. Hence, I try to be honest and true to myself and if I can't tell a difference, I'll go with the cheaper, quicker, easier solution. If I can tell a difference, and it's worth it, I'll go the other way.
Sorry to rant, but my hope was to bring a "be true to yourself" and try "not to be influenced by others opinion and money" to make a decision. Do what's true for you.
Regards,
Honestly, I can't say (at the moment) that USB Audio is better than BT Audio. I've been poking around the LC500 group, and some of those folks suggest it's better. This whole exercise is more of a "let me try and see if I can tell a difference and make my own conclusion".
RE: Audiophiles. What I'll say is a bit controversial and only reflects MY PERSONAL OPINION and I'm not here to start a audiophile war. It's relatively easy to convince yourself if you spend $$$ dollars, you'll convince yourself something is "better". Especially applicable in the high-fidelity audio world. To be a bit more objective, there have been many blind A/B tests with minimal variances, where one source is "high end" and the other is "normal end", and amongst multiple trials, the ability to accurately discriminate the "high end" version vs the "normal end" version is no more than a coin flip. Now, there are people that have higher sensitivities and are trained, that may be able to do better than 50/50, but for a "regular Joe", I'd be willing to wager it'd be pretty difficult to repeatably pick out the "better one". All of this is with the assumption that we're minimizing variables as much as possible. In another words, we're not comparing a source that is sampled at 44.1kHz at 16bit resolution vs a very lossy .mp3 format where you don't need "high end gear" to tell a difference. That's not really a fair fight. What it comes down to (assuming we're attempting to compare as close to apples to apples as possible) is the comparison of running a digital USB stream through the head unit's DAC (which could be totally crap as well) and hopefully designed with good low noise amplifiers before it gets to the power amplifiers all in a hard line connection when it hits your ears vs your phone or head unit's CODEC that is used to decode the BT stream via a wireless link. Could be fine, could be great, could be crap. Don't know. Hence, an interest to give it a try and see if I can tell and if it's worth it (for me.) Finally, I do believe that some gear is "better than others". Certainly can be repeatably proven through objective means such as measurement. Better noise performance, minimal coloration of the harmonics,etc. I could go on and on. But, at the end of the day, I'm not a precision measuring instrument that can discern the levels that an instrument can discriminate between 0.001% vs 0.0005% THD as an example. Hence, I try to be honest and true to myself and if I can't tell a difference, I'll go with the cheaper, quicker, easier solution. If I can tell a difference, and it's worth it, I'll go the other way.
Sorry to rant, but my hope was to bring a "be true to yourself" and try "not to be influenced by others opinion and money" to make a decision. Do what's true for you.
Regards,
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s3v3n (04-21-21)
04-21-21, 05:29 AM
#888
Thanks for the continued help.
Honestly, I can't say (at the moment) that USB Audio is better than BT Audio. I've been poking around the LC500 group, and some of those folks suggest it's better. This whole exercise is more of a "let me try and see if I can tell a difference and make my own conclusion".
RE: Audiophiles. What I'll say is a bit controversial and only reflects MY PERSONAL OPINION and I'm not here to start a audiophile war. It's relatively easy to convince yourself if you spend $$$ dollars, you'll convince yourself something is "better". Especially applicable in the high-fidelity audio world. To be a bit more objective, there have been many blind A/B tests with minimal variances, where one source is "high end" and the other is "normal end", and amongst multiple trials, the ability to accurately discriminate the "high end" version vs the "normal end" version is no more than a coin flip. Now, there are people that have higher sensitivities and are trained, that may be able to do better than 50/50, but for a "regular Joe", I'd be willing to wager it'd be pretty difficult to repeatably pick out the "better one". All of this is with the assumption that we're minimizing variables as much as possible. In another words, we're not comparing a source that is sampled at 44.1kHz at 16bit resolution vs a very lossy .mp3 format where you don't need "high end gear" to tell a difference. That's not really a fair fight. What it comes down to (assuming we're attempting to compare as close to apples to apples as possible) is the comparison of running a digital USB stream through the head unit's DAC (which could be totally crap as well) and hopefully designed with good low noise amplifiers before it gets to the power amplifiers all in a hard line connection when it hits your ears vs your phone or head unit's CODEC that is used to decode the BT stream via a wireless link. Could be fine, could be great, could be crap. Don't know. Hence, an interest to give it a try and see if I can tell and if it's worth it (for me.) Finally, I do believe that some gear is "better than others". Certainly can be repeatably proven through objective means such as measurement. Better noise performance, minimal coloration of the harmonics,etc. I could go on and on. But, at the end of the day, I'm not a precision measuring instrument that can discern the levels that an instrument can discriminate between 0.001% vs 0.0005% THD as an example. Hence, I try to be honest and true to myself and if I can't tell a difference, I'll go with the cheaper, quicker, easier solution. If I can tell a difference, and it's worth it, I'll go the other way.
Sorry to rant, but my hope was to bring a "be true to yourself" and try "not to be influenced by others opinion and money" to make a decision. Do what's true for you.
Regards,
Honestly, I can't say (at the moment) that USB Audio is better than BT Audio. I've been poking around the LC500 group, and some of those folks suggest it's better. This whole exercise is more of a "let me try and see if I can tell a difference and make my own conclusion".
RE: Audiophiles. What I'll say is a bit controversial and only reflects MY PERSONAL OPINION and I'm not here to start a audiophile war. It's relatively easy to convince yourself if you spend $$$ dollars, you'll convince yourself something is "better". Especially applicable in the high-fidelity audio world. To be a bit more objective, there have been many blind A/B tests with minimal variances, where one source is "high end" and the other is "normal end", and amongst multiple trials, the ability to accurately discriminate the "high end" version vs the "normal end" version is no more than a coin flip. Now, there are people that have higher sensitivities and are trained, that may be able to do better than 50/50, but for a "regular Joe", I'd be willing to wager it'd be pretty difficult to repeatably pick out the "better one". All of this is with the assumption that we're minimizing variables as much as possible. In another words, we're not comparing a source that is sampled at 44.1kHz at 16bit resolution vs a very lossy .mp3 format where you don't need "high end gear" to tell a difference. That's not really a fair fight. What it comes down to (assuming we're attempting to compare as close to apples to apples as possible) is the comparison of running a digital USB stream through the head unit's DAC (which could be totally crap as well) and hopefully designed with good low noise amplifiers before it gets to the power amplifiers all in a hard line connection when it hits your ears vs your phone or head unit's CODEC that is used to decode the BT stream via a wireless link. Could be fine, could be great, could be crap. Don't know. Hence, an interest to give it a try and see if I can tell and if it's worth it (for me.) Finally, I do believe that some gear is "better than others". Certainly can be repeatably proven through objective means such as measurement. Better noise performance, minimal coloration of the harmonics,etc. I could go on and on. But, at the end of the day, I'm not a precision measuring instrument that can discern the levels that an instrument can discriminate between 0.001% vs 0.0005% THD as an example. Hence, I try to be honest and true to myself and if I can't tell a difference, I'll go with the cheaper, quicker, easier solution. If I can tell a difference, and it's worth it, I'll go the other way.
Sorry to rant, but my hope was to bring a "be true to yourself" and try "not to be influenced by others opinion and money" to make a decision. Do what's true for you.
Regards,
04-23-21, 03:39 PM
#889
Lexus Test Driver
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After a little bit of Google'ing it seems a common issue since the Android Pie update...so it looks like an Android/Samsung issue.
04-23-21, 05:22 PM
#890
Driver School Candidate
Thanks very much for the effort Sasnuke. I greatly appreciate it.
Surprised this is broken on Samsung's side and hasn't been patched/fixed yet.
Guess I'll have to wait till i's fixed before I can try it.
Surprised this is broken on Samsung's side and hasn't been patched/fixed yet.
Guess I'll have to wait till i's fixed before I can try it.
04-23-21, 05:55 PM
#891
Driver School Candidate
@Sasnuke
Ugh. You are 100% right. There are quite a few threads on this specific issue, and even on Samsung's community support site, which appears to be moderated by people with limited authority to do anything. From reading multiple different sources (ie: reddit, stackexchange), and seeing comments where it was working, but then broken in Pie (as you stated), and other platforms (LG, Apple) working fine, I'm pretty convinced this is 100% on Samsung and quite sad they will likely not fix it. I do know Samsung has an obligation to continuously patch critical security flaws identified for a few years after product end of life, but minimal bugs and limited use features (ie: USB Audio) will likely not get addressed as it would take away more time from developers, lengthier regression testing, certification/re-certification/approval at the carrier level... it just doesn't seem likely, so for other folks, I'm sorry to say, you should just assume you'll be SOL unless you goto a different platform. To summarize, it seems confirmed that S8, S9, S10, and Note10 running Pie or later is broken for USB Audio despite it working in the past on an earlier Android release.
Very disappointed at Samsung for not fixing, what was working previously, despite the low use case on a flagship product.
May have to consider a Google phone in the future, which appears to have a stronger pulse on the community feedback.
To close out my inquiry on this topic, would someone with a S21 (which I believe is the current flagship Samsung phone) validate if USB Audio works on their IS? Please report OS version and your IS model and year. Hopefully, that'll help other members in the community when they run across this issue as well to validate if it's still broken or a known issue.
Thanks All, and particularly Sasnuke.
Ugh. You are 100% right. There are quite a few threads on this specific issue, and even on Samsung's community support site, which appears to be moderated by people with limited authority to do anything. From reading multiple different sources (ie: reddit, stackexchange), and seeing comments where it was working, but then broken in Pie (as you stated), and other platforms (LG, Apple) working fine, I'm pretty convinced this is 100% on Samsung and quite sad they will likely not fix it. I do know Samsung has an obligation to continuously patch critical security flaws identified for a few years after product end of life, but minimal bugs and limited use features (ie: USB Audio) will likely not get addressed as it would take away more time from developers, lengthier regression testing, certification/re-certification/approval at the carrier level... it just doesn't seem likely, so for other folks, I'm sorry to say, you should just assume you'll be SOL unless you goto a different platform. To summarize, it seems confirmed that S8, S9, S10, and Note10 running Pie or later is broken for USB Audio despite it working in the past on an earlier Android release.
Very disappointed at Samsung for not fixing, what was working previously, despite the low use case on a flagship product.
May have to consider a Google phone in the future, which appears to have a stronger pulse on the community feedback.
To close out my inquiry on this topic, would someone with a S21 (which I believe is the current flagship Samsung phone) validate if USB Audio works on their IS? Please report OS version and your IS model and year. Hopefully, that'll help other members in the community when they run across this issue as well to validate if it's still broken or a known issue.
Thanks All, and particularly Sasnuke.
Last edited by Observer1; 04-23-21 at 06:02 PM.
04-26-21, 11:13 AM
#892
Great point here. I don't think wired or bluetooth makes a difference when it comes to audio quality. Just listen to XM radio how clear the quality is - and that's thru airwaves(wireless). But soon, we humans, will figure out a way to completely eliminate the use of wires. Remember, we are all connected (thru energy).
04-26-21, 12:04 PM
#895
Lexus Test Driver
Join Date: Feb 2017
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kj07xk (04-27-21)
04-27-21, 05:21 AM
#897
Pit Crew
I've noticed many threads/questions/issues with audio systems after a battery is replaced. Mine is 5.5 years old...original battery in my 2016 IS 300. I'm going to proactively replace it. Is there any thing that needs to be done, other than just swapping it out, to prevent the black screen of death or any other type of radio issue? I currently have no problems with the car, radio, GPS, etc.
Thanks
Thanks
04-27-21, 05:33 AM
#898
I've noticed many threads/questions/issues with audio systems after a battery is replaced. Mine is 5.5 years old...original battery in my 2016 IS 300. I'm going to proactively replace it. Is there any thing that needs to be done, other than just swapping it out, to prevent the black screen of death or any other type of radio issue? I currently have no problems with the car, radio, GPS, etc.
Thanks
Thanks
The most important thing to remember is the battery polarity. Make sure you know where the positive and negative terminals before installing.
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bgross88 (04-27-21)
04-27-21, 05:38 AM
#899
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I've noticed many threads/questions/issues with audio systems after a battery is replaced. Mine is 5.5 years old...original battery in my 2016 IS 300. I'm going to proactively replace it. Is there any thing that needs to be done, other than just swapping it out, to prevent the black screen of death or any other type of radio issue? I currently have no problems with the car, radio, GPS, etc.
Thanks
Thanks
I've had to disconnect the battery a couple times on my 2014, which makes me nervous AF. But so far so good...no issues (knock on wood!).
My approach to the battery disconnect/reconnect is simple:
- Makes sure all doors and trunk are closed (hood open obviously) - this ensures that noting is going to load on the battery at reconnection time other than the ECU's
- Take all Smart keys well away from the vehicle (I leave both keys in the house well away from the car)
- Disconnect Negative terminal, then Positive terminal
- Reconnect Positive terminal, then Negative
- Close hood
- Go get a key, then fire up vehicle
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bgross88 (04-27-21)
04-27-21, 07:42 AM
#900
My comment was wrt the sound quality of streaming music via BT vs USB.