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Hey everyone I'm due to change my lower control arm bushings, because I'm on the verge of needing new tires from the toe wear. The reason I have made this thread is to get an opinion on whether there is a major difference between the two, if one is more durable then the other ? Has anyone here installed these on their vehicle , I understand that I will sacrifice a little bit of comfort but I don't mind I prefer better control and feeling everything on the road along with saving money on not having to replace tires every 25-30 k. So anyone have any experiences and if so which ones would you recommend ?
W/ those bushings, a bit more added discomfort than a "little bit." Multi-axis bushings are designed to be compliant, so you don't want to go too stiff or you'll induce understeer and break traction quicker without warning.
That energy from the bump you hit mid-corner has to go somewhere and if it can't be deflected, that shock will translate directly to your tires. If your tires happen to already be at their adhesion limit the precise moment you hit that bump and the energy has nowhere to go, you will break traction. Don't forget the rear is still soft.
You should highly consider RC-F/GS-F bushings as they use a stiffer compound and will not require special service/lubing and/or make noises and are still compliant enough for street duty. They're also much, much cheaper.
Also remember that RCF/GSF bushing won't solveyour front toe wear. They are little stiffer and may help a little, but not enough to remove the issue. The RCF/GSF owners are having same front toe wear.
Also remember that RCF/GSF bushing won't solveyour front toe wear. They are little stiffer and may help a little, but not enough to remove the issue. The RCF/GSF owners are having same front toe wear.
Some people have reported that the ISF bushings didn’t help, but that the RCF/GSF bushings did. Who knows though.
It's just mitigation, not elimination. These aren't Camrys, Corollas. You want performance and stability, the hallmark of a RWD sports sedan/sports car, you have to pay to play. Porsche and AMG, BMW M, etc. drivers experience this too
It's just mitigation, not elimination. These aren't Camrys, Corollas. You want performance and stability, the hallmark of a RWD sports sedan/sports car, you have to pay to play. Porsche and AMG, BMW M, etc. drivers experience this too
I disagree, I don’t think it’s something somebody should have to deal with. Most RWD “luxury sedans” don’t experience this inner tire wear. Maybe if our cars were designed for 400 HP then I could see having to deal with inner tire wear, but not on the IS I think it’s unacceptable.
Also remember that RCF/GSF bushing won't solveyour front toe wear. They are little stiffer and may help a little, but not enough to remove the issue. The RCF/GSF owners are having same front toe wear.
I looked for threads of people complaining of inner tire wear on the RC-F forums and didn’t find any. I found one and it’s because their Toe was way off. They got an alignment and they didn’t have issues anymore. This is on the 2015-present RCF forum.
I disagree, I don’t think it’s something somebody should have to deal with. Most RWD “luxury sedans” don’t experience this inner tire wear. Maybe if our cars were designed for 400 HP then I could see having to deal with inner tire wear, but not on the IS I think it’s unacceptable.
It's not something to disagree on. Sports cars have experienced excessive inner tire wear from the beginning of time. Both my M3s did--both fully restored fully built suspensions from the ground up, my 330 did (same thing--museum grade undersides, all new parts). Also had another BMW brand new from the dealer. Same thing. Inner wear. Porsche guys, AMG guys too. The reason is because of market expectations. Inner tire wear is characteristic of this genre, but to all varying degrees depending on the particular car. On our cars, it can be mitigated somewhat.
All the cars in the luxury-sport class that receive award-winning press praise have to characteristics: polished control and high performance.The way you get both is having an elastic suspension. BMW was the company to figure this out in the 70s and there is an actual BMW design philosophy behind this called Elastokinematics. This concept is decades old and started at BMW Engineering HQ. Since then, every manufacturer of luxury-oriented performance cars followed suit. BMW invented the category/class and therefore every car that joined the class had to compete and to compete in the handling department, they all needed to have the same characteristics. Remember BMW cars are tuned and designed on the nurburgring so they have to endure high speed driving over extreme bumps.
BTW here's a decades old document explaining the benefits of an elastic suspension... there's deep engineering reasons for it. It's why the 3 series back in the day (E46) and E39 were praised in the automotive press. Nobody in this era could make cars that handled like this. Especially not sedans!
How to make a car stable and have polished characteristics.
As with anything, you have to pay to play. This is why BMW suspensions are high wear components. And I keep referencing BMW because this is the design/philosophy performance cars today follow. High-wear, high-movement suspension. Great performance but wreaks havoc on tires and other components. People want to have their cake and eat it too when it comes to performance. You can't have high performance and stability without sacrificing wear to tires and other components. The higher up the performance totem pole you go, the more you replace stuff. This is why race car components are measured in hours, and not miles.
I looked for threads of people complaining of inner tire wear on the RC-F forums and didn’t find any. I found one and it’s because their Toe was way off. They got an alignment and they didn’t have issues anymore. This is on the 2015-present RCF forum.
RCF forum was my primary source of info on USRS kit since there were none in the IS forum when I was researching little over a year ago. It is a known issue in the RCF community.
I agree with E46CT. At the end of the day, we have decent performance in a still livable package. However, perhaps using OEM RC F or GS F bushings would still be a decent compromise. If I were keeping this car long-term I'd consider doing that mod. Eventually those bushings might need replaced anyway, might as well upgrade if it makes sense to do so.
Personally, for what the IS is designed to do - be a fun-to-drive daily, IMHO - the stock bushings are good. But that's just me! I think dealing with a little tire wear instead of compromising on comfort or handling is fine.
It's not something to disagree on. Sports cars have experienced excessive inner tire wear from the beginning of time. Both my M3s did--both fully restored fully built suspensions from the ground up, my 330 did (same thing--museum grade undersides, all new parts). Also had another BMW brand new from the dealer. Same thing. Inner wear. Porsche guys, AMG guys too. The reason is because of market expectations. Inner tire wear is characteristic of this genre, but to all varying degrees depending on the particular car. On our cars, it can be mitigated somewhat.
All the cars in the luxury-sport class that receive award-winning press praise have to characteristics: polished control and high performance.The way you get both is having an elastic suspension. BMW was the company to figure this out in the 70s and there is an actual BMW design philosophy behind this called Elastokinematics. This concept is decades old and started at BMW Engineering HQ. Since then, every manufacturer of luxury-oriented performance cars followed suit. BMW invented the category/class and therefore every car that joined the class had to compete and to compete in the handling department, they all needed to have the same characteristics. Remember BMW cars are tuned and designed on the nurburgring so they have to endure high speed driving over extreme bumps.
I've been shouting this on the forums for years. Very few people know this and how the cars today are the way they are.
My G37S never had this issue and it’s much faster and sportier than my IS. I don’t understand why you’re just “willing to accept” that cars have inner tire wear. Makes no sense to me.
RCF forum was my primary source of info on USRS kit since there were none in the IS forum when I was researching little over a year ago. It is a known issue in the RCF community.
I also searched RCF forums and found no complaints on tire wear. I ordered the RCF bushings at $110 ($55 ea) with caster correction and they should be in next week.
The Figs and RRR bushings are not the same. RRR uses a bushing design that does not allow for the multi axis movement. Youll see the bushing much wider on the control arm side with a large washer. Watch both videos of the bushings in action and youll see FIGs pulls in and out.
10-11-18, 03:30 PM
RR RACING USRS vs FIGS ENGINEERING ?
