Power steering rack and shaft may need replacement at 110k kms / 68k miles.
04-13-22, 01:55 AM
#1
Driver
Thread Starter
Power steering rack and shaft may need replacement at 110k kms / 68k miles.
Hello Lexus 3IS owners, hopefully someone can help me shed some light on this problem as I'm looking for opinions. I took my 2016 IS350 F sport AWD in for a vehicle inspection yesterday to get a diagnosis on the squeaks and creaks my car makes, most especially at the front, when braking, turning, going over bumps, and driving over uneven roads. I'm also lowered on RSR down springs so we could factor this in but apparently this isn't the cause of the problem at hand according to my mechanic.
I just got back from a weekend trip in Montreal and that city is not known for having the nicest roads. Also my daily commutes does not always have the nicest roads so I think my suspension gets a bit of a beating on a daily basis. My mechanic ruled out that all this noise is coming from the front sway bar bushings (which may need replacement) and from the electric power steering rack and shaft which will need to be completely replaced. Front sway bar bushings apparently are going to be tough and take time to reach in so this should be skipped according to them. But I find it hard to believe that replacing the steering column is necessary especially for a low-mileage Lexus. It's had its share of spirited driving and a minuscule amount of track days but it's impossible for me to believe that my entire steering column and shaft need to be replaced as that's where the sound is coming from. Over time the sound has gotten even more pronounced and I can hear this from the inside of my car when the windows are up but not as much when my windows are rolled down. No lights, no events popped up on my dash about having to visit the dealer or anything but I was proactive about this issue.
Front desk guy at the shop went on about how the newer Lexus models have this problem with the electric power steering but he just found it odd that this issue happened in a much earlier mileage in my case. I'm getting quoted $5000 to get the entire steering rack and shaft replaced including an alignment.
I appreciate any thoughts and insights into this problem if anybody can help out
I am seeing another mechanic on the weekend to get another opinion as I feel I am getting ripped off at the current shop I took my vehicle to.
I just got back from a weekend trip in Montreal and that city is not known for having the nicest roads. Also my daily commutes does not always have the nicest roads so I think my suspension gets a bit of a beating on a daily basis. My mechanic ruled out that all this noise is coming from the front sway bar bushings (which may need replacement) and from the electric power steering rack and shaft which will need to be completely replaced. Front sway bar bushings apparently are going to be tough and take time to reach in so this should be skipped according to them. But I find it hard to believe that replacing the steering column is necessary especially for a low-mileage Lexus. It's had its share of spirited driving and a minuscule amount of track days but it's impossible for me to believe that my entire steering column and shaft need to be replaced as that's where the sound is coming from. Over time the sound has gotten even more pronounced and I can hear this from the inside of my car when the windows are up but not as much when my windows are rolled down. No lights, no events popped up on my dash about having to visit the dealer or anything but I was proactive about this issue.
Front desk guy at the shop went on about how the newer Lexus models have this problem with the electric power steering but he just found it odd that this issue happened in a much earlier mileage in my case. I'm getting quoted $5000 to get the entire steering rack and shaft replaced including an alignment.
I appreciate any thoughts and insights into this problem if anybody can help out
I am seeing another mechanic on the weekend to get another opinion as I feel I am getting ripped off at the current shop I took my vehicle to.
Last edited by silbercar; 04-13-22 at 02:02 AM.
04-13-22, 04:51 AM
#2
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I would find it odd that the entire rack needs to be replaced.
I think a second opinion is definitely in order. Worse case even take it to the dealer for diagnosis at least.
As they see these vehicles all day every day they are likely most familiar as to what is causing the noise.
You could always get it fixed somewhere else once you know for sure what the issue is.
My first thought from your post was the sway bar bushings or end links...which are a much more reasonable repair than an entire rack.
Also, you mentioned the seems to be coming from the steering column/rack, what about the u-joint (or intermediate shaft) that joins the column to the rack? I'd bet money on that making noise before the entire rack needs replacement.
And really, how does a rack make noise? All it does is slide side to side. If the rack was so worn that it was making noise you'd think you'd have other steering concerns.
Second opinion is definitely a must.
I think a second opinion is definitely in order. Worse case even take it to the dealer for diagnosis at least.
As they see these vehicles all day every day they are likely most familiar as to what is causing the noise.
You could always get it fixed somewhere else once you know for sure what the issue is.
My first thought from your post was the sway bar bushings or end links...which are a much more reasonable repair than an entire rack.
Also, you mentioned the seems to be coming from the steering column/rack, what about the u-joint (or intermediate shaft) that joins the column to the rack? I'd bet money on that making noise before the entire rack needs replacement.
And really, how does a rack make noise? All it does is slide side to side. If the rack was so worn that it was making noise you'd think you'd have other steering concerns.
Second opinion is definitely a must.
04-14-22, 09:41 PM
#3
Driver School Candidate
My car does the same when going over speed bumps at slow speeds, I hear creaks coming from the front, I am at 45k miles, and my passenger shock has started leaking, but even before it was leaking it was creaking and noise would come from the front. If you do not feel anything strange or unusual with your steering, then there is no reason to change the whole steering rack for $5000 just because of noises. It might have to do more with you being lowered and your OEM shocks starting to give out or it would be bushings that are a bit worn out at your mileage. This is definitely safe to say not from your steering column and you need a second opinion, or you just need to turn up the music and not pay attention to creaks at low speed. I am at 45k miles as I said and on OEM suspension, not lowered or anything, only RCF bushings, and I hear creaks as well but no issues with steering.
Get a second opinion or take it to a Lexus dealership for a diagnostic, even if your dealer charges $100-$400 for a diagnostic fee, I think you would much rather pay that amount than $5000 for something that might not even fix your issue.
Get a second opinion or take it to a Lexus dealership for a diagnostic, even if your dealer charges $100-$400 for a diagnostic fee, I think you would much rather pay that amount than $5000 for something that might not even fix your issue.
04-15-22, 12:38 PM
#4
Not sure which started it but ever since I got my RSR Down Springs / GSF|RCF bushings, I hear a small popping noise (sounds like plastic touching) on the driver's side only when I'm driving at 25mph, it happens here or there but that's about it. No issues with steering
05-03-22, 01:41 PM
#5
Driver
Thread Starter
I would find it odd that the entire rack needs to be replaced.
I think a second opinion is definitely in order. Worse case even take it to the dealer for diagnosis at least.
As they see these vehicles all day every day they are likely most familiar as to what is causing the noise.
You could always get it fixed somewhere else once you know for sure what the issue is.
My first thought from your post was the sway bar bushings or end links...which are a much more reasonable repair than an entire rack.
Also, you mentioned the seems to be coming from the steering column/rack, what about the u-joint (or intermediate shaft) that joins the column to the rack? I'd bet money on that making noise before the entire rack needs replacement.
And really, how does a rack make noise? All it does is slide side to side. If the rack was so worn that it was making noise you'd think you'd have other steering concerns.
Second opinion is definitely a must.
I think a second opinion is definitely in order. Worse case even take it to the dealer for diagnosis at least.
As they see these vehicles all day every day they are likely most familiar as to what is causing the noise.
You could always get it fixed somewhere else once you know for sure what the issue is.
My first thought from your post was the sway bar bushings or end links...which are a much more reasonable repair than an entire rack.
Also, you mentioned the seems to be coming from the steering column/rack, what about the u-joint (or intermediate shaft) that joins the column to the rack? I'd bet money on that making noise before the entire rack needs replacement.
And really, how does a rack make noise? All it does is slide side to side. If the rack was so worn that it was making noise you'd think you'd have other steering concerns.
Second opinion is definitely a must.
Went to Mecano Autoworks today to get it checked out by Rish while also getting my brakes serviced here. A very reputable shop and a great owner too. Rish told me that my CV shaft may need to be replaced, eventually. For now, he's yet to see what's up when he works on the next IS later this week who's going through a similar problem. However it's not an easy fix as they need to go "in the car" and not just take the part out so worst case scenario, it'll be a hefty repair bill. Rish was very accommodating that he even took me in his shop to show me the issue. Also, this is a common problem when you drop your Lexus as the CV shaft changes angle when taking load, just due to the nature of the springs having this impact on the suspension geometry. I have no regrets from such a ridiculous mod, I love the look of a dropped Lexus but eventually I will go back to stock springs eventually as this is my daily driver. I have had my springs (RSR downs) installed around 65k kms and I'm at 112k kms.
05-03-22, 01:58 PM
#6
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Seems like a little bit of guessing going on by everyone that has looked at the car.
"..my CV shaft may need to be replaced, eventually"...ok, well which one? Assuming he is talking about the front, is it the left or right? And is it the inboard or outboard? And what does that statement even mean...eventually?
I could say that my brakes may need to be replaced, eventually...ok, so when is eventually, and why.
I'm assuming he meant the driveshaft will need to be replaced, as there is a CV joint at each end of the driveshaft....and an AWD has 4 driveshafts (2 front and 2 rear)
FYI...I have RSR Downs in for 70+K kms and I'm about 10K behind you in mileage and no issues with CV joints.
Granted that lowering a car could effect the driveshafts, it's not like Downs is by any means some crazy drop. And by the very nature of how CV joints work, the drop from Downs will have little to no impact on them at all.
I'm sure Rish is a great guy, but sweet Jesus people just guessing.
And you don't need to go in the car to replace CV joints...if you're in the car, you're nowhere near the CV joint lol!! The left front driveshaft isn't so bad, but the right front, forget about it!!!
What did he show you in the shop specifically? I think a third opinion is needed...I'm still suggesting the dealer, at least for the diagnosis.
"..my CV shaft may need to be replaced, eventually"...ok, well which one? Assuming he is talking about the front, is it the left or right? And is it the inboard or outboard? And what does that statement even mean...eventually?
I could say that my brakes may need to be replaced, eventually...ok, so when is eventually, and why.
I'm assuming he meant the driveshaft will need to be replaced, as there is a CV joint at each end of the driveshaft....and an AWD has 4 driveshafts (2 front and 2 rear)
FYI...I have RSR Downs in for 70+K kms and I'm about 10K behind you in mileage and no issues with CV joints.
Granted that lowering a car could effect the driveshafts, it's not like Downs is by any means some crazy drop. And by the very nature of how CV joints work, the drop from Downs will have little to no impact on them at all.
I'm sure Rish is a great guy, but sweet Jesus people just guessing.
And you don't need to go in the car to replace CV joints...if you're in the car, you're nowhere near the CV joint lol!! The left front driveshaft isn't so bad, but the right front, forget about it!!!
What did he show you in the shop specifically? I think a third opinion is needed...I'm still suggesting the dealer, at least for the diagnosis.
05-03-22, 02:07 PM
#7
Driver
Thread Starter
Sorry for not being specific enough: it's the right front CV shaft according to him. Grease was leaking out of it too. Hey man, you're not too far from where I live. May I ask who you go to for servicing your car? I've stopped going to the dealer after 80k kms, I just found them to be ridiculously overpriced... The Lexus dealer where I got my car from tried to swindle me to replace the entire left lower control arm when my suspension barely had any problems at all. All I told them was that I hit a massive pothole on the 401... and they didn't even align my car properly either. I am willing to try another dealer, just to get a third opinion. Probably just not the same dealer I went to. Any other shop recommendations would be great.
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05-03-22, 02:31 PM
#8
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If grease is leaking out, then there are two options:
1. If it's not too late and the grease has just started leaking, replace the boot and repack with new grease.
2. If it is too late, then replace the driveshaft with a rebuilt one...it doesn't sound like you're at that stage yet.
Keeping in mind that the lowering of the vehicle is not what caused the grease to start leaking. The CV joint boots are really tough, like super hard, so likely something hit it from the road, or it just degraded due to the environment we live in.
From a cost perspective, regardless of the scenario, it's likely more effective to just replace the shaft.
The loss of grease is what will inevitably ruin the joint.
I do all my own servicing on my vehicles, and if I do have to take it anywhere (which drives me absolutely bananas, cause I don't trust anyone to do as good of a job as I would), I take it to the dealer...actually the Toyota dealer.
I have a friend at one dealer that i half trust, and a relative at another dealer, that i trust him, just not his techs. But since he's in charge I trust that if they screw up something he'll make them fix it lol!!!
Don't even get me started on people doing alignments on my cars, that's a rant that no one should be subjected to lol! But I don't have an alignment machine at home...that and they cost $70K+ for a good one lol!!!
If it's not too far from you, I would suggest TLex Auto Service (7605 Woodbine Ave #5, Markham, ON L3R 5V3 - (905) 415-3384)
The owner is Basilio (or Basil for short)...he's a former Lexus tech that opened this shop around the turn of the century, so 2+ decades ago.
The name is meant to represent Toyota + Lexus...TLex.
I would suggest that he is competent enough to make an intelligent diagnosis of the problem...I'm sure you will find you are in good hands over there, just make sure you speak to Basil.
1. If it's not too late and the grease has just started leaking, replace the boot and repack with new grease.
2. If it is too late, then replace the driveshaft with a rebuilt one...it doesn't sound like you're at that stage yet.
Keeping in mind that the lowering of the vehicle is not what caused the grease to start leaking. The CV joint boots are really tough, like super hard, so likely something hit it from the road, or it just degraded due to the environment we live in.
From a cost perspective, regardless of the scenario, it's likely more effective to just replace the shaft.
The loss of grease is what will inevitably ruin the joint.
I do all my own servicing on my vehicles, and if I do have to take it anywhere (which drives me absolutely bananas, cause I don't trust anyone to do as good of a job as I would), I take it to the dealer...actually the Toyota dealer.
I have a friend at one dealer that i half trust, and a relative at another dealer, that i trust him, just not his techs. But since he's in charge I trust that if they screw up something he'll make them fix it lol!!!
Don't even get me started on people doing alignments on my cars, that's a rant that no one should be subjected to lol! But I don't have an alignment machine at home...that and they cost $70K+ for a good one lol!!!
If it's not too far from you, I would suggest TLex Auto Service (7605 Woodbine Ave #5, Markham, ON L3R 5V3 - (905) 415-3384)
The owner is Basilio (or Basil for short)...he's a former Lexus tech that opened this shop around the turn of the century, so 2+ decades ago.
The name is meant to represent Toyota + Lexus...TLex.
I would suggest that he is competent enough to make an intelligent diagnosis of the problem...I'm sure you will find you are in good hands over there, just make sure you speak to Basil.
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