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When you sign up for these features, it explicitly says that no data is shared without your express consent.
you could wrap your DCM in tinfoil I guess
The problem with this is two-fold. If you *don't* sign up, then they haven't promised to not share or sell your data, so they can do it without your knowledge. If you *do* sign up, then somewhere in the small print (or in some online or offline addendum referred to somewhere during the sign-up process) you'll most likely find something stating that by signing up you are permitting your data to be shared/sold. AFAIK, the only way out right now is to explicitly opt-out, and I'd be willing to bet there are caveats to that as well.
Well, time to wrap your DCMs in tin foil. The funny part is that they say “if you provide express prior consent” but then you go to the Opt In / Opt Out portion of the policy and they only let you opt out of Service Connect. And then under the consent portion of the policy they say that you consent to this policy by purchasing any vehicle equipped with connected services. So I hate to say it, but they are def selling our data and the sad part is they are legally doing it.
Well, time to wrap your DCMs in tin foil. The funny part is that they say “if you provide express prior consent” but then you go to the Opt In / Opt Out portion of the policy and they only let you opt out of Service Connect. And then under the consent portion of the policy they say that you consent to this policy by purchasing any vehicle equipped with connected services. So I hate to say it, but they are def selling our data and the sad part is they are legally doing it.
They seem to be pretty inconsistent between the mobile version of the privacy policy, the "desktop" version of the privacy policy, and the PDF version. I grabbed this from the PDF:
Driving Data. We collect your driving behavior data (“Driving Data”) which includes the acceleration and speed at which your vehicle is driven, travel direction, use of the steering and braking functionality in your vehicle, and vehicle operation data (e.g., sensor readings). Driving Data is used to deliver Connected Services to you, and for quality confirmation, data analysis, research, and product development. Unless we obtain your consent, we will not provide your Driving Data to other parties for their own purposes or use your Driving Data for our marketing purposes.
This one seems a lot more clear and less vague. I'm interpreting it as, they collect the data but keep it to themselves, unless they obtain your consent. I don't see any way for you to initiate consent, so I presume this means they would contact you in writing if they wanted this for some reason? I still wouldn't trust it whole cloth. I ordered a copy of my LexisNexis consumer report, since that seems to be the most common one used for this sort of thing. I looked at Verisk but they explicitly state they only get driving data from GM, Honda, and Hyundai at this time. Curious whether or not anything shows up.
There are 6 policies that need to get read, and I'd guess you would need to carefully interpret them as a lawyer would in order to determine the actual usage of what information.
Further, there are agreements for the Lexus App. So if you want remote start, you have to agree to this. I refused, and I got an email that my opt-out has been acknowledged, and the app is basically a paperweight. The only thing I can see is see my own VIN in it.
I wish I could get remote start with my keyfob, but nope. Lexus seems to require the car to phone home every time. And if you use the app they are selling your driving info, from what this summary shows.
There are 6 policies that need to get read, and I'd guess you would need to carefully interpret them as a lawyer would in order to determine the actual usage of what information.
Further, there are agreements for the Lexus App. So if you want remote start, you have to agree to this. I refused, and I got an email that my opt-out has been acknowledged, and the app is basically a paperweight. The only thing I can see is see my own VIN in it.
I wish I could get remote start with my keyfob, but nope. Lexus seems to require the car to phone home every time. And if you use the app they are selling your driving info, from what this summary shows.
The Vehicle Privacy Report shown above may be general vehicle manufacture info reported in certain vehicles but not necessarily the VIN you run. I ran my 2002 Jeep Liberty and it says Identifiers, Biometrics, Location, Insurance, and Government are reported yet my Jeep is not connected to anything. The highest tech thing in there is my cassette player LOL. I'm sure it has an event data recorder, but it has no way of knowing who's driving, where it's at or where it's going. Not sure I would put too much weight on this report although it's probably pretty accurate on our IS 500s.
Last edited by Benibiker1558; 03-25-24 at 03:53 PM.
They seem to be pretty inconsistent between the mobile version of the privacy policy, the "desktop" version of the privacy policy, and the PDF version. I grabbed this from the PDF:
This one seems a lot more clear and less vague. I'm interpreting it as, they collect the data but keep it to themselves, unless they obtain your consent. I don't see any way for you to initiate consent, so I presume this means they would contact you in writing if they wanted this for some reason? I still wouldn't trust it whole cloth. I ordered a copy of my LexisNexis consumer report, since that seems to be the most common one used for this sort of thing. I looked at Verisk but they explicitly state they only get driving data from GM, Honda, and Hyundai at this time. Curious whether or not anything shows up.
I wonder if you provide consent by purchasing the vehicle?
GM appears to be on track to be one of the worst for data collection. If it makes Google and Microsoft trillion dollar companies then why not GM too? GM is also moving away from CarPlay/AA and doing it all built-it so they can charge you for that stuff too. I am moderately strict on privacy and that's enough for me to shop other brands.
I wonder if you provide consent by purchasing the vehicle?
IANAL, but they do state “express consent,” which I am pretty sure means it needs to be explicit, i.e. as part of a signed agreement, where the terms you are consenting to are explicitly stated and you sign in agreement of them, or like providing explicit acceptance through the app via an agree button. The purchase itself would be implied consent, so I don’t think that would count for anywhere they say “express.” But you definitely provide your acceptance of the privacy policy overall by purchasing the vehicle, and they state as much in the policy.
IANAL, but they do state “express consent,” which I am pretty sure means it needs to be explicit, i.e. as part of a signed agreement, where the terms you are consenting to are explicitly stated and you sign in agreement of them, or like providing explicit acceptance through the app via an agree button. The purchase itself would be implied consent, so I don’t think that would count for anywhere they say “express.” But you definitely provide your acceptance of the privacy policy overall by purchasing the vehicle, and they state as much in the policy.
I wonder if you provide consent by purchasing the vehicle?
GM appears to be on track to be one of the worst for data collection. If it makes Google and Microsoft trillion dollar companies then why not GM too? GM is also moving away from CarPlay/AA and doing it all built-it so they can charge you for that stuff too. I am moderately strict on privacy and that's enough for me to shop other brands.
Per the mobile privacy terms you provide consent by purchasing or leasing a vehicle with connected services. Which is a very fine line of legality because are they basically insinuating I have to read the owners manual or a privacy guide prior to purchasing the vehicle for me to be educated?
Per the mobile privacy terms you provide consent by purchasing or leasing a vehicle with connected services. Which is a very fine line of legality because are they basically insinuating I have to read the owners manual or a privacy guide prior to purchasing the vehicle for me to be educated?
It’s probably on one of the sheets we have to sign when we purchase the car. Where you sign at the bottom of the last page of 6 pages of small font…
The car manufacturers are definitely selling your info, I know companies that are buying it. Toyota I'm not hearing as much, but GM, Ford, etc. are selling it to many companies to make more revenue.
So after some runaround from LexisNexis, I finally got a copy of my report. The good news is that Toyota thus far does not appear to be reporting any of the data collected via telematics. I would caution that this doesn’t mean they won’t do it in the future, and I’m sure if they do they won’t exactly scream it from the rooftops, either. I requested a copy of my report here if anyone else wants theirs.
In other good news, I just noticed that Verisk says they no longer collect driving data from any automakers. They were only ever getting data from GM, Honda, and Hyundai, but good news nonetheless, and I’d hope that it makes it even less likely that we need to worry about this from Toyota. Kinda seems that the news in media caused enough stir that they stopped doing it (for now at least).
03-23-24, 06:01 AM
